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Re: Conclusion to effects of readonly on trigger

From: Erik Bruchez <ebruchez@orbeon.com>
Date: Thu, 03 May 2007 12:25:47 +0800
Message-ID: <4639644B.9060102@orbeon.com>
To: public-forms@w3.org

If John is talking about the *default* "countenance" only, then I think 
that still leaves open the possibility to change that appearance, right?


Klotz, Leigh wrote:
> John,
> Here's my opinions on this summary:
> I think the key thing we came up with was that, unlike the recent notice 
> that disabled form controls don't receive events, we are *not* going to 
> say that about trigger bound to readonly node. That appears to be point 
> 1.  We also decided that readonly has no effect on trigger's behavior in 
> other unspecified ways, so that's point 2a.
> As for point 2b, Im not sure a "countenance".  If it means style, and 
> the host language supports some styling mechanism such as CSS, an author 
> (or user agent default) can certainly style it however desired.  Our 
> informative CSS3 style sheet does show anything for xf|trigger:readonly 
> but I don't see how we can proscribe it.  (I think Mark Birbeck made the 
> argument that we should avoid saying anything about presentation here, 
> but maybe I'm confused.) 
> I'd be happier to see these two responses split up:
> - Put (1) and (2a) in the spec document as an inforamative note.
> - The body of (2) remains where it is (the minutes, this discussion) but 
> not in the spec document.
> - Change 2b to an email response and say we aren't putting anything in 
> our informative CSS style sheet section for xf|trigger:readonly.
> I suspect that some implementations might use XBL or some other 
> customization mechanism to take advantage of the readonly MIP or the 
> :disabled CSS pseudo-property to affect behavior, and again, while we 
> might think it's unclean to do so, we can't really prohibit it; at the 
> same time, we have recognized the request already for extensible MIPs 
> for use in styling and XBL binding, so I don't think we need to act 
> further on this for XForms 1.1.  In other words, those who have XBL or 
> their own extension mechanism are allowed to warp trigger:disabled 
> behavior and style, but should know that it's not the path going 
> forward, and they probably want to pay attention XForms futures for 
> extensible MIPs.
> How does this all sound?
> Leigh.
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* public-forms-request@w3.org [mailto:public-forms-request@w3.org] 
> *On Behalf Of *John Boyer
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 02, 2007 12:53 PM
> *To:* public-forms@w3.org
> *Subject:* Conclusion to effects of readonly on trigger
> I think we were pretty close to a conclusion on the telecon about the 
> interpretation of the readonly MIP for trigger.
> Whatever the decision, it seems worthwhile make note of it in the spec 
> given that we had some work to do getting through the points ourselves.
> Let's see if we can get this wrapped up on the list during the week 
> and/or get a clear statement of resolution that folks can vote on next 
> week if necessary.
> Here is what I understood from the discussion:
> 1) Like all other events for MIPs, the xforms-readonly and 
> xforms-readwrite events are received by a trigger bound to a node (when 
> the processing model says those events are to be dispatched, of course).
> 2) The readonly MIP is a statement about the what can happen to the data 
> node.  Since a trigger does not directly manipulate the data node via 
>  its UI binding, there is no direct relationship between the data node 
> being readonly and presentational properties of the trigger.  Specifically,
> a) The ability to activate a trigger is not disabled if the trigger is 
> bound to a readonly node
> b) The default countenance of the trigger is unaffected, i.e. it does 
> not take on a disabled countenance
> Cheers,
> John M. Boyer, Ph.D.
> STSM: Lotus Forms Architect and Researcher
> Chair, W3C Forms Working Group
> Workplace, Portal and Collaboration Software
> IBM Victoria Software Lab
> E-Mail: boyerj@ca.ibm.com  
> Blog: http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/blogs/page/JohnBoyer

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Received on Thursday, 3 May 2007 04:25:55 UTC

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