Re: Little PROV-O questions

On Feb 12, 2013, at 12:22 PM, Luc Moreau <L.Moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk> wrote:

> Hi Tim, Simon, and Ivan, and all
> 
> 
> Appendix A in prov-dm is normative, and changing it would .... you know what.

Does that mean I cannot add the sentence:

"The properties rdf:type and rdfs:label are used to express prov:type and prov:label, respectively."

to a normative section?

-Tim

> 
> The group has decided not to formalise the translation between serializations, except
> for the toplevel concepts listed table 10 of prov-dm.
> 
> We had a similar debate for translating types to xml.  We had left this to the translators
> to solve.
> 
> Luc
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 02/12/2013 02:29 PM, Timothy Lebo wrote:
>> Simon (and Luc),
>> 
>> On Jan 16, 2013, at 3:51 AM, "Miles, Simon" <simon.miles@kcl.ac.uk> wrote:
>> 
>>> Hello PROV-O authors,
>>> 
>>> From doing some implementation based on the PROV-O and PROV-DM specs, I noticed a few things that could be clarified.
>>> 
>>> 1. Two terms defined in PROV-DM are not part of PROV-O and it's not clearly set out how the same concepts should be expressed in PROV-O. In particular, PROV-DM definitions use attribute prov:type. I believe, from previous mails, that this should be expressed as rdf:type in PROV-O data, but I couldn't find it documented.
>> 
>> 
>> You are correct, PROV-O uses rdf:type to express prov:type.
>> You are also correct that this was not explicitly stated in the HTML document.
>> I've added a note into http://aquarius.tw.rpi.edu/prov-wg/prov-o#description-starting-point-terms
>> 
>> @Luc, would it make sense to make entries for "type" and "label" in http://www.w3.org/TR/prov-dm/#cross-references-to-prov-o-and-prov-n ?
>> 
>>> Similarly, I couldn't find information on how to encode prov:label, which is asked about in the implementation questionnaire maybe implying it could be used with PROV-O (I assume it maps to rdfs:label).
>> 
>> Yes, this is included in the change I mention above.
>> 
>>> 
>>> 2. I noticed that qualifiedPrimarySource, qualifiedRevision and qualifiedQuotation are subproperties of qualifiedInfluence, but not of qualifiedDerivation. This seems inconsistent with the binary relations, hadPrimarySource, wasRevisedFrom and wasQuotedFrom which are subproperties of wasDerivedFrom.
>> 
>> .. and also inconsistent with the subclass hierarchy, where e.g. Revision is a subclass of Derivation.
>> We changed the class hierarchy in response to Alan's http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/ResponsesToPublicComments#ISSUE-552_.28Influence_subclasses.29
>> So, the natural direction for "readability" would be to make the qualified* sub properties of qualifiedDerivation.
>> But we can't make the change this far along.
>> Fortunately, the qualification properties are of a different breed than the binary properties and the classes, so we can justify the distinction.
>> And, the ranges of the qualified{Revision,PrimarySource,Quotation} are to the specific classes Revision,PrimarySource,Quotation -- which are now subclasses of Derivation thanks to Alan in his issue above.
>> So, it all still works out.
>> 
>> 
>>> Maybe I don't understand the rationale or missed it on the mailing list, but thought I'd point it out.
>> 
>> Thanks.
>> 
>>> 
>>> 3. I think the definition/description of prov:value could be better: "The main value (if there is one) of a structured value." Should the second "value" be another term?
>> 
>> This was out of date. What is shown was prov-o editorial and taken from rdf:value's definition.
>> i've updated the prov:value to be from DM: 
>> 
>> provides a value that is a direct representation of an entity
>> 
>> at http://aquarius.tw.rpi.edu/prov-wg/prov-o#value
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Tim
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> thanks,
>>> Simon
>>> 
>>> Dr Simon Miles
>>> Senior Lecturer, Department of Informatics
>>> Kings College London, WC2R 2LS, UK
>>> +44 (0)20 7848 1166
>>>  
>>> Transparent Provenance Derivation for User Decisions:
>>> http://eprints.dcs.kcl.ac.uk/1400/
>> 
> 
> -- 
> Professor Luc Moreau
> Electronics and Computer Science   tel:   +44 23 8059 4487
> University of Southampton          fax:   +44 23 8059 2865
> Southampton SO17 1BJ               email: l.moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk
> United Kingdom                     http://www.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~lavm
>