Re: User testing for semantic applicatons

Thanks Jonathan

>>5've been pressing the W3C management to include naive users in the 
>>specification process. which is another alternative..

definitely, as well as include them in the testing etc
, I take you are working the in the Semantic Web Usability Standards team 

Thing is, I am not that 'naive' at all, I am system engineer analysing and 
designing  rather advanced architectures
 Just have never managed to get a semantic web application to work the way I 
expect it to.
And I cannot be sure if the problem is with me. (obviously feeling terribly 
 or if  there some other problem along the line (until I see TBL not being 
too sure either, then I feel OK again)

I understand. these good semdevs are trying to get up some core 
functionality and they seem to communicate with each other nonetheless, but 
yes, whatever is that is happening,  will have to be made intuitive and user 
friendly sooner or later, better sooner perhaps so maybe we can help and 
speed up the debugging too

look forward!



Jonathan Chetwynd
Accessibility Consultant on Media Literacy and the Internet

On 7 Nov 2007, at 13:56, <> wrote:

Thanks Emmanuelle

for understanding and supporting the point

I know that some  may not see  the need to comply with WCAG  for applications that are supposed to
be used by machines,
But these parsers and reasoners need to be written, developed,
bought, designed, maintained, manged, budgeted for, operated by
(intelligent?) humans (until we can replace those too) - these humans
are likely to managing offline processes now, and I am not surprised
the semantic web looks like its still distant to them - as well as to
anyone else who is not writing semantic apps

  'Semantic usability testing' is currently being done by the same geeks
who develop the semantic things that nobody else can understand. A
user group should be diverse
and respond to a plural list of user profiles, especially if they are
technology savy in other areas of IT, and still cant make sense of
the think, or must struggle too hard to work it out, or dont have
that kind of time right now

I think there is scope for a web service to collect user feedback
from all the semantic web applications and store it in an online
repository for analysis and consideration and to help develop  a
repository for training materials and usability guidelines for
semantic web applications .Should not be difficult to do,Emmanuelle,
let me know if you want to start working together on this idea, we
can propose a workgroup (or start a user led protest)

Look forward to be testing intuitive semantic applications, at your
convenience folks

Paola Di Maio (PDM)

----- Original Message -----
From: Emmanuelle Gutiérrez y Restrepo
To: ; 'SW-forum Web'
Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 7:27 PM
Subject: RE: User testing for semantic applicatons

Hi "PDM",

I agree with you. There are a lot of work around the "semantic web"
and maybe is a good work for the "machines". But I can't understand
why the people working on it don't care about accessibility. The
semantic web is nothing if can't be useful for the humans.

Accessibility means usability for all. So, I think that complain with
the WCAG must be *prerequisite* for each semantic web application.

Best regards,
Emmanuelle Gutiérrez y Restrepo         Fundación Sidar
Coordinadora del SIDAR        
Tel.: +34 - 91 725 71 47

De: []
En nombre de
Enviado el: miércoles, 07 de noviembre de 2007 11:40
Para: SW-forum Web
Asunto: User testing for semantic applicatons

I must say something
There are a lot of cool applications coming up, I try most of them ,
but they are new
I am not sure what to expect exactly. What should it do? How do I
know if there is an error, or if this is really the way
it should look? Little documentation, usability almost not taken into
account etc.
Also I dont have all day, just a few minutes, a few clicks, then I
lose interest, must move on

Now, the linked data below is quite straighforward intuitive
interface (not bad in fact) although a few more explanations and how
to's would be good. I also got an error when I tried it (different
from the error below) not sure what to do next

All this to suggest  a forum is created to handle usability of
semantic applications, where we 'users' can
report our experiences and get some help in running/understanding the
stuffs. I have a lot of feedback and user tests already running on
semantic applications, may be most productive if handled collectively
and shared, rather than just sent to the developers who are likely
not to understand my problem anyway (we seem to speak different


----- Original Message -----
From: Tim Berners-Lee
To: Hugh Glaser
Cc: Linking Open Data ; SW-forum Web ; Ian Millard
Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 11:15 AM
Subject: Re: Linked Data available

Umm ,,, in
person-6092a2a72319fc9437583fb2d04733ea I get

Request for
person-6092a2a72319fc9437583fb2d04733eaabout under the hood
Label Request for
Status 200
StatusText OK
Accept-ranges bytes
Connection close
Content-length 2005
Content type       text/xml
Date Wed, 07 Nov 2007 00:27:37 GMT
Etag "7785ba-7d5-43e4bd0f48e00"
Last-modified Wed, 07 Nov 2007 00:27:36 GMT
Server Apache/2.0.52 (Red Hat)
Handler opt off

Something funny about the XML:  Line 2: doctype broken.  Shoud not be
a doctype.

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
         <!ENTITY rdf ''>
         <!ENTITY rdfs ''>
         <!ENTITY owl ''>
         <!ENTITY akt ''>
         <!ENTITY akts ''>
         <!ENTITY extn ''>
         <!ENTITY wiki ''>
         <!ENTITY resist '
         <!ENTITY resex '
         <!ENTITY courseware '
         <!ENTITY dc ''>
         <!ENTITY dct ''>
         <owl:Ontology rdf:about="">


Received on Wednesday, 7 November 2007 14:43:23 UTC