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MINUTES: W3C User Agent Telecon 26 April 2001

From: Jon Gunderson <jongund@uiuc.edu>
Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2001 08:23:28 -0500
Message-Id: <>
To: w3c-wai-ua@w3.org

Chair:Jon Gunderson

Scribe: Jim Allan

Mickey Quenzer
Tim Lacy
David Poehlman
Eric Hansen
Gregory Rosmatia

Ian Jacobs
Charles McCathieNevile

Action Item Summary

Open Action Items

    1.IJ: Edit the text of checkpoints 2.1, 2.2, 8.1, and 8.2 so that UAs 
are not required to conform for all formats that are implemented.
      Source: Minutes 19 April 2001 Teleconference
    2.IJ: Make mention of animations, text streams, and refresh in the 
      Source: Minutes 19 April 2001 Teleconference
    3.IJ: Coordinate usability testing of the guidelines (JRG volunteers to 
be one of the testers).
      Source: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2001JanMar/0137
    4.CMN: Find out from SYMM WG whether repositioning of objects will 
appear in the spec (or should be in UAAG).
      Source: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2001JanMar/0357
    5.RS: Send pointer to information about universal access gateway to the 
      Source: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2001JanMar/0258
    6.GR: Review event checkpoints for techniques
    7.MQ: Review speech checkpoints

New Action Items

    1.JA: test object in opera
    2.DP: support for no-script HPR
    3.GR: support for no-script lynx longdesc - webspeak, HPR
    4.JG: check with opera how they comply with 2.4
    5.GR: write different markup (list of elements) that 2.9 applies to, 
for clarification.

Completed Action Items

    1.DP: Review navigation checkpoints for techniques
    2.TL: CSS 1 compliance of IE
      IE XP will when rendering HTML strict documents


JG: want to document implementation plans for most recent draft

JA: have developed a table for input of implementation reviews, inputting 
Opera information

JG: want documentation. going through checkpoints.

MQ for speech implementation, I was looking at HPR. Is IBM reviewing their 

JG: need to look for techniques

MQ ok will do it

1.1 Ensure that the user can operate the user agent fully throughkeyboard 
input alone. [Priority 1] Bothcontent and
user agent.

JG: cp 1.1 - any browser for all functionalities through keyboard

TL: IE yes except text selection.

JG: IE plus assistive tech will do text selection. send details to the list

1.2 For the element with content focus, allow the user to activateany 
explicitly associated input device event handlers
through keyboard input alone. [Priority 1] Content only.

JG: cp 1.2 - event handlers that can be activated through keyboard in 
win2000 with IE and narrator - have mouse in mouse out, combine with mouse
keys for clicking (a possible solution) accessible browser project- 
navigate to event handlers, get a list and activate event (UIUC accessible 

1.3 Ensure that every message (e.g., prompt, alert, notification, etc.) 
that is a non-textelement and is part of the user
agent user interface has a textequivalent. [Priority 1] Useragent only.

JG: cp 1.3

TL: IE - yes. media player ??, they are improving

2.1 For all format specificationsthat the user agent implements, make 
contentavailable through the rendering
processes described by those specifications.[Priority 1] Content only.

JG: cp 2.1 use rendering in specs. html 4 is weak

GR: opera follows html spec for no script and error recovery. if script 
does not execute then display "no script". broken script, turn scripts off,

JG: this is a difficult checkpoint. question - abbreviation or acronym. 
html doesn't say what to do with it. Keep in DOM

GR: yes, in DOM, then UA or at can

GR:ab it.

JG: what about longdesc.

GR: will look into it.

TL: 2.1 reviewing list. IE, first DOM will reflect what is authored, will 
hand off non-native to plugin, will do html, xml, most of the text stuff. 
IE does not
support longdesc. planning for next version. trying to

MQ webspeak would follow longdesc and open an new browser instance. needed 

JG: only thing html 4.0 spec says. accessing longdesc must be different 
from accessing href

GR: HPR supports longdesc. treats it like an href. alerts user for activation.

TL: parts of html 4 that are not implemented. support html 3.2 and css1 and 
parts of dom.

JG: anticipate DOM for

JA:va script - text note

TL: don't know

JG: any browser html 4 compliant

JA: Netscape 6 ???

Action TL: css 1 compliance of IE

JG: some will change as html and css are modularized. don't know how this 
will affect checkpoints and compliance. xhtml basic.

JG: need to know about html version compliance for browsers.

JG: is realmedia SMIL 1 compliant.

GR: what about lpplayer,

JA: supports SMIL as far

check with issound for SMIL compliance -


2.2 For all text formats that the useragent implements, provide a view of 
the text source. Text formats include at least
the following: (1) allmedia objects given an Internet media type of "text" 
(e.g., text/plain,text/HTML, or text/*), and
(2) all SGML and XML applications, regardless ofInternet media type (e.g., 
HTML 4.01, XHTML 1.1, SMIL, SVG,

JG: 2.2 view of text source. - yes for nearly all

2.3Allow globalconfiguration so that, for each piece of unrendered 
conditional content "C", the user agent alerts the
user to the existence of the contentand provides access to it

JG: 2.3 global configuration content access, conditional content

JG: what about object

GR: Netscape 6 has some support, if you use map to render text it renders 

JG: 4.75 will render it.

GR: testing pages for guidelines


JG: may have use ulist and div

MQ webspeak may do this, list items, no script, no frames, alt

JG: display alt, alternative content in object and image, captions, no 
script, no frames,

JA: no switch for captions in smile

JG: opera - no script, no frames (if no frame information included, will 
not generate a plac

EHolder - no repair strategy), image, no longdesc.

JG: - alt for image, ti

TL:e through tool tip. no frames.

TL: don't know if IE will display no script.

GR: no frame only to be rendered if non support for frames (quotes from spec)

JA: IE seems to work, Netscape

action JA: test object in opera

GR: iframe should be included. did pages for testing that are archived 
somewhere. wai/gl/test has test pages for browsers, assistive tech, user
expectations, functionalities. access key test pages, div etc.

JG: may frame, iframe, longdesc, alt, no-script, object, no-frames no frame 
- opera and lynx object - Netscape no-script - lynx, opera,

action DP: support for no-script HPR

action GR: support for no-script lynx longdesc - webspeak, HPR

2.4 For content where user input is only possiblewithin a finite time 
interval controlled by the user agent, allow
configuration to make the time interval "infinite". Do this bypausing 
automatically at the end of each time interval
where user input ispossible, and resuming automatically after the user has 
explicitly completedinput. In this
configuration, alert the user when the session has been pausedand which 
enabledelements are time-sensitive.

JG: 2.4 pausing

JA: opera says they do

JG: how

JA: don't know.

action JG: check with opera how they comply with 2.4

2.5 Allow configuration or control sothat texttranscripts, collated text 
transcripts, captions,and auditory descriptions
are rendered at the same time as the associated audiotracks and visualtracks

JG: 2.5 caption. configuration of caption real does - has a switch window 
media does quick time does, using pro version can turn on-off captions (by
deleting captions?)

EH don't know of any. magpie is a creation engine. there is information 
that serves role of transcript, but the player does not know what it is.

2.6 Respect synchronization cuesduring rendering.

JG: 2.6 synchronization real yes windows media yes

2.7 Allow configuration to generate repair text when the user agent 
recognizes that the author has failed to provide
conditional content that was required by the format specification.The user 
agent may satisfy this checkpoint by
basing the repair text on any ofthe following available sources of 
information: URI reference, content type, orelement

JG: 2.7 repair text - alt text, does anyone generate IE if no alt then IE 
show href lynx - file name, nothing, or place holder text IE with

JA:ws - similar to lynx, configurable (

GR: may revise previous posting about JFW configuration)

2.8 Allow configuration so that when the user agent recognizes that 
conditional content required by the format
specification is present but empty (e.g., the empty string), the user 
agenteither (1) generates no repairtext, or (2)
generates repair text as described in checkpoint 2.7.

MQ HPR does something. 2.8 configuration - generate repair text - if alt 
null IE render plac

2.9 Allow configuration to render all conditional content automatically. 
Provide access to this contentaccording to
format specifications or where unspecified, by applying one of thefollowing 
techniques described in checkpoint 2.3:
1a, 2a, or 1b

EH: older or not. IE with JFW - JFW says nothing, can configure to speak 
images without alt. 2.9 configure - render all conditional content. ???
discussion about what checkpoint means. about SMIL and language tracks.

EH in previous version of documents, automating pulling up of content out 
of context.

GR: if no frame has longdesc, provide some step through functionality. more 
for querying to ask for selected items from a list of alternative 
information to

JA: selecting caption and language tracks from a movie with 3 languages of 

GR: in cases where you need to generate repair text, it is a way to find 
repair text.

JG: someone want to write technique

action GR: write different markup (list of elements) that 2.9 applies to, 
for clarification.

2.10 Allow configuration not to render content in unsupported 
naturallanguages. Indicate to the user in context that
author-suppliedcontent has not been rendered.

JA: I am confused 2.10 configuration to not render content and inform user. 
if you don't support a font for a language, browser would not render
language but render place holder. IE prompt to get different language, or 
auto download, or do nothing,

GR: technique-need demarcation for unrendered text should be in same 
character set declared for page.

TL: css conformance for windows xp, if strict mode declared, then css1 

JG: organize a face to face in July or later, topic--conformance test 
suites for developers, purpose for f2f try to bring in developers to 
develop test suites
and recruiting. at this point in guidelines need to not change text but get 
implementation (must be satisfied by 2 independent implementations). need this
to move to candidate recommendation. not sure where yet.

GR: sent uri for test documents. there is dom-ts@w3.org list. see W3 QA 
(quality assurance) for more info. working on gl pages with UA in mind.

JG: AOL working with Henter-Joyce, need to develop special api and 
accessibility api because they do not meet their needs.

TL: do not know about this. am very interested.

JG: messaged Scott Totman (?) about this. may have both ST and

TL: on call in two weeks to discuss.

DP: adobe and AOL using MSAA and inte

GR:ating it in their suites.

TL: working with adobe to get MSAA on track.

JG: AOL ask for relief from using standard API. concerned about proprietary 
API for assistive technology. want developer and at people to use

TL: IE 6 has beefed up DOM and MSAA support, round tripping to find either 
place. closing hole as we find them.

GR: lynx supports no-script renders it inline.

Copyright    2001 W3C (MIT, INRIA, Keio ), All Rights Reserved. W3C 
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Jon Gunderson, Ph.D., ATP
Coordinator of Assistive Communication and Information Technology
Division of Rehabilitation - Education Services
College of Applied Life Studies
University of Illinois at Urbana/Champaign
1207 S. Oak Street, Champaign, IL  61820

Voice: (217) 244-5870
Fax: (217) 333-0248

E-mail: jongund@uiuc.edu

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WWW: http://www.w3.org/wai/ua
Received on Friday, 27 April 2001 09:23:15 UTC

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