- From: <jrmt@almas.co.jp>
- Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2015 12:47:47 +0900
- To: "'Badral S.'" <badral@bolorsoft.com>, "'Greg Eck'" <greck@postone.net>, <public-i18n-mongolian@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <000201d125a1$b8413aa0$28c3afe0$@almas.co.jp>
Hi Badral, After several mail communication, I find you are making trouble without any examples or assertive evidence. You cannot accept any more constructional advice. I provided plenty of examples and evidence on these two issue you are insisting. I will stop argue with you until you provide assertive evidence as well as clear and workable logic. Because I have already know 1. You are not completely understanding the Unicode Mongolian Encoding concepts and the base document like TR170. Especially, the evidence for the change request on the NA, GA, DA, you are totally misunderstanding your own base document TR170. You are just providing us the TR170 basic and presentation character set only and arguing with the document naming of the presentation character. You are ignoring the TR170 detailed encoding mapping table or you are not completely refereeing it to developing your font. If so you are walking on the wrong way as my understanding. It is not just myself one people reading your mail. All of the other members will have their own judgement. 2. Your proposal on the YI encoding on Diphthongs, I can understand your request meaning. But when you say the Diphthongs YI is more than the regular YI, it is just in Mongolia case. But it is the rare case In Inner Mongolia. On this we have to select one of them as regular. No other option. When we have no other option, it is best to select the simple one, regular one. The default form should be same on the medial form before all of the vowel. The different one, irregular one should be encoding with FVS. It is reasonable best solution. It will simplify the learning, teaching as well as the processing procedure. If you still continue to insist, I can give you one comparison. It is just like you have a long TOOTH and you always say it is changed from your NOSE You are wanting to put it on the position of your NOSE. For this reason, you have to take another one surgery to move your NOSE on the one side of your FACE first and do another one surgery to move your long TOOTH to the position of your NOSE. Please consider is it valuable to cost so much ? Is it beautiful after this big surgery ? You will cost more to explain people the reason why you do it every day after the surgery. I was feeling like this when I read the proposal and it is the reason because it will confuse our children and cost more to explain. All of these reason, I am not including the bugs of the YI encoding for diphthongs. There is a lot kind of theory bug on the YI spelling of Diphthongs. I don’t want to discuss this more. This part I will leave for you to effort your life time to understand and sort out. Because it is the argument point of continued several hundred years. 3. Of cause we should respect the linguists. Even we should respect each other. The linguists, especially Professor Quejingzhabu spend his half-life time to established the Unicode encoding bases. But when we find some mistake in his book or his design or proposal, we should point out it and provide the correction solution. I think he will understand and accept the correction if we are providing correct and best solution. Regards, Jirimutu =============================================================== Almas Inc. 101-0021 601 Nitto-Bldg, 6-15-11, Soto-Kanda, Chiyoda-ku, Tokyo E-Mail: jrmt@almas.co.jp <mailto:jrmt@almas.co.jp> Mobile : 090-6174-6115 Phone : 03-5688-2081, Fax : 03-5688-2082 http://www.almas.co.jp/ http://www.compiere-japan.com/ http://www.mongolfont.com/ --------------------------------------------------------------- Inner Mongolia Delehi Information Technology Co. Ltd. 010010 13th floor of Uiles Hotel, No 89 XinHua east street XinCheng District, Hohhot, Inner Mongolia Mail: jirimutu@delehi.com <mailto:jirimutu@delehi.com> Mobile:18647152148 Phone: +86-471-6661969, Ofiice： +86-471-6661995 http://www.delehi.com/ =============================================================== From: Badral S. [mailto:badral@bolorsoft.com] Sent: Monday, November 23, 2015 7:25 AM To: jrmt@almas.co.jp; 'Greg Eck' <greck@postone.net>; public-i18n-mongolian@w3.org Subject: Re: Two Final Threads - Diphthongs / Final glyph checks Hi Jirimutu, On 22.11.2015 02:59, jrmt@almas.co.jp <mailto:jrmt@almas.co.jp> wrote: Hi Badral, >We should not use any FVSs for YI diphthongs. It makes not only difficult the input (4 times typing for two characters!) I advise you to solve the issue of more one FVS1 between <U+1836_YA> and <U+1822_I> in your Input method to not typing the FVS1 between <U+1836_YA> and <U+1822_I> You can automatically insert/delete the FVS1 between <U+1836_YA> and <U+1822_I>. Our Mongolian IME will eliminate almost all of the Mongolian control script like NNBSP, MVS, FVS key typing in the normal input process. All of the NNBSP, MVS, FVS will be automatically inserted when you select the word from the option list. We are discussing about encoding, especially harmonization of FVSs not IME solutions. There are a lot of situation composed keyboard layout doesn’t work. >but decrease performance of post-processing like spell checking. The occurrence of diphthongs in Mongolian are incomparable high from just some limited number of regular YI words. This is not an issue. You can optimize your algorithm in any way. >The stems with YI are not more than 20. All words with inflections are listed in email https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-mongolian/2015OctDec/0184.html from Siqin. It is originally existing Mongolian regular words. We have no reason to force peoples to accept the regular word use irregular encoding way with extra FVS This is the big issue if we ask Users to accustom the regular writing as irregular encoding / input. You say you can tolerate this, but I think not all Mongolian in Mongolia can tolerate it. In Inner Mongolia it is definitely not acceptable in almost all 5 million Mongolian. It will confuse the original education theory and system in Inner Mongolia. It will cause big damage to Mongolian culture inhibition process. Please consider this situation. It's the crucial point, why we can't accept medical default form of DA, NA, GA and Y'I diphthongs. From technical point of view it could be no issue even they could be easy to implement. Everybody, who learns Mongolian how distinguishes medical NA from medical A, medical masculine GA from QA. etc. Not by the dots? Actually, dropping YA letter to express diphthongs is as you said BIG DAMAGE of Mongolian culture inhibition, learning and teaching logic and BASE writing rules. Thus, we have decided to implement both. Now, you want to encode YI diphthongs with FVS instead of 15-20 words, it's nothing else to eliminate YI variants for diphthongs. The diphthongs are really common. I don't understand what do you mean by originally existing Mongolian regular words! Are the all words with diphthongs not originally existing Mongolian regular words or? If yes, please explain me. If no, your argument is really weak to compare that one. This is the reason why I am spending so many time and efforts to change this encoding in the standards. Even it is already written into China National Standards GB26226-2010. It is unacceptable to almost all of Mongolian In Inner Mongolia except a small group of linguists. Maybe the group of linguists just easily compromise to accept the opinion of Mongolian linguists on this point, not totally recognized its damage and harm. Please pickup all of the related articles and interview documents in previous mail. All of them is supporting this point. As I know this encoding changes had not included in the ISO 10646 proposal until 1998. I do not know how it had been included in the standard proposal, and in the MGWBM book of professor Quejingzhabu. But it is just changed the code not changed the name, it is a little bit unbelievable. We have to respect linguists. Badral Jirimutu =============================================================== Almas Inc. 101-0021 601 Nitto-Bldg, 6-15-11, Soto-Kanda, Chiyoda-ku, Tokyo E-Mail: <mailto:jrmt@almas.co.jp> jrmt@almas.co.jp Mobile : 090-6174-6115 Phone : 03-5688-2081, Fax : 03-5688-2082 <http://www.almas.co.jp/> http://www.almas.co.jp/ <http://www.compiere-japan.com/> http://www.compiere-japan.com/ <http://www.mongolfont.com/> http://www.mongolfont.com/ --------------------------------------------------------------- Inner Mongolia Delehi Information Technology Co. Ltd. 010010 13th floor of Uiles Hotel, No 89 XinHua east street XinCheng District, Hohhot, Inner Mongolia Mail: <mailto:jirimutu@delehi.com> jirimutu@delehi.com Mobile:18647152148 Phone: +86-471-6661969, Ofiice： +86-471-6661995 <http://www.delehi.com/> http://www.delehi.com/ =============================================================== -- Badral Sanlig, Software architect www.bolorsoft.com <http://www.bolorsoft.com> | www.badral.net <http://www.badral.net> Bolorsoft LLC, Selbe Khotkhon 40/4 D2, District 11, Ulaanbaatar
Received on Monday, 23 November 2015 03:48:20 UTC