W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > whatwg@whatwg.org > April 2014

Re: [whatwg] summary/details - proposal

From: Ian Hickson <ian@hixie.ch>
Date: Mon, 7 Apr 2014 19:06:15 +0000 (UTC)
To: Steve Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.00.1404071857200.21310@ps20323.dreamhostps.com>
Cc: whatwg <whatwg@lists.whatwg.org>
On Mon, 7 Apr 2014, Steve Faulkner wrote:
> >
> > All that should be necessary is:
> >
> >  <details>
> >   <summary> Foo </summary>
> >   ...
> >  </details>
> >
> > Adding two attributes and an elements is thus more complicated than 
> > necessary. This seems pretty unambiguous to me.
> 
> for the case
> 
> <details>
>   <summary> Foo  <input> Bar  </summary>
>   ...
>  </details>
> 
> whats the disclosure label?

The text "Foo", a text field, and the text "Bar". If by "disclosure label" 
you mean the parts which, on certain platforms, when clicked, would toggle 
the open state, then that depends on the platform, but I would expect the 
"Foo" and "Bar" text to be good candidates, since they're otherwise inert.


> what about?
> 
> <details>
>   <summary> <label><input> Bar  </label></summary>
>   ...
> </details>

Here there's no non-interactive text, so there's no text to target.


> > > in the absence of browser making "clicks on (non-interactive) parts 
> > > of the summary defer to the disclosure triangle." how is an author 
> > > supposed to do this?
> >
> > The author isn't supposed to do this. The whole point of semantic 
> > controls like this is that the user agent is the one that picks the 
> > user interface.
> 
> does this also extend to the author being able to provide an accessible 
> name for the control?

Should there be a particular need for an accessible name for the <details> 
control, ARIA can be used to set the name. But I must admit to not 
understanding why you would need that in practice, if the page is well 
written. (I find most pages that use accessible labels in situations such 
as this tend to be poorly written for non-AT users.)


> > Once we start talking about custom widgets, we're in the space of Web 
> > components, at which point the author can do whatever the author 
> > wants.
> 
> yeah, its a shame that the design of some html features don't provide 
> the flexibility to allow authors to fix user agent specific design 
> deficits without recourse to web components

Why is avoiding Web components a goal? That's like saying it's unfortunate 
that nails don't provide enough flexibility to be driven into walls 
without recourse to a hammer. 

-- 
Ian Hickson               U+1047E                )\._.,--....,'``.    fL
http://ln.hixie.ch/       U+263A                /,   _.. \   _\  ;`._ ,.
Things that are impossible just take longer.   `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'
Received on Monday, 7 April 2014 19:08:31 UTC

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