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Re: PROV-ISSUE-142 (Tlebo): Can roles only be Literals? [Data Model]

From: Timothy Lebo <lebot@rpi.edu>
Date: Tue, 22 Nov 2011 12:41:38 -0500
Cc: public-prov-wg@w3.org
Message-Id: <8C039110-5E66-4F6A-8101-841489A3D8C3@rpi.edu>
To: Paolo Missier <Paolo.Missier@ncl.ac.uk>

On Nov 8, 2011, at 3:28 AM, Paolo Missier wrote:

> Luc, Jim
> 
> I think Luc is formally right but again, to anyone wearing SW glasses, the examples /look like/ RFD Literals.
> So I suggest to state in the section that Typed Literals in DM are expressed using a combination of a string and datatype iri. And state explicitly that this follows RDF convention but are not to be confused with RDF literals. and give the counter example:
>  "http://example.org/foo"^^rdf:resource
> as a valid Literal


since rdf:resource doesn't exist as a datatype, perhaps use dm:Resource or similar?

-Tim


> 
> --Paolo
> 
> 
> On 11/8/11 8:44 AM, Luc Moreau wrote:
>> You are mixing concrete syntax and abstract syntax. All typed literals in prov-dm have a string and a datatype iri.  It also applies to int, float, etc for which there is no syntactic sugar either in the ASN.  Why should we make a distinction for resources?
>> 
>> Professor Luc Moreau
>> Electronics and Computer Science
>> University of Southampton
>> Southampton SO17 1BJ
>> United Kingdom
>> 
>> On 8 Nov 2011, at 06:40, "Jim McCusker"<mccusj@rpi.edu>  wrote:
>> 
>>> If you're going to directly reference RDF Resource, just use the
>>> accepted syntax for it (like you did with the other literals), which
>>> is what I used.
>>> 
>>> Jim
>>> 
>>> On Tue, Nov 8, 2011 at 1:25 AM, Luc Moreau<L.Moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk>  wrote:
>>>> It seems that you want to write
>>>> "http://example.org/foo"^^rdf:resource
>>>> or similar.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Professor Luc Moreau
>>>> Electronics and Computer Science
>>>> University of Southampton
>>>> Southampton SO17 1BJ
>>>> United Kingdom
>>>> 
>>>> On 8 Nov 2011, at 00:27, "Jim McCusker"<mccusj@rpi.edu<mailto:mccusj@rpi.edu>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> These are syntactically RDF literals:
>>>> 
>>>> "abc"
>>>> "abc"@en
>>>> "abc"^^xsd:string
>>>> "1"^^xsd:int
>>>> "http://example.org/foo"^^xsd:anyURI
>>>> 
>>>> Maybe they're also PROV-DM literals, but then you should support the
>>>> following URI "literals":
>>>> 
>>>> <http://example.org>
>>>> 
>>>> Jim
>>>> 
>>>> On Mon, Nov 7, 2011 at 6:38 PM, Luc Moreau<L.Moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk<mailto:L.Moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk>>  wrote:
>>>> No Jim, they are prov-dm literals, "leaves" as you said.
>>>> I thought you would map a prov-dm URi literal into an rdf resource.
>>>> 
>>>> Professor Luc Moreau
>>>> Electronics and Computer Science
>>>> University of Southampton
>>>> Southampton SO17 1BJ
>>>> United Kingdom
>>>> 
>>>> On 7 Nov 2011, at 23:35, "Jim McCusker"<mccusj@rpi.edu<mailto:mccusj@rpi.edu>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> The examples are all RDF literals. I thought that we weren't using any
>>>> RDF in the DM...
>>>> 
>>>> Jim
>>>> 
>>>> On Mon, Nov 7, 2011 at 5:19 PM, Luc Moreau<L.Moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk<mailto:L.Moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk>>  wrote:
>>>> Hi Tim, Stephan, Jim,
>>>> 
>>>> Here is a first draft of the literal section.
>>>> 
>>>> http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/prov/raw-file/default/model/ProvenanceModel.html#record-literal
>>>> 
>>>> It would be good to have your feedback.
>>>> If you find it's ok, than the literals examples in the document need to be
>>>> checked.
>>>> 
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Luc
>>>> 
>>>> On 07/11/11 18:15, Jim McCusker wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> On Mon, Nov 7, 2011 at 12:42 PM, Paolo Missier<Paolo.Missier@ncl.ac.uk<mailto:Paolo.Missier@ncl.ac.uk>>
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> DM says:
>>>> 
>>>> 5.5.5 Literal
>>>> 
>>>> Literals represent data values such as particular string or integers.
>>>> 
>>>> My understanding is it's always been used in the standard grammar
>>>> production
>>>> meaning (eg: http://savage.net.au/SQL/sql-2003-2.bnf.html#literal). Not
>>>> so?
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> I think a clearer definition would be:
>>>> 
>>>> A Provenance Literal is a "leaf" value. It does not explicitly have
>>>> any outgoing relations (in SW-ish: Is not a subject of any statement)
>>>> in the PROV data model. Any outgoing relations from a Provenance
>>>> Literal is out of scope for the PROV DM.
>>>> 
>>>> Jim
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
> 
> 
> 
Received on Tuesday, 22 November 2011 17:42:34 UTC

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