Fwd: [MINUTES] W3C CCG CCG Verifiable Credentials for Education Task Force Call - 2022-07-25

> Begin forwarded message:
> 
> From: CCG Minutes Bot <minutes@w3c-ccg.org>
> Subject: [MINUTES] W3C CCG CCG Verifiable Credentials for Education Task Force Call - 2022-07-25
> Date: July 25, 2022 at 2:20:24 PM EDT
> To: public-credentials@w3.org
> Resent-From: public-credentials@w3.org
> 
> Thanks to Our Robot Overlords for scribing this week!
> 
> The transcript for the call is now available here:
> 
> https://w3c-ccg.github.io/meetings/2022-07-25-vc-education/
> 
> Full text of the discussion follows for W3C archival purposes.
> Audio of the meeting is available at the following location:
> 
> https://w3c-ccg.github.io/meetings/2022-07-25-vc-education/audio.ogg
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> VC for Education Task Force Transcript for 2022-07-25
> 
> Agenda:
>  https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-vc-edu/2022Jul/0015.html
> Topics:
>  1. IP Note
>  2. Call Notes
>  3. Introductions & Reintroductions
>  4. Announcements & Reminders
>  5. Main Topic: DIDs 101 at VC-EDU
> Organizer:
>  Kerri Lemoie
> Scribe:
>  Our Robot Overlords
> Present:
>  Jeff O - HumanOS, Philipp, Kerri Lemoie, Fateme Fathi, Fiona, 
>  Jonathan Bethune, Razvan Braghesiu (Lightpass), Simone Ravaoli, 
>  David Ward, Chris Wilson, Sharon Leu, Andy Griebel, Victor, Greg 
>  Iarusso (McMaster University), Deb Everhart, Markus Sabadello, 
>  Kimberly Linson, Kate Giovacchini, Paul Grehan, Tim Dutta, Pete 
>  Teigen, Akshar Patel, Nate Otto, Allyson Parco, Brookings, 
>  Matthieu Collé, Chandi Cumaranatunge, Dmitri Zagidulin, Björn 
>  Adelberg (TU Dresden), John Kuo, Keith Hackett, Colin, Learning 
>  Economy, Deepak Kulkarni, Rebecca Busacca, Territorium, Stuart 
>  Freeman, Rohan Carter-Rau, Xander, Matthias Gottlieb (TUM), 
>  Geun-Hyung, Joe Kaplan, Phil L (P1), Phil Barker, James 
>  Chartrand, TimG, Tayken (LEF), David Chadwick, Tim Bouma, Aditya, 
>  Kayode Ezike, Marty Reed, Victor ryu, Keith, Kaliya, Jenn G
> 
> Our Robot Overlords are scribing.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Can you folks hear me okay.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Great hey welcome to the Monday July 25th call for 
>  verifiable credentials for Education. Our main topic today is 
>  essential as identifiers 101 we're going to do some basic 
>  introductions to what did tsar and based on the decentralized 
>  identifier specification that was just approved.
> Kerri Lemoie:  And we'll take a slight BC I do angle to this but 
>  it's going to be a pretty basic calls that we can start setting 
>  up some 101 documentation and get your questions and hopefully 
>  answer some of them.
> <colin,_learning_economy> gm gm
> 
> Topic: IP Note
> 
> Kerri Lemoie:  We have a few things to go over before we get 
>  started the first is the IP note anyone can participate in these 
>  causes are open calls however all substitutive contributions to 
>  any of the ccg work items specification items should be done by 
>  members of the credential community group with full IP our 
>  agreement signed to do that first you would sign up for a W3 
>  account and then you would join the ccg the credential.
> 
> Topic: Call Notes
> 
> Kerri Lemoie:  Secondly these meetings and audio recording for 
>  these meetings we do a transcription so you will see a robot 
>  transcriber you probably see it right now in the chat and we also 
>  do an audio recording and I believe we are doing video recordings 
>  of these calls if you see the transcriber is going awry and I'm 
>  saying things that haven't been said or misinterpreting language 
>  you can go ahead and help.
> Kerri Lemoie:  As with this so we can the most.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Get minutes passed.
> <kerri_lemoie> how to correct the transcriber: s/wrong/correct
> Kerri Lemoie:  By doing substitutions right in the chat and it's 
>  easy and you can do this by Titan s /o wrong term and then 
>  correct one and I just put this in the chat right now let's see 
>  how to wreck the transcriber.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Thank you I missed calls we also use a cue system 
>  so DQ yourself up please put a q+ in the chat and Duty or remove 
>  yourself from the queue predict you - I'm if you know what your 
>  comment is about is helpful for us to know so maybe we can leave 
>  it into the conversation you can cure yourself up with with the 
>  words following like the topic description.
> Kerri Lemoie:   Like this.
> Kerri Lemoie:  And then I'm going to remove myself from thank 
>  you.
> 
> Topic: Introductions & Reintroductions
> 
> Kerri Lemoie:  Okay why don't we start with some introductions 
>  and reintroductions is there anyone who's new to the call today 
>  or has come back to the fall today and would like to tell us 
>  about themselves and maybe we can reduction or tell us about work 
>  that you're doing anything that's changed for you just 
>  queueyourself up right now and we'd love to hear from you.
> Kerri Lemoie:  My folks are debating that I'm going to do a 
>  substitution right now.
> 
> Topic: Announcements & Reminders
> 
> <kerri_lemoie> Upcoming CCG Meetings & Events: 
>  https://w3c-ccg.github.io/announcements/
> <kerri_lemoie> VC-EDU Task Force mailing list, you can join here: 
>  https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-vc-edu/
> Kerri Lemoie:  Have announcements and reminders first is that any 
>  sort of upcoming ccg events are usually announced on this page 
>  also there is a public mailing list for the CG where agenda 
>  announcements are sent out before the the primary group we also 
>  have a mailing list specific for VC edgy that you can join here 
>  I'll put this in the chat for you.
> Kerri Lemoie:  And this is actually an archive page so you can 
>  click on this link and see all archived emails that happen on 
>  this thread there is a subscribe link that's a mail to link that 
>  you can use to join the list and all you do is send the email 
>  with subscribe in the subject you don't need a message for that.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Does anybody else here today have any 
>  announcements.
> Phil_L_(P1): If you can hear me I'll be happy to make one Carrie.
> Phil_L_(P1): One two one two no.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Phil long once you try again I don't see you in a 
>  few and I don't hear you.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  I could hear it though.
> <simone_ravaioli> Yes
> Phil_L_(P1): I guess I better hear me now.
> <kate_giovacchini> Hearing Phil
> Stuart Freeman:  Yes I hear you.
> Phil_L_(P1): You heard me.
> <john_kuo> I can hear Phil
> Phil_L_(P1): Okay doesn't look like Carrie can.
> Colin,_Learning_Economy: Here you go it's kind of strange I think 
>  others said they could hear as well.
> Phil_L_(P1): Can you hear me.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  Wait Harry can you hear us.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Okay Phil and I touch base with you towards the 
>  end of the call and then see if you have some damn you okay.
> <kate_giovacchini> Can Kerri hear anyone else? Yeah.
> Phil_L_(P1): Try again John.
> <sharon_leu> I can hear you, Phil
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  Do you care.
> <simone_ravaioli> Yes
> <colin,_learning_economy> We can hear you Kerri!
> Kerri Lemoie:  Carrie here I am the one with sound issues 
>  apparently you can hear me though which is good give me one 
>  moment.
> <colin,_learning_economy> But not sure you can hear us
> <phil_l_(p1)> Kerri there are others who can hear me but each 
>  other
> <kate_giovacchini> Check speaker--I had mine off. LOL
> Kerri Lemoie:  Okay Phil can you try that again I think I may 
>  have fixed my idea.
> Phil_L_(P1): Alright is this better.
> Kerri Lemoie:  There you are yeah sorry about that please take 
>  the floor.
> Phil_L_(P1): That's all right I'm off and have trouble connecting 
>  attended yesterday just a quick note that we have submitted a 
>  paper to the rebooting the web of Trust on the endorsement 
>  credential which we use some time ago you and I will put the link 
>  for that in chat is going to be here.
> https://github.com/WebOfTrustInfo/rwot11-the-hague/blob/master/advance-readings/endorsements.md
> Phil_L_(P1): And and we will be holding a session hopefully 
>  sometime in the near future at another we see edu meeting.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Thanks Phil you know you Phil's been working on 
>  this for a long time and really been pushing pushing this topic I 
>  had it's just take a look at this and read our thoughts on this 
>  and how how this can be done we'd like to work with all of you in 
>  this open community.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Okay the queue is empty Dimitri and Simone do you 
>  have anything before I get started on our dids 101.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  Nothing for me.
> <phil_l_(p1)> Thanks to Dmitri for his expert guidance on the 
>  endorsement credential work, and Kerri for critical input and 
>  comments
> Kerri Lemoie:  Okay thank you thanks feel free to I jump in at 
>  any time and also let me know if there's anything in the Keel so 
>  I can kind of keep an eye on it I'm going to share my screen.
> 
> Topic: Main Topic: DIDs 101 at VC-EDU
> 
> Kerri Lemoie:  Hey can you see my screen.
> Phil_L_(P1): Yes we can.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Website before we get started Jonathan I see you 
>  just added yourself to the queue I took yourself off from the 
>  queue are you all set.
> Jonathan_Bethune: I didn't do a thumbs up.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Oh good thank you okay.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Hey Sue the aims of this discussion.
> <kate_giovacchini> P1, please put yourself on mute.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I'm having a little bit of feedback.
> Kerri Lemoie:  If you have your mic on would you mind.
> <deb_everhart_(credential_engine)> it's Phil L
> Kerri Lemoie:  Harold I'm having audio issues today.
> <kate_giovacchini> GTG
> Kerri Lemoie:  Still there we go okay that's much better thank 
>  you all right.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Themes of today's call is to basically have an 
>  introduction to decentralize identifiers and why this matters for 
>  us for educational training and achievement verifiable 
>  credentials we're going to be doing this sort of deconstructing 
>  the did core specification really at a very I was at a very high 
>  level but also at a we're going to take in a little bit but we're 
>  not going to get into.
> Kerri Lemoie:  How do you actually implement this.
> Kerri Lemoie:  It's so it is sort of a broader understanding of 
>  how it did Czar how they work why we need them and and some 
>  examples of what they look like.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Then we're going to do is we're going to see if 
>  some questions come up and later on we're going to turn these 
>  slides into the archive of this call into my resource so please 
>  feel free to ask your questions and I guarantee that if you have 
>  them that others have them to also we have quite a few people on 
>  the call today and I know that many of you are very much more 
>  deeply experienced and knowledgeable about it so I hope that you 
>  can jump on the Queue and share what you know as well.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Hey so why did he need this.
> Kerri Lemoie:  So we have right now we use a lot of globally you 
>  need at Affairs telephone numbers email addresses usernames on 
>  websites government ID diverse domain names and none of these are 
>  under our control very we rent them we someone gives them to us.
> Kerri Lemoie:  We have they were taken away from us right so for 
>  instance or also they could be replicated like how many times 
>  have you gotten a phishing email spam email or even you know a 
>  text that looks like it's coming from somebody and these are 
>  things that exist out in the world that we use to like represent 
>  ourselves and to communicate but they don't actually represent us 
>  they are created by us at all and then you know that's how the 
>  area has been all along that's how you know it's probably going 
>  to be for some time.
> Kerri Lemoie:  But in the meantime.
> Kerri Lemoie:  So we can that you can shift this a little bit.
> Kerri Lemoie:  We should also note that in educational 
>  credentials like badges we've historically use email addresses to 
>  represent the Learners and this has been a problem because 
>  Learners May or individuals idlers may use lose those email 
>  addresses from your institutions or employers may take away those 
>  email addresses I know like I've encountered this where I've had 
>  accounts with email address and then if I can't access that email 
>  address anymore then I can't prove that I have control over it if 
>  you.
> Kerri Lemoie:   Can't prove that you've contributed.
> Kerri Lemoie: 
>  https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/19ghZWblVjB7ozW_VkgjXgy10kUvnqiC-ws8V7cO9xKg/edit#slide=id.g13ebe55d3de_0_67
> Kerri Lemoie:  All over the identifier that you are using for a 
>  credential that you can't really prove that credential is yours 
>  and maybe sometimes it doesn't matter in the short term but in a 
>  matter longer in life and that's sort of what we want to think 
>  about when you I'm going to put the link to the slides here in 
>  the chat for you so you can follow along and have access to all 
>  the links.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I am minor 7th slide I've made links to that pet 
>  that section of the dock and also any sort of ancillary 
>  references so for instance at the bottom of this document we have 
>  a link to the did use cases where you can read more about why 
>  we're going to be like how we could use did some of those use 
>  cases are.
> Kerri Lemoie:  So what is it right attend size identify or a did 
>  is a globally unique identifier.
> Kerri Lemoie:  It can that the specification says that it refers 
>  to any subject us to be a person organization a thing a data 
>  model abstract entity anything and I was as however the 
>  controller of the did decides and.
> Kerri Lemoie:  We talked about it in this context more for 
>  education or training or to cheat if you my credentials but dudes 
>  can also represent books or you know supplies you mostly they're 
>  used for Supply management now than anything else but it because 
>  in this context we want to use people be able to use them in 
>  organizations be able to use them we're investigating them more 
>  right here at VC-EDU.
> Kerri Lemoie:   So did Zara.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Unique identifier they can be created by 
>  individuals organizations to represent themselves they create 
>  them they create them using some kind of a tool provided to 
>  create them whenever they want however they work that is it the 
>  plan anyway that is the idea they can also be deleted right the 
>  control is should be right there by the individuals or the 
>  organization's you can have as many as you want you can use them 
>  as many different contexts as we want and that is very.
> Kerri Lemoie:   Different than how we use identifiers online.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Did Sarah Fenton hated by proof of control using 
>  cryptographic groups and so what does that mean right this means 
>  cryptographic ography Works in a way that the way we haven't 
>  talked about it here anyway is public and private key pairs so 
>  you have a private key and that means that it is associated with 
>  a public key that public can see I often use a house analogy for 
>  this where you.
> Kerri Lemoie:   You might have the address of where I live but.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Key to get into that house and is the private key 
>  that actually proves control of ditz and we're not going to get 
>  too much into the different proof methods and encryption types 
>  that are out there we could probably have another call about that 
>  as we get closer to cluckfest to but today I think it is enough 
>  probably to know that if you create a did.
> Kerri Lemoie:   You typically have.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I have a key that you control to prove control of 
>  that did we are going to show one other example though called did 
>  with that that breaks that move just a little bit.
> Kerri Lemoie:  And I'm just going to check the queue and see if I 
>  should pause there there's any questions.
> Kerri Lemoie:  This is what it looks like.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I'm giving us even the cutest give them get 
>  through this part and then we had colony.
> Kerri Lemoie:  So did see are your eyes they associate a did 
>  subject with a did document the did document describes how a did 
>  can be how the proof of control can be verified.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Um the actual statement from the specification 
>  says dids are you are eyes that Associated did subject with a did 
>  document allowing trustable interactions associated with that 
>  subject and they look like.
> Kerri Lemoie:  And you are eyes actually looks like the sweet 
>  example of another kind of a URI is a URL instead of did here 
>  which describes describes the scheme of this URI you are much 
>  more familiar with seeing HTTP which describes how to access your 
>  l in a web browser.
> Kerri Lemoie:   With the did.
> Kerri Lemoie:  You have the.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Mm did this is the says this this URI is did and 
>  this is the did method and the did method describes there's so 
>  many of them it describes how this did can be verified it points 
>  to the did documents now get that a little bit more but each each 
>  method provides different ways of proving control of the did and 
>  then lastly is the unique identifier for that did method.
> Kerri Lemoie:  But David you have the floor.
> <phil_l_(p1)> Actually you can control the identifier in the 
>  sense that you can create it or remove it.  The question of how 
>  credible the DID doc references that give someone multiple 
>  attributes about you is a different question.
> <phil_l_(p1)> Similarly the question of key backup is a different 
>  question as well.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I'm going to call on TV tree but first I just want 
>  to say thank you for sharing your opinion David I'm today we're 
>  just reviewing what is in the document certainly there are 
>  challenges to consider with any technology and appreciate you 
>  bringing that up Dimitri.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  I just wanted to follow on you David.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  The famous line in this is not even who is 
>  controlling like yeah there's an enable digital a lot more 
>  control about they're both identity but even for institutional 
>  control.
> <kate_giovacchini> A little hard to hear--maybe that mic can be 
>  closer.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  Did provide a number of technical features 
>  that made even if none of the power structures control structures 
>  or anything like that changes did Stone able to use previous 
>  systems just much easier much better with probation revocation 
>  capabilities Discovery capabilities and and in addition to giving 
>  us say.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  A bigger URL space than just the web for 
>  example in which to explore theirs.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Thanks to entry I think it's great to have this 
>  time this rounded discussion about it and I'm just going to get 
>  back to our unpacking of the the did Doc did course back now and 
>  and then we hopefully will have some room at the end of the call 
>  to have further discussion about this topic.
> Kerri Lemoie:  In the next section I that I have here in the 
>  slides come right from the the document from the specification 
>  this is the design goals of the centralized identifiers and I'm 
>  going to go through them pretty quickly here so that you sort of 
>  understand what the aims are for centralized identifiers and and 
>  understand sort of that angle of it a little bit better so here's 
>  here's what the specification spills out.
> Kerri Lemoie:   The first thing on the list is.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Actions and seeds to eliminate the requirement for 
>  centralized authorities or single point of failure and identifier 
>  management including the registration of globally unique 
>  identifiers and public verification keeps.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Second is control.
> Kerri Lemoie:  This gives and his employers identifiers aim to 
>  give entities with human and non-human the power to directly 
>  control their digital identifiers without the need to rely on 
>  external authorities.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Next is privacy dids enable entities to control 
>  the privacy of their information including minimal selective and 
>  Progressive disclosure of attributes or other data.
> Kerri Lemoie:  It may have security dids enables efficient 
>  security for requesting parties to depend on did documents for 
>  their required level of assurance we're going to talk about did 
>  documents a little bit next and how they work.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Did the naval did controllers to provide 
>  cryptographic proof when they're interacting with other entities.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Discoverability makes it possible for instance he 
>  discovered bids for other entities to learn more about or 
>  interact with those entities.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Interoperability which we talked about a lot here 
>  in this space especially verifiable credentials use interoperable 
>  standards so that the did infrastructure can make use of existing 
>  tools and software libraries designed for interoperability we're 
>  going to have two tools that we're going to talk about in a 
>  little while.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Did she system our aim to be system and network 
>  independent and enable entities to use a digital identifiers with 
>  any system that supports dudes and did methods and simplicity 
>  dudes favor A reduced set of simple features to make the 
>  technology easier to understand and Implement and deploy.
> <davidc> I wonder why none of the comments I made have made it 
>  into the minutes, yet Dmitri's response did?
> Kerri Lemoie:  Extensibility when possible we are possible Disney 
>  able extensibility provides it does not greatly hinder 
>  interoperability portability or Simplicity that's how they worded 
>  it in the documents reading it right from there let me see who is 
>  in the queue I think I heard someone come up okay.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Is how do you dudes work.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Like we said above I'm dids are you arise that 
>  associate the did subject with a did document that allows 
>  trustable interactions associated with that subject.
> Kerri Lemoie:  This screenshot right here in the slide is it a 
>  base example very simple example of a did document that is in the 
>  specification.
> Kerri Lemoie:  This document contains information that's to 
>  associate with the do such as ways to cryptographically 
>  authenticate the controller.
> Kerri Lemoie:  It's method of the did that explains how to 
>  retrieve this document the document and how the proof of control 
>  of the did can be performed for that method.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Is that does anybody have anything they want to 
>  ask right now I don't see anyone in the queue but I just want to 
>  make sure that everybody is all with me.
> Kerri Lemoie:  So we're going to go through three examples.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Um these were chosen these three examples were 
>  chosen because they were the top three methods that are being 
>  used by the plugfest one participants.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Is a no favoritism in my apart this is just what 
>  the data shows the first one though is that did key.
> Kerri Lemoie:  So this is what it did he look like.
> Kerri Lemoie:  And you can see it is a did the name of the method 
>  is key and then here's a you guys identifiers in this example.
> Kerri Lemoie:  The document for a dick he explains the 
>  cryptographic method that's associated with the did and it looks 
>  like this.
> Kerri Lemoie:  This also provides the information that you need 
>  to prove control over did key note that I did he doesn't use a 
>  blockchain at all it relies on the holder of the did to prove 
>  that they have control of the private key that is associated with 
>  the public key in the did document and that is that there is no 
>  blockchain involved there's no writing to a blockchain is simply 
>  stored on a computer that is being used or the the app the mobile 
>  device that's being used is generated there and stored there.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Did kids use being used a lot right.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Now because it's really.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Did Implement there's a lot of libraries for it 
>  and most of the implications right now least in our VC Edge you 
>  space are the pilots that are using this.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Next example that we have here.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Did web is based on the URL this note that I put 
>  here comes from the did word explanation here in the registry is 
>  the fully qualified domain name that secured by TLS or SSL 
>  certificate eyes with an optional path to a did document and how 
>  this works is that someone applies for a domain name at a 
>  register and then they associate a domain name with an IP address 
>  where it can be located and then it did.
> Kerri Lemoie:  And with the json-ld that looks something like.
> Kerri Lemoie:  This is actually stored on that server where that 
>  domain is and and that is how that one works there are no keys 
>  involved it is all done through the SSL register and improving 
>  control of the domain.
> Kerri Lemoie:  The third one that's the most popular being used 
>  because especially it's a very early one is did sov.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Only in red here because that's how it is in the 
>  specification this is a screenshot it doesn't it's not read 
>  because you know read to me is a very strong color anyway this is 
>  an example of a did self and it's created on a public blockchain 
>  called Sovereign it reads directly from Sovereign and then I'm 
>  did document is generated from that what is the results of the 
>  poll from The Sovereign blockchain and then proof of control is 
>  still based on the cryptographic key pairs.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Those are three examples that we have but as the 
>  publication of the did spec there are over 130 this said 103 103 
>  sorry it's it's a lot prettier.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Will it typically means user need to look up all 
>  of these dad's probably not most applications will decide which 
>  ones to implement an overtime America will probably decide which 
>  ones that use the most and but until then probably there's going 
>  to be more before there will be less and what we have to look up 
>  dudes is it did specification registry and it contains an 
>  alphabetical list of the did methods put it right here.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Quite a few of these are using blockchain in fact 
>  I think maybe all of them are using black chain or some describe 
>  how to move from one black change to another I believe that is 
>  how how Carrie Works although I need to learn a little bit more 
>  about that some are Ledger agnostic to you.
> Kerri Lemoie:  This tree actually serves as the official registry 
>  and it stores all known Global parameters the property is the 
>  values so all of these documents here actually our reference from 
>  the from here so all of the information you want to learn how to 
>  read the document retrieve the document and verify that did all 
>  could be stored in the registry and so you can learn how to do 
>  that and decide which dids your applications are going to use.
> Kerri Lemoie:  But now we have a couple of tools.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I'm just going to highlight today one is did actor 
>  we used it after quite a bit during the plugfest I'm did actor 
>  you can create and resolved it you can also create and verify 
>  credentials and presentations.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Really super easy to use and it's a good way to go 
>  in and just play with play with things I don't know how many 
>  different types of did you can eat it looks like maybe you can 
>  only create did key on here but still it's a way to try that out 
>  and see how that works.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Secondly we have a universal resolver so with the 
>  resolver does as is it says this is how this it retrieves the 
>  actual document and I think that Marcus Marcus from Danny Tech is 
>  here Marcus are you here today so you'd mentioned you would be 
>  hearing kids her talk about Universal resolver if you are.
> Markus Sabadello:  I'm I'm here yes sir okay.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Hi do you mind explaining the resolver.
> Markus Sabadello:  Yes no problem.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Would you like me to hand the screen over to you 
>  or should I just leave it on the screen here.
> Markus Sabadello:  Are you can can also leave it here with you 
>  for now I think you've I think you've already explained all the 
>  important Concepts very well so as you as you said that it's have 
>  Associated the documents and you also explain the concept of 58 
>  method I and as you as you said there are a lot of them and for 
>  each did method the process how you get from the deed to the 
>  document is very different right you.
> Markus Sabadello:  That some did method.
> Markus Sabadello:  Use block chains and added methods to not use 
>  block chains and that's one of the features of the it's if you 
>  think about it is kind of abstraction layer and and the fact that 
>  it's can work very differently underneath so that this process 
>  how you get from the D to the document initially a few years ago 
>  when we started to work on this we thought they would all be 
>  blockchain based on we thought we would need different did 
>  methods because you know there was.
> Markus Sabadello:   There was.
> Markus Sabadello:  There was a theory mm and there was Sovereign 
>  then there was various one and then those were all Ledger's and 
>  we thought that's why we need did methods but over time the 
>  concept of a did method has become much more flexible and people 
>  have come up with very Innovative types of these including things 
>  like the web and did these key that that you mentioned but what 
>  they all have in common is that there's always these resolutions 
>  step 4 you can get to the document and the universal resolved 
>  arisen.
> Markus Sabadello:   Implementation of I think about 45 different.
> Markus Sabadello:  You can pass in a dedicated web Deeds of the 
>  in the end and so on and it will be able to resolve it and it 
>  does that by using a set of what we call drivers right so it has 
>  a list of drivers and each driver implements added method and 
>  that's how it becomes a Universal resort branded can be useful in 
>  scenarios when when you're building applications.
> Markus Sabadello:  Services that you want to be.
> Markus Sabadello:  Headed with this.
> <kerri_lemoie> Article by Markus about the DID Resolver: 
>  https://medium.com/decentralized-identity/the-universal-resolver-infrastructure-395281d2b540
> Markus Sabadello:  It methods to and this can be a useful tool of 
>  course it also has some some drawbacks probably on the technical 
>  level it's a pretty heavyweight service it's operated as a 
>  service with remote endpoint right so you you run it as a as a 
>  remote service it may introduce some dependencies that you may 
>  not always always one so for example if.
> Markus Sabadello:   If you're if you're just building.
> Markus Sabadello:  Occasions and services that that should work.
> Markus Sabadello:  State weapon did key then probably you don't 
>  need this tool because it's very easy to resolve it weaponed Tiki 
>  and you don't need to use such a heavy weight remote service like 
>  the universal resolver but if you want to be compatible with many 
>  did methods and then this could be useful and a final thing I 
>  will say is this is a community maintained or right so this is an 
>  open source project at the decentralized identity Foundation.
> Markus Sabadello:   Ian and those drivers those.
> Markus Sabadello:  So stay calm from different.
> Markus Sabadello:  They typically come from the same Community 
>  that's also that also invented the did method right at that's the 
>  intention if you decide if you design a new did method and it 
>  would be nice to also contribute a driver for the universal 
>  resolver so that people can can resolve your you did method.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Thank you Marcus is great one question I have for 
>  you is I'm you mentioned that it's a service is there some open 
>  source code or libraries that could people can install on their 
>  own their own applications instead of using the service.
> Markus Sabadello:  The whole thing is open source so what you're 
>  looking at here the user interface the API and the set of these 
>  these drivers you can take all of that and you can deploy it on 
>  your own server right so people are not really supposed to rely 
>  on on this one instance that you're looking at where it says 
>  they've taught you need to resolve a totally oh that's one 
>  instance of the universal resolver which diff is operating for 
>  the community and maybe it's it's good enough for some.
> Markus Sabadello:   Mentation but you should not rely on this 
>  one.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I guess that.
> Kerri Lemoie: Github: 
>  https://github.com/decentralized-identity/universal-resolver
> Markus Sabadello:  And point there's also a warning little 
>  warning sign on the top right corner of the of the page so if you 
>  yeah it is one sexy it explains the downsides of this but it's 
>  open source and you can run your own instance of that instead of 
>  relying on the the instance that you're looking at.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I just had a link to get Hub in the chat is that 
>  the correct Repository.
> Markus Sabadello:  Yes that is the that is the source repository 
>  and that has some some information also on how it works and how 
>  to contribute drivers and how to install it it maybe I can.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I think you owe us okay.
> Markus Sabadello: 
>  https://github.com/decentralized-identity/universal-registrar
> Markus Sabadello:  Maybe I'll just quickly also post the second 
>  repository so there's a lesser-known second open source project 
>  which is called Universal registrar so that's a similar idea 
>  similar design but that is not for resolving these that's for 
>  creating and updating and deactivating deeds and it's a bit more 
>  experimental it's not so much here and it doesn't support that 
>  many did methods but it's.
> Markus Sabadello:   Also modeled after the universal resources.
> Markus Sabadello:  Yeah but but for creating and managing these 
>  rather than resolving DIDs.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Thank you Marcos it's great really appreciate this 
>  work that you all do.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I'm also looking here I was looking at the GitHub 
>  repo for a good actor I'm going to put that in the chat as well.
> <kerri_lemoie> github repo for did actor: 
>  https://github.com/w3c-ccg/did.actor
> Kerri Lemoie:  His folks who are interested in doing this might 
>  be able to look at that source and sort of back into how they 
>  would create it's on their system.
> Kerri Lemoie:  The queue is still empty the last thing I had for 
>  for today for now is all of these are all of the references that 
>  were mentioned throughout these slides the only one that I did 
>  not reference here didn't get into it too much at all actually is 
>  it did rubric and this may be interested interesting to some of 
>  you who are trying to evaluate.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Kids to you.
> Kerri Lemoie:  The did rubric is a scoring guide that's used to 
>  evaluate evaluated and you can take a look at that and and see 
>  the examples that they have provided some really well if I did 
>  like you know what is the what are the processes what are the 
>  requirements and then what are some examples and how they were 
>  scored just to give you a comparison for how you would evaluate 
>  dids for your own systems.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Yeah that is the end of the slides for now and 
>  what I have to present for now as part of this did one on one 
>  does anybody have any questions they would like to ask their you 
>  think others on your teams may have and we can do our best to 
>  answer them or you know have any other sort of discussions about 
>  its while we're here especially in relation to a verifiable 
>  credentials for education.
> <john_kuo> Thank you Kerri this is a great overview
> Kerri Lemoie:  Hey David you have the floor.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I don't know it didn't.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I mean I can restart the transcriber thank you for 
>  noticing that it doesn't say that it's not running and I see it 
>  transcribing here so I'm not sure it's capturing everything.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I don't I don't think so I don't have any controls 
>  and it should not be specific to any individuals it is just based 
>  on whatever is all based on the Google transcriber and so it does 
>  picks up whatever here's and does its best to translate you know 
>  vocals the words.
> Kerri Lemoie:  That's a good question I don't know what browser 
>  are you using because I can help.
> <simone_ravaioli> Thanks for flagging this, David. Let us look 
>  into it.
> Kerri Lemoie:  It should work with Firefox I'm going to look into 
>  that I'm not using Firefox right now that I'm planning on 
>  switching to that so that's good to know I think some people are 
>  because we were having trouble with with other browsers yeah 
>  thank you for mentioning that so we can look into it.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Absolutely we'd like to capture as much as we can.
> <simone_ravaioli> the audio recording will be ok
> <phil_l_(p1)> I'm using firefox as well. 102.0.1 (64-bit). So if 
>  my comment is in there it's not Firefox dependent
> Kerri Lemoie:  Fortunately we do have the audio and that will be 
>  sent out with the minutes but I'll take a look at that.
> <stuart_freeman> I'm using firefox and it transcribed something I 
>  said earlier
> Phil_L_(P1): Yes thank you.
> Kerri Lemoie:  You have the floor yep you have the floor.
> Kerri Lemoie:  David can you hear me.
> <david_ward> I guess you can't hear me.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I can't hear you.
> <simone_ravaioli> no.
> <phil_l_(p1)> No I can't
> Kerri Lemoie:  It's not me again can anybody else here David not 
>  me okay good.
> <geun-hyung> No I can't
> Kerri Lemoie:  Sorry did you want to type something into the 
>  chat.
> <david_ward> I wanted to ask about the design goal of 
>  discoverability.
> Kerri Lemoie:  The design goal of discoverability.
> <david_ward> I haven't seen anything showing how to discover DIDs 
>  of other entities.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Make it back to that slide here.
> <david_ward> Are there examples of such yet?
> Kerri Lemoie:  That's a good question so I David says he hasn't 
>  seen anything showing how to discover dudes or other entities.
> Kerri Lemoie:  And that is good that's a good question to be 
>  treated you I do you know anything about discovering did it but 
>  any sort of work out there that.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  Sure and Marcus so absolutely right the 
>  question of Discovery is associating did with anti-government 
>  companies or people.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  Thomas Malthus depend on.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  I'm the ways of animals.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  For example there's facts that'll allow you if 
>  you know Innovations or so the person.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  Allows you to discover what the did that 
>  empties using from what essentially a file that you post on your 
>  website that's one option another option is to bootstrap.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  So you again you know somebody's URL you can 
>  load their schedule.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  That's an onboarding sort of way to relate 
>  Legacy information like do rails to companies but obviously not 
>  everybody is going to be hosting every dollar on the way home 
>  what other another approach taken by the community is the notion 
>  of prospects.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  For example here in the case.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  Not carry things like name of these do stand 
>  for it.
> Kerri Lemoie: Sidebar: is anyone else using firefox who has 
>  participated in the audio?
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  Propelled with that they could be put into 
>  service so would provide is a directory much like phone days we 
>  have the White Pages Yellow.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  How do you discover I didn't phone number.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  Other methods of bootstrapping process.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  They did that have to do with physical places 
>  by.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  To our codes and offices for Michael Kamen.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  A part of.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  Contact you know spending of your business 
>  card is a discovery may know the entity and I see are a bunch of 
>  identify you know phone number and now did so.
> Dmitri Zagidulin:  All of the techniques from phone and email 
>  days of Discovery apply plus we have.
> <david_ward> Thank you.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Thanks to meet Ray Marcus.
> Markus Sabadello:  I agree with everything that Dimitri said I 
>  can think of one more potential approach to discover teeth 
>  remember that a lot of the did methods are based on lectures or 
>  blockchains which means that in for some of the did methods all 
>  the DIDs are globally visible right if you create a sovereignty 
>  it or you create an FC T it or anion.
> Markus Sabadello:   Eat it then.
> Markus Sabadello:  Anyone can see all the Deeds that exists 
>  globally and often you will not know anything about these things 
>  right so in many cases the data is just the deed and there's no 
>  other data associated with it which is often a good thing and 
>  therefore you don't really know anything about it but in theory 
>  it would be possible to have also public data associated with 
>  those publicly visible Deeds right for example.
> Markus Sabadello:   I've heard some.
> <kerri_lemoie> Folks may find Phil Windley's explanation of DIDs 
>  helpful: 
>  https://www.windley.com/archives/2019/02/decentralized_identifiers.shtml
> Markus Sabadello:  Use cases are or ideas we're at the heat in 
>  that the document could have a service endpoint which points to 
>  some place for example the centralized web node or something else 
>  but it points to something where you can actually discover public 
>  information about the date like the name of the organization for 
>  example and if you do that then then you couldn't see a read 
>  index all those public Deeds plus all the data that's available 
>  about it and you.
> Markus Sabadello:   Could have something like Google of Deeds.
> Markus Sabadello:  Sickly but your index the dates with the 
>  associated public data and that's something that hopefully would 
>  be done for Deeds of organizations and companies are not so much 
>  for personalities but that could be another approach where were 
>  you then run searches or Discovery processes against this Public 
>  public set of tits.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Anybody else have any questions.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Kate you have floor.
> Kate_Giovacchini: And I just want you to repost that link to the 
>  Google slide deck could you do that.
> Kerri Lemoie:  I sure can.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Here you go.
> <kerri_lemoie> slide deck: 
>  https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/19ghZWblVjB7ozW_VkgjXgy10kUvnqiC-ws8V7cO9xKg/edit#slide=id.p
> Kerri Lemoie:  Ideally what we do is take this slide deck 
>  Gathering your questions and put this out there as a resource on 
>  the VC edgy website and start compiling more and more resources 
>  because we're getting to the stage where more and more pilots are 
>  happening and more and more questions are coming in and it's just 
>  time to start building up documentation to help folks really get 
>  started and digging into this and in my experience.
> Kerri Lemoie:   Experience a multi-modal.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Coach to this works works best when you have very 
>  many different documents to look at and documentation to 
>  reference and at some point different parts of each one help 
>  gather understanding and this is how I work as a developer 
>  sometimes it takes me 20 different references before it really 
>  clicked with me and I know I've got it right.
> Kerri Lemoie:   And we'd like to do the.
> Kerri Lemoie:  You help folks get it right.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Anybody else have any questions.
> Kerri Lemoie:  Okay about four minutes left so I'm going to let 
>  folks have that time back I appreciate all of you being here 
>  today I will do the minutes soon and send those out and of course 
>  feel free to reach out with any questions and I will see you next 
>  week.
> <sharon_leu> Thanks!
> <deb_everhart_(credential_engine)> thank you, very helpful!
> <geun-hyung> Thanks
> <kimberly_wilson_linson> THANK YOU
> <tim_dutta> Thanks!
> <colin,_learning_economy> Thank yoU!
> <tayken_(lef)> Thank you! 🙏
> Jenn_G: Cording has stopped.
> 
>