- From: Laura Carlson <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com>
- Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2010 12:54:25 -0500
- To: Richard Schwerdtfeger <schwer@us.ibm.com>
- Cc: public-html-a11y@w3.org
Hi Rich, > Here is the IRC. log: Thank you very much. I linked it to the "Accessibility Task Force Minutes" Wiki Page http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Meetings/Minutes Best Regards, Laura On 8/16/10, Richard Schwerdtfeger <schwer@us.ibm.com> wrote: > > not sure how to do that once the minutes are posted. Here is the IRC. log: > > IRC log of html-a11y on 2010-08-05 > > > Timestamps are in UTC. > > > 14:58:58 [RRSAgent] > RRSAgent has joined #html-a11y > 14:58:58 [RRSAgent] > logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/08/05-html-a11y-irc > 14:59:14 [Stevef] > Stevef has joined #html-a11y > 14:59:36 [janina] > zakim, this will be WAI_PFWG(HTML > 14:59:36 [Zakim] > ok, janina, I see WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM already started > 14:59:44 [janina] > zakim, call janina > 14:59:44 [Zakim] > ok, janina; the call is being made > 14:59:46 [Zakim] > +Janina > 15:00:12 [Zakim] > +kliehm > 15:00:22 [Marco_Ranon] > Marco_Ranon has joined #html-a11y > 15:00:49 [Zakim] > +Michael_Cooper > 15:01:00 [Marco_Ranon] > hi all. I can't dial in. Zackim UK busy apparently... > 15:01:29 [MichaelC] > regrets: Steven_Faulkner, Denis_Boudreau, Laura_Carlson, > Gregory_Rosmaita > 15:01:37 [MichaelC] > agenda: > http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2010Aug/0001.html > 15:02:04 [Zakim] > +John_Foliot > 15:03:00 [JF] > JF has joined #html-a11y > 15:03:07 [Marco_Ranon] > I'll be on IRC. Thanks Janina. > 15:04:05 [Marco_Ranon] > Since Zakim UK is a bit temperamental, do you mind if we use Skype > and we dial in at 6 or 7 UTC? > 15:04:40 [Marco_Ranon] > I will need to run home just after the call but that's OK. > 15:05:11 [janina] > zakim, who's on the phone? > 15:05:11 [Zakim] > On the phone I see Eric, Janina, kliehm (muted), Michael_Cooper, > John_Foliot > 15:05:21 [Zakim] > +Marco_Ranon > 15:07:50 [Zakim] > +??P14 > 15:08:25 [richardschwerdtfe] > richardschwerdtfe has joined #html-a11y > 15:09:02 [Ben] > Ben has joined #html-a11y > 15:09:32 [Zakim] > +Rich > 15:09:50 [Zakim] > +??P15 > 15:10:04 [jongund] > jongund has joined #html-a11y > 15:10:06 [Ben] > zakim, ??P15 is Ben_Caldwell > 15:10:06 [Zakim] > +Ben_Caldwell; got it > 15:10:14 [richardschwerdtfe] > scribe: Rich > 15:10:40 [kliehm] > s/Since Zakim UK is a bit temperamental, do you mind if we use Skype > and we dial in at 6 or 7 UTC?// > 15:11:11 [Zakim] > +Cynthia_Shelly > 15:11:15 [richardschwerdtfe] > Topic: Actions Review > 15:11:23 [richardschwerdtfe] > janina: not a lot of people present > 15:11:47 [richardschwerdtfe] > janina: was there a media call yesterday > 15:12:19 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: just a formal discsussion on time stamp formats. > 15:12:39 [richardschwerdtfe] > Topic: Action 28 > 15:12:53 [richardschwerdtfe] > Action: 47 > 15:12:53 [trackbot] > Sorry, bad ACTION syntax > 15:13:00 [richardschwerdtfe] > Topic: Action 47 > 15:13:08 [richardschwerdtfe] > regrets from both Steve and Gregory > 15:13:34 [richardschwerdtfe] > Topic: Keyboard Access Requirements > 15:13:51 [gfreed] > gfreed has joined #html-a11y > 15:14:04 [richardschwerdtfe] > janina: We need UAAG to work with us on this. However, Gregory who is > out was supposed to spearhead that for us > 15:14:20 [richardschwerdtfe] > Topic: Drag and Drop > 15:14:50 [MichaelC] > rs: asked PaulC for IE engineers to work on drag 'n drop solution > 15:14:58 [MichaelC] > nothing back yet > 15:15:08 [MichaelC] > cs: has been asking around, just waiting on responses > 15:15:20 [richardschwerdtfe] > janina: without feedback we cannot move forward > 15:15:47 [richardschwerdtfe] > janina: as it sits drag and drop were modelled on mouse actions but > not in a device independent manor. So, we are on hold on this topic > 15:16:08 [MichaelC] > topic: Canvas subteam report > 15:16:27 [MichaelC] > rs: modified proposal to incorporate feedback from James Graham > 15:16:36 [MichaelC] > allow focus ring to use drawing path in canvas > 15:16:45 [MichaelC] > also adjusted caret tracking > 15:17:16 [MichaelC] > caret and focus need to be separate > 15:17:23 [MichaelC] > spent time with Ian on it > 15:17:32 [MichaelC] > he thinks it would be too complex > 15:17:41 [MichaelC] > but people who are working on accessibility will use that > 15:18:04 [MichaelC] > entered 2 bugs related to this > 15:18:16 [MichaelC] > no review yet on changes from James > 15:18:31 [MichaelC] > trying to make sure API would work > 15:18:39 [MichaelC] > tying to a drawing call is problematic > 15:18:49 [MichaelC] > not much more can do until hear back on reviews > 15:18:55 [MichaelC] > the drawing thing will be an issue > 15:19:06 [MichaelC] > next steps? > 15:19:21 [MichaelC] > don't expect a drawing thing soon > 15:19:31 [davidb] > db: (irc only) sorry i haven't been active on the canvas subteam > (blame priorities) > 15:19:34 [MichaelC] > don't expect support for a API specific to accessibility > 15:20:01 [Zakim] > +[Microsoft] > 15:20:11 [MichaelC] > js: it's not sufficient to have a canvas element that doesn't meet > accessibility > 15:20:17 [MichaelC] > we've created what we know meets the need > 15:20:28 [MichaelC] > so not up to us any more > 15:20:34 [paulc] > paulc has joined #html-a11y > 15:20:36 [MichaelC] > we can try to help them out > 15:20:49 [MichaelC] > zakim, Microsoft if Paul_Cotton > 15:20:49 [Zakim] > I don't understand 'Microsoft if Paul_Cotton', MichaelC > 15:20:53 [MichaelC] > zakim, Microsoft is Paul_Cotton > 15:20:53 [Zakim] > +Paul_Cotton; got it > 15:21:08 [paulc] > zakim, [Microsoft] has paulc > 15:21:08 [Zakim] > sorry, paulc, I do not recognize a party named '[Microsoft]' > 15:21:12 [MichaelC] > jg: no developers stepping up? > 15:21:36 [MichaelC] > does Microsoft natively support canvas, or translate to their own > language? > 15:21:40 [MichaelC] > pc: native support > 15:21:55 [MichaelC] > js: we seem to have an impasse > 15:22:12 [MichaelC] > we have an accessibility solution not widely supported > 15:22:40 [MichaelC] > not getting movement on finding a solution that meets everyone > 15:26:28 [MichaelC] > pc: suggest Janina and Paul discuss this issue at HTML chairs meeting > next Monday > 15:27:11 [MichaelC] > would be good to have a problem statement in advance for the people > not previously in the discussion > 15:27:28 [MichaelC] > js: asks Rich to prepare that > 15:28:21 [MichaelC] > pc: nobody understimates the amount of work that's been done > 15:28:28 [MichaelC] > very helpful to have clear statement of the logjam > 15:28:39 [MichaelC] > topic: ARIA mapping > 15:29:08 [MichaelC] > rs: had a call with Maciej last week > 15:29:17 [MichaelC] > wants us to break up change proposal into specific problem areas > 15:29:28 [MichaelC] > with the original content in section 3.2.6 > 15:29:34 [MichaelC] > didn't understand reason for all the changes > 15:30:05 [MichaelC] > there's a whole collection of discrete changes needed > 15:30:15 [MichaelC] > cs: Steve was going to do some changes > 15:30:25 [MichaelC] > not sure if it's to the change proposal or the substance > 15:30:41 [MichaelC] > rs: so moving along fairly well > 15:30:53 [MichaelC] > cs: we should have an ARIA mapping call next week > 15:32:09 [richardschwerdtfe] > Topic: Media > 15:32:30 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: we have are use cases and are working on technical requirements > 15:32:44 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: We are grappling with the time line issue > 15:33:12 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: What do we do when takes 10 seconds to describe a theme > 15:33:45 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: For SVG they went SMIL and made it native to SVG. That is being > investigated > 15:33:54 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: We are grappling with the larger isuue > 15:34:03 [richardschwerdtfe] > s/isuue/issue/ > 15:34:19 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: We want to defer the hard stuff until we get the easy stuff done. > 15:34:46 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: This is an incomplete solution > 15:35:51 [richardschwerdtfe] > Janina: if you assume all your media matches on the time line then > you can't deal with deviations. > 15:36:08 [richardschwerdtfe] > Janina: extended is just one case where the time lines might diverge > 15:36:32 [richardschwerdtfe] > Janina: Say you have a half hour video with a lot of dialog and you > want the video descriptions in the middle of it > 15:36:47 [richardschwerdtfe] > Janina: Do you want two downloads? > 15:37:21 [richardschwerdtfe] > cynthia: Is this a must have > 15:37:24 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: yes and no > 15:37:56 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: the concern is that if we don't figure out how to asynchronous > timing it will make it difficult to circle back and pick up the > straggling end. > 15:38:26 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: the other problem is that if we spend too much time other items > will suffer. we want implementers to try this out > 15:38:32 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: It is a big problem > 15:38:53 [richardschwerdtfe] > jongunderson: I noticed that each time a video format comes out we > have a new timed text format > 15:39:14 [richardschwerdtfe] > jongunderson: has a media developer ever adopted someone elses timed > text format? > 15:39:35 [richardschwerdtfe] > jongunderson: Industry does never use a single timed text format > 15:39:38 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: that is the problem > 15:39:50 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: we have SRT which is a stripped down file > 15:40:00 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: it is a simple text file > 15:40:25 [gfreed] > note that DFXP/TTML was supposed to solve the problem not having a > single timed-text format for everyone to use. > 15:40:27 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: some are looking to take this format and extend it > 15:41:06 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: there is also timed text format. this is in most of the flash > players today. TTML is an extremely large spec. It is overengineered > 15:41:15 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: there are issues with the styling of it > 15:41:28 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: It is an XML format. then there is the whole XML namespace > discussion > 15:42:20 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: Silvia Pfypher at mozilla is looking at WWML. The feedback is > that because it is XML based is a problem per HTML working group > members > 15:42:30 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: that is the impass > 15:42:49 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: Again, the asynchronous time line is going to be a vexing > problem. > 15:43:00 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: any solutions will be delayed > 15:43:45 [richardschwerdtfe] > jongunderson: my only comment is to try and figure out where you are > going to make progress. There does not seem to be any force out there > that is trying to make it better. The incentives are to do your own. > 15:44:01 [richardschwerdtfe] > jongunderson: the markup in html 5. is it easy to detect if captions > are added? > 15:44:21 [richardschwerdtfe] > jongunderson: my question is how to make captions for the file > 15:44:51 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: there is a proposal in the WhatWG spec for the track element > which would be a track of video > 15:45:06 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: each track would add markup for the video > 15:45:31 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: you would have tracks for different languages > 15:45:49 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: it has been on the whiteboard for a while but that seems to be > the general direction we are moving in > 15:45:56 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: there is no formal name for it > 15:46:17 [richardschwerdtfe] > janina: we would rather these be text files vs. binary so that we can > style them > 15:46:37 [richardschwerdtfe] > janina: for the majority of the time a supporting track could be a > video file with sign language signing > 15:47:20 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: we are agnostic as to what the support file in track would be. > You need a control time line. this would be the primary media asset > 15:47:30 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: this is the hardest piece to resolve > 15:47:40 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: can we advance this to the larger HTML working group > 15:47:52 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: we need to move on multiple fronts > 15:48:11 [richardschwerdtfe] > jongunderson: the timed text format thing is a tough one > 15:48:13 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: yes > 15:48:22 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: that is the hardest thing to resolve > 15:48:33 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: It may turn religious > 15:48:53 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: we want the user agent requirements to firmly laid out > 15:48:58 [Ben] > Ben has joined #html-a11y > 15:49:13 [gfreed] > will send a note to the list regarding the text format and possibly > aligning it with other formats that are being adopted. > 15:49:14 [richardschwerdtfe] > JF: it really is going to be the last thing to get resolved. there > are no easy answers > 15:49:30 [gfreed] > it will probably complicate the issue further. sorry... > 15:49:33 [JF] > thanks geoff > 15:50:05 [richardschwerdtfe] > michaelC: Marco and I will meet in a couple hours to see how we will > work > 15:50:15 [richardschwerdtfe] > michaelC: we will see if they are available > 15:50:32 [richardschwerdtfe] > michaelC: Laura will join us in a couple weeks > 15:50:59 [richardschwerdtfe] > michaelC: I am hoping it won't be a big time synch. Laura has been > submitting reviews for several months > 15:51:22 [richardschwerdtfe] > Janina: canvas question > 15:51:48 [richardschwerdtfe] > Janina: where are we via Charles' proposal? > 15:52:26 [MichaelC] > rs: The proposal submitted included an allotment for using an <area> > map > 15:52:31 [davidb] > s/Silvia Pfypher at mozilla/Silvia Pfeiffer, funded by mozilla, > 15:52:40 [MichaelC] > Charles is away; when he gets back I'll be gone > 15:53:05 [MichaelC] > but at least the space exists for him to plug his work in > 15:54:21 [Zakim] > -Paul_Cotton > 15:55:09 [richardschwerdtfe] > RRSAgent, make log member > 15:55:12 [Zakim] > -Jon_Gunderson > 15:55:21 [richardschwerdtfe] > RRSAgent: draft minutes > 15:55:21 [RRSAgent] > I have made the request to generate > http://www.w3.org/2010/08/05-html-a11y-minutes.html richardschwerdtfe > 15:55:57 [richardschwerdtfe] > Zakim: bye > 15:56:06 [richardschwerdtfe] > Zakim bye > 15:56:20 [Zakim] > -Cynthia_Shelly > 15:56:22 [Zakim] > -Rich > 15:56:23 [Zakim] > -Janina > 15:56:23 [Zakim] > -Eric > 15:56:24 [Zakim] > -Ben_Caldwell > 15:56:24 [Zakim] > -Michael_Cooper > 15:56:25 [Zakim] > -kliehm > 15:56:26 [Zakim] > -John_Foliot > 15:56:30 [Zakim] > -Marco_Ranon > 15:56:31 [Zakim] > WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM has ended > 15:56:33 [Zakim] > Attendees were Eric, Janina, kliehm, Michael_Cooper, John_Foliot, > Marco_Ranon, Jon_Gunderson, Rich, Ben_Caldwell, Cynthia_Shelly, > Paul_Cotton > 15:56:49 [richardschwerdtfe] > RRSAgent, draft minutes > 15:56:49 [RRSAgent] > I have made the request to generate > http://www.w3.org/2010/08/05-html-a11y-minutes.html richardschwerdtfe > 15:58:01 [Ben] > Ben has left #html-a11y > 15:58:11 [janina] > janina has left #html-a11y > 16:21:42 [gfreed] > gfreed has left #html-a11y > 16:32:06 [eric_carlson] > eric_carlson has left #html-a11y > 16:35:45 [richardschwerdtfe] > richardschwerdtfe has left #html-a11y > 17:31:06 [Zakim] > Zakim has left #html-a11y > > Rich Schwerdtfeger > CTO Accessibility Software Group > > > > From: Laura Carlson <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com> > To: Richard Schwerdtfeger/Austin/IBM@IBMUS, public-html-a11y@w3.org > Date: 08/08/2010 07:47 AM > Subject: Re: Minutes: August 5, 2010 HTML Accessibility Task Force > Sent by: public-html-a11y-request@w3.org > > > > I can't access the minutes. I'm getting a "Sorry, Password Required". > > Could the minutes please be made public viewable? > > Thanks. > > Best Regards, > Laura > > On 8/5/10, Richard Schwerdtfeger <schwer@us.ibm.com> wrote: >> >> Minutes: August 5, 2010 HTML Accessibility Task Force: >> >> http://www.w3.org/2010/08/05-html-a11y-minutes.html >> >> Rich Schwerdtfeger >> CTO Accessibility Software Group > > > -- > Laura L. Carlson > > -- Laura L. Carlson
Received on Monday, 16 August 2010 17:54:58 UTC