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[MINUTES] CCG VC-EDU Task Force 2021-11-01

From: Kerri Lemoie <klemoie@concentricsky.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Nov 2021 17:48:06 -0400
Message-Id: <29CD8B0C-71C9-4EBE-87A6-177027C687BD@concentricsky.com>
To: public-vc-edu@w3.org, Credentials Community Group <public-credentials@w3.org>
Thanks to John Kuo for scribing this week! The minutes
for this week's CCG Verifiable Credentials for Education Task Force telecon are now available:

https://w3c-ccg.github.io/meetings/2021-11-01-vc-education 

Full text of the discussion follows for W3C archival purposes.
Audio from the meeting is available as well (link provided below).

----------------------------------------------------------------
CCG Verifiable Credentials for Education Task Force Telecon Minutes for 2021-11-01

Agenda:
  https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-credentials/2021Oct/0091.html
Topics:
  1. IP Note
  2. Scribe Selection
  3. Introductions & Reintroductions
  4. Announcements & Reminders
  5. Co-chairs election begins - review of nomination and voting 
    procedures.
  6. Review Use Cases - Two from Matt Lisle
Organizer:
  Kerri Lemoie
Scribe:
   john_kuo
Present:
  Kerri Lemoie, Hakan Yildirim, Matt Lisle, Dmitri Zagidulin, 
  Stuart Freeman, John Kuo, Kayode Ezike, Nate Otto, Phil Barker, 
  David Ward, Simone Ravaoli, Juan Caballero

Audio:
  https://w3c-ccg.github.io/meetings/2021-11-01/audio.ogg


Topic: IP Note

Kerri Lemoie: https://www.w3.org/community/credentials/join
Kerri Lemoie: https://www.w3.org/accounts/request
Kerri Lemoie: https://www.w3.org/community/about/agreements/cla/
<john_kuo> OK
Kerri Lemoie:  Asked John to be the scribe and typing up how to 
  do it here [scribe assist by Kerri Lemoie]
Kerri Lemoie:  IRC commands: 
  https://w3c-ccg.github.io/irc_ref.html [scribe assist by Kerri 
  Lemoie]

Topic: Scribe Selection

 john_kuo is scribing.
<john_kuo> There are guidelines with tips
John Kuo: :+1:

Topic: Introductions & Reintroductions

<john_kuo> Introductions...
<john_kuo> Hakan Yildrim new
<john_kuo> PhD student in Turkey, visiting scholar at Purdue
<john_kuo> Working on blockchain in education, happy to be here
<kayode_ezike> Welcome Hakan!

Topic: Announcements & Reminders

Kerri Lemoie:  Announcements and reminders [scribe assist by John 
  Kuo]
Kerri Lemoie: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-vc-edu/
Kerri Lemoie: 
  https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-credentials/2021Oct/0092.html
<john_kuo> Tomorrow CCG call will have state senator sharing 
  Wyomings initiative
Kerri Lemoie: 
  https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-credentials/2021Nov/0000.html
Kerri Lemoie: https://www.evernym.com/dids-webinar/
<john_kuo> Drummond Reed from Evernym

Topic: Co-chairs election begins - review of nomination and voting procedures.

<john_kuo> First agenda item:  VC edu co-chair election, two open 
  slots
<kerri_lemoie> Co-chair description 
  https://docs.google.com/document/d/11I96C6QMzx9Yv0mvM3hAnc3jB5ER69qmzQTeY1a8M8s/edit
<john_kuo> Kerri- finds it fulfilling, always know what's going 
  on, as co-chair you are at the center
<john_kuo> Hard for one person, better to distribute 
  responsibilities
<kerri_lemoie> public-vc-edu@w3.org
<john_kuo> Two week nomination, self nomination via email
<john_kuo> Send it why you are interested
<john_kuo> If more than two will hold a vote
Kerri Lemoie: https://www.opavote.com
<john_kuo> Will be ranked choice
<john_kuo> Monday 11/15 statements and questions
<john_kuo> Or if just two will be introductions
<john_kuo> 11/21 voting deadline
<john_kuo> 11/22 results
<john_kuo> Use Cases:
Kerri Lemoie:   Working to populate: [scribe assist by John Kuo]
<kerri_lemoie> VC-EDU use case doc: 
  https://w3c-ccg.github.io/vc-ed-use-cases/
<kerri_lemoie> Google doc: 
  https://docs.google.com/document/d/1O98lt85PS8ozyMtKQMPdZPLnzpNI30bEgYH1Dq-C-IQ/edit?usp=sharing
<john_kuo> Started google to work directly avoid GitHub etc. for 
  now
<john_kuo> Will begin reviewing and populating
<john_kuo> Review existing use cases and align with template
<john_kuo> Please write your own
<john_kuo> Just use template
<kerri_lemoie> Use case template: 
  https://docs.google.com/document/d/1QcPTXUuhcJdQFPcj0F31MVg8QTGtOsSx93E7D6L4ZSI/edit

Topic: Review Use Cases - Two from Matt Lisle

<john_kuo> Matt Lyle from Georgia tech has two use cases
<john_kuo> Matt share screen
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> one of the counterintuitive bits about 
  jitsi UX
<kerri_lemoie> Professional Education:  
  https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Sr4FGsv6gpViu0i5a9hduNpdXz2z9KND5MWtGoAma6s/edit
<john_kuo> First use case GT professional education
<john_kuo> E.g. continuing education
<john_kuo> Jane is employee at company looking for promotion via 
  GT
<john_kuo> Wants to earn GT PE certificate, 4 course 1 day in 
  person course, at end you get a certificate
<john_kuo> Slight wrinkle: Jane would like cumulative and also 
  for each course, Jane wants printable certificate
<john_kuo> Companies want printable certificate
<john_kuo> Copied from existing use cases, OB, DIF, CLR etc.
<john_kuo> DID web,OIDC
John Kuo: Tech:  LMS of GTP and SIS,. Canvas and Genius, GT 
  Authentication, Wallet, talent  system
John Kuo: Goal: advance career
<john_kuo> Actors, Jane, GTPE, employer
John Kuo: Preconditions: Janes needs wallet... ?
<john_kuo> Have Grad student doing UX research, how important is 
  a wallet long term...
<john_kuo> GTPE needs to issue and print, local company needs 
  verification and ingest
John Kuo: Flow: current, local company doesn't use VCs
<john_kuo> Separate one for when they can
<john_kuo> - Completes course in LMS
<john_kuo> - LMS issues / claim course
<john_kuo> - Jane gets credential
<john_kuo> Repeat
<john_kuo> For 4 credentials
<john_kuo> SIS issues certificate
<john_kuo> Gets in wallet and printable certificate
<john_kuo> Has a unique serial number
<john_kuo> Jane presents certificate, gets recorded in HR system
<john_kuo> Jane has all 5 digital certificates
<john_kuo> Long term: local company can recognize VCs
<john_kuo> Jane can just share VCs
<john_kuo> When there is a framework Jane can be recognized as 
  candidate
Kerri Lemoie:   This is just digital? [scribe assist by John Kuo]
<john_kuo> Second case version is digital VC sharing only
Kerri Lemoie:  Is unique ID tied to certificate? [scribe assist 
  by John Kuo]
<john_kuo> How is serial number used?
<john_kuo> Interesting to note
John Kuo:  ASU has a use case for having an external id and an 
  attachment for paper or paper-like. [scribe assist by Kerri 
  Lemoie]
John Kuo:  External id maps to external system that's not a VC 
  [scribe assist by Kerri Lemoie]
John Kuo:  Then build a connector to the VC. Pocket is a wallet 
  that stores schemas and instances of VCs. [scribe assist by Kerri 
  Lemoie]
John Kuo:   Needs external ID and attachment, great use case 
  [scribe assist by John Kuo]
John Kuo: Add: this version doesn't need printable?
<john_kuo> In second use case set maybe still need printable
John Kuo:  Other use case - a vc with a corresponding child 
  collection. Issue a credential that includes the child 
  credentials based on business rules that help trigger that 
  credential. [scribe assist by Kerri Lemoie]
John Kuo:  For instance four courses & course completion. Done 
  for transcript processing purposes. [scribe assist by Kerri 
  Lemoie]
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> `evidence`?
John Kuo:  Context needed. [scribe assist by Kerri Lemoie]
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> yeah, i agree
<kerri_lemoie> ack?
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> mind-reading!
<kerri_lemoie> :)
John Kuo: Dmitri>: use cases for relationships
<kerri_lemoie> The CLR has a way to make these relationships
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> i'm not sure it's appropriate here but 
  there is this spec in TOIP land for chaining VCs: 
  https://wiki.trustoverip.org/display/HOME/ACDC+%28Authentic+Chained+Data+Container%29+Task+Force
John Kuo:   Yes, it is an issue for VCs.  Pocket is using JSON-LD 
  and data models [scribe assist by John Kuo]
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> Pocket?
Dmitri Zagidulin:   Hash links [scribe assist by John Kuo]
John Kuo: https://pocket.asu.edu/
<john_kuo> Will be presenting to CCG
Juan Caballero:  Chain of VCs / web of trust [scribe assist by 
  John Kuo]
John Kuo:   This is lineage but not collection? [scribe assist by 
  John Kuo]
<kerri_lemoie> Not Kerri-sphere :)
Juan Caballero:  May not map neatly to DIDs and VCs [scribe 
  assist by John Kuo]
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> Kerri is NOT the empress of the 
  KeRisphere
<kerri_lemoie> Not yet!
Matt Lisle:  One note, these are not just 4 courses necessarily 
  but could be 4 modules [scribe assist by John Kuo]
John Kuo: Success:
<john_kuo> -Jane has agency
<john_kuo> -Company has access to Jane's data
<john_kuo> Jane can become a candidate more readily
John Kuo: Failure:
<john_kuo> -GT can't issue
<john_kuo> -Company can't verify
<john_kuo> Jane has not printed copy
Kerri Lemoie:   Any companies interested? [scribe assist by John 
  Kuo]
Matt Lisle:  Companies setting these requests all the time 
  [scribe assist by John Kuo]
Kerri Lemoie:   Phil Long suggest employer flows [scribe assist 
  by John Kuo]
John Kuo: Barrier:  who will build?
Kerri Lemoie:  We need more 3rd party and verifier stories 
  [scribe assist by John Kuo]
John Kuo:  Pocket working AZ Next - how to get in touch with 
  organizations partnered with AZ Next. They don't want additional 
  requirements. Probably will be a time before these orgs accept 
  VCs. May take some time for this. Growing awareness fo benefits. 
  [scribe assist by Kerri Lemoie]
Matt Lisle:  Seconds that, thinks companies are interested but 
  not ready so much, they see it more as a retention [scribe assist 
  by John Kuo]
John Kuo: Kerr: that does make sense
John Kuo:  The companies are two busy [scribe assist by John Kuo]
Kerri Lemoie:  Benefits don't outweigh cost [scribe assist by 
  John Kuo]
<kerri_lemoie> Access to campus Makerspaces: 
  https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Q3Vl_IjCkKorKl4kb_Qw_RD4E2Bwe3W42Lq2k6Xf1oc/edit
Matt Lisle:  Second use case [scribe assist by John Kuo]
<john_kuo> Maker Spaces
<john_kuo> Could do general training, get a credential, can 
  access maker spaces
John Kuo: Wrinkle: Different levels of access...
<john_kuo> General access isn't enough, need levels of access
John Kuo: Standards: same as before, OB, VCs. DIDs, OIDC
John Kuo: Tech: Authentication, scanners, wallet
John Kuo: Goal:  Jessica wants access to maker spaces
<john_kuo> Also make spaces outside of GT
John Kuo: Actor:  Jessica, Maker employees
John Kuo: Conditions:  has wallet on smartphone
<john_kuo> College has method to issue VCs and has hardware to 
  present VCs
John Kuo: Flow:
<john_kuo> - Jessica completes LMS course
<john_kuo> - Gets VC from LMS adds to wallet
<john_kuo> - Select credential, presents QR code
<john_kuo> May not be enough has to log in
<john_kuo> Gets access to limited stuff
John Kuo: Success:
<john_kuo> - one credential gains access to all
<john_kuo> Automated access
John Kuo: Failure:
<john_kuo> Someone else gets phone access
<john_kuo> Jessica can access equipment not qualified for
Kerri Lemoie:  Great use case [scribe assist by John Kuo]
<john_kuo> Similar use case for first responders
<john_kuo> Emergency situations, issuing badges
<john_kuo> Was hardened for security
<juan_caballero_(spruce)> Venn Agency in LA/BC was working on 
  something similar, i can't remember if VC-based or badge-based
John Kuo:  Adding biometrics to Pocket [scribe assist by Kerri 
  Lemoie]
Matt Lisle:  Mentioned we have a UX research student, she 
  questioned the focus on wallet [scribe assist by John Kuo]
<john_kuo> If she completes training, should be on record
<john_kuo> Swipes ID card instead
John Kuo:  Wallet replaces ID card, or vice versa? (Kerri) 
  [scribe assist by John Kuo]
Matt Lisle:  Near term first tab [scribe assist by John Kuo]
<john_kuo> Use case link:
Matt Lisle: 
  https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Bz-lKhvBmWyP8t8hC0m47Y54_IOGuIsSOE4Rjsq4e1A/edit?usp=sharing
Kerri Lemoie:   Need to talk about governance [scribe assist by 
  John Kuo]
<john_kuo> Lots of controversy, will need to talk about it, get 
  into use cases
Kerri Lemoie:  Anything else?  Thanks Matt! [scribe assist by 
  John Kuo]
<kayode_ezike> Thanks Matt!
<nate_otto_(badgr/csky)> Cheers! :+1:
Received on Monday, 1 November 2021 21:48:21 UTC

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