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Re: {agenda} TTWG Meeting 2017-05-25

From: Nigel Megitt <nigel.megitt@bbc.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 24 May 2017 19:56:54 +0000
To: Dae Kim <dakim@netflix.com>, Timed Text Working Group <public-tt@w3.org>
Message-ID: <74C2E14D-0394-4C69-AE96-38F7E6215711@bbc.co.uk>
I'd be happy to.



On 24 May 2017, at 20:30, Dae Kim <dakim@netflix.com<mailto:dakim@netflix.com>> wrote:

Should we discuss AD (195<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/195>) at the top of the meeting?
We didn't have a chance to discuss last week.

-Dae

Dae Kim | Senior Video Engineer | Encoding Technology
9420 94f4 a834 b038 2920 34b3 38ad b632 3738 942c 942f

On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 4:12 AM, Nigel Megitt <nigel.megitt@bbc.co.uk<mailto:nigel.megitt@bbc.co.uk>> wrote:

This meeting is scheduled for up to 120m. Please be ready for a prompt start at 10:03am Boston time.

Our teleconference is scheduled with reference to Boston Time, the correct time of this teleconference in your locale may change.

Check https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?iso=20170525T10&p1=43

Thursdays 10:03am-12:00pm Boston local

Joining details:

see https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-tt/2016Oct/0009.html
(members-only link – if you can't see this and wish to join please contact me)

Agenda+ Assign Roles

Chairs: Nigel Megitt

Scribe: usually Nigel – open to offers!

Regrets: Andreas, Thierry

Activity since last meeting:
See individual agenda items for recent activity on specific products

Cross-product TTWG board: http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/board/
We are still using tracker for actions unrelated to issues.
Please do not add or modify issues in tracker!

IMSC: https://github.com/w3c/imsc/pulse
TTML1: https://github.com/w3c/ttml1/pulse
TTML2: https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pulse
TTML Profile Registry: https://github.com/w3c/tt-profile-registry/pulse
TTML-WebVTT mapping: https://github.com/w3c/ttml-webvtt-mapping/pulse
WebVTT: https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/pulse

Agenda+ Prioritise discussion for this meeting and look ahead

Check-point for order of topics – I'd suggest, subject to reordering:
1. TPAC advanced planning
2. TTML issue assignment and progress tracking
3. TTML1 & TTML2 issues, actions, PRs, editorial actions etc
4. IMSC
5. HDR in PNG
6. Progress on HTMLCue proposal (placeholder)
7. WebVTT comments (placeholder)
8. AOB – please notify of any other AOB now!


Reminder re future milestones and meetings:

June Meetings:

Thursday 1st June: TTWG phone meeting 2 Hour(s)
Thursday 8th June: TTWG phone meeting 2 Hour(s)
Thursday 15th June: TTWG phone meeting 2 Hour(s)
Thursday 22th June: TTWG phone meeting 2 Hour(s)
Thursday 29th June: TTWG phone meeting 2 Hour(s)

Further ahead:

Thursday 6th July: TTWG phone meeting ? Hour(s)
Thursday 13th July: TTWG phone meeting ? Hour(s)
Thursday 20th July: TTWG phone meeting ? Hour(s)
Thursday 27th July: TTWG phone meeting ? Hour(s)

IMSC 2 and TTML2 publication events: see the timeline of upcoming work at https://www.w3.org/wiki/TimedText/Publications#Timeline_of_TTML2_and_IMSC2_work


Agenda+ TPAC 2017 Advanced planning

As Chair I have completed the WBS survey, requesting:

Attendance for ~10 people.
No preference for date, meet on any two days.
Flexible about days.
Joint meeting with CSS WG and with Web and TV IG.
Avoid overlap with Web and TV IG.
Permit observers.
Not member confidential.
Estimate ~6 attending technical plenary.
Estimate ~3 attending AC sessions Tuesday and Thursday.

https://www.w3.org/2017/11/TPAC/Overview.html

Agenda+ TTML issue assignment and progress tracking (20 minutes maximum)

We have a tough goal to resolve our open issues by the end of May. Please could you indicate for the coming week which issues you will be able to pick up and prepare pull request(s) for?

Agenda+ TTML1 & TTML2 issues, actions, PRs, editorial actions etc

Horizontal Review:

CSS Review of TTML2, threads: FW: TTML2 horizontal review with CSS<https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2016Dec/0013.html> and Fwd: Subtitle/caption styling + TTML + CSS<https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2016Dec/0019.html>

Internationalisation review by r12a has generated several new issues on TTML2 and comments on existing issues (see below), this week mainly about alignment with relatively recent CSS developments.

CSS 2.2 request for reviews from TTWG et al: Pre-announcement of CR for CSS 2.2 & request for reviews<https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2016Dec/0017.html> When can we schedule a review and gather feedback?

Actions:
ID      State   Title   Person  Due Date        Associated with
ACTION-443<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/443>[(edit)]<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/443/edit>     open    Prepare a document showing mapping arib ruby extension features to ttml2 for use as a liaison document to arib.<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/443>   Glenn Adams     2016-08-26      TTML2<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/products/4>
ACTION-462<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/462>[(edit)]<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/462/edit>     open    Create issue on ttml2 to add "mapping from other versions and profiles of ttml"<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/462>   Glenn Adams     2016-04-28      TTML2<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/products/4>

Most recent WD published at https://www.w3.org/TR/2017/WD-ttml2-20170106/

Merged TTML1 Pull Requests: None
Merged TTML2 Pull Requests:
Issue 0186 value expression conventions<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/311>
Issue 0105 out of line region timing<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/309>
Clarify support for R217 (#141).<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/318>
Add #region-timing feature designation (#169).<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/317>
Clarify applicability of special value of 60 in seconds component (#1…<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/325>
Add support for Unicode explicit directional isolates<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/322>
Minor corrections regarding inline progression dimension vs direction…<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/326>
Open TTML1 Pull Requests: None
Open TTML2 Pull Requests:
Apply improvements to aspect ratio and pixel semantics.<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/321>
Issue 0164 default play rate<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/324>
Issue 0230 vertical scripts<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/327>
Issue 0133 ruby style inheritance<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/328>
New TTML1 Issues:
Text is over 4 lines in BasicTiming011.xml<https://github.com/w3c/ttml1/issues/242>
tts:displayAlign should be `after` in BeginEnd002.ttml<https://github.com/w3c/ttml1/issues/243>
Improve text at WritingMode004.ttml and WritingMode009.ttml<https://github.com/w3c/ttml1/issues/244>
Text not shown at Opacity004.ttml<https://github.com/w3c/ttml1/issues/245>
"." shows with overline in TextDecoration011.ttml<https://github.com/w3c/ttml1/issues/246>
tts:writingMode="rl" with latin characters and a comma<https://github.com/w3c/ttml1/issues/247>
New TTML2 Issues:
Review deprecations before finalizing WR.<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/316>
tts:position on <tt><https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/319>
[related media object region target] and [viewport target] defined but not referenced<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/320>
Questions about ttp:mediaOffset<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/323>
tts:extent="contain" is not defined when applied to <tt><https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/329>
Closed TTML1 Issues: None
Closed TTML2 Issues:
Ensure that document conventions cover syntax used in value expressions.<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/186>
Prefer end to dur on generated out-of-line regions<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/105>
Embedded graphics don't fully meet requirement<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/141>
The tts:textAlign property may need to apply to div, body<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/138>
Consider applying ipd or bpd to content images<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/140>
Feature designator for time expressions on region<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/169>
Specify date as well as hours, minutes and seconds in time expressions<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/96>
Clarify timing concepts in relation to SMIL<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/135>
Create a section on options for customisation<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/156>
Clarify semantics of content bpd for inline and line areas<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/163>
The tts:displayAlign property may need to apply to content elements<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/137>
Clock-time form time expressions allow 60 seconds for media timebase<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/158>
Clarify the application specific usages of clockMode="local"<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/136>
No mention of isolation for directional controls<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/265>
The width of content elements' areas is unclear, especially looking at the examples<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/134>
Ensure consistency in ttml2 w.r.t. inline progression dimension vs direction<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/155>
Discussed TTML1 Issues: None
Discussed TTML2 Issues:
Meaning of 'glyph area descendant'<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/236>
Ruby text should used special inheritance algorithm<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/133>
rubyAlign withBase<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/248>
Add support for Audio Description requirements<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/195>
Specify attribute term delimiter as post-normalised space<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/191>
Metadata examples do not include xml:lang (editorial) <https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/271>
LWSP in rgba expressions?<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/315>
The uniqueness of xml:id needs to be broken for some uses of condition<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/128>

Focus topic(s) for this week

Open Pull Requests (50 minutes)

Can we reach consensus to merge the open pull requests or understand what changes are needed so that they can be merged?

Issues (remaining time)

(Please advise if you would like to raise any other issues for the group's consideration this week)

The uniqueness of xml:id needs to be broken for some uses of condition<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/128>

LWSP in rgba expressions?<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/315>

Questions about ttp:mediaOffset<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/323>

Add security and privacy section. <https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/224>

Inclusion of foreign namespace elements – is it only permitted on metadata elements, or anywhere? Do we need additional conformance language? See also IMSC issue foreign namespace usage is underspecified<https://github.com/w3c/imsc/issues/213>

Consider applying ipd or bpd to content images<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/140> – can we agree what we want to happen here?

A PR was merged early (direct commit) for How to specify aspect ratio to understand positioning that may apply for display or video<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/30> - does this do what we need? Last comment on the issue was Jan 6. This now incorporates Interpreting the pixel measure<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/27>.

Given the recent discussions, are we in a position to propose a syntax and semantic to resolve Should background of a span be height of text in line or computed lineHeight?<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/101> in a way that can reasonably be contributed to CSS WG for their proposed equivalent?

AD Requirements

Given the discussion on Add support for Audio Description requirements<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/195>  review the AD requirements document.

See also: AD Requirements wiki page.<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/wiki/Audio-Description-Requirements>



Current open issues: https://github.com/w3c/ttml1/issues and https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues
See spreadsheet of editorial actions at https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/blob/master/spec/ednotes.xlsx
Edit/build instructions now in README in ttml2/spec/ at https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/blob/master/spec/README.md


Agenda+ IMSC (now incorporates Unicode ticket)

The Wide Review period has now expired and we have received some incoming liaisons.

What are our next steps? We will need dispositions for the review comments, to Create tests for CR exit criteria<https://github.com/w3c/imsc/issues/226> and set a CR exit minimum timeline.

IMSC 1.0.1 WD for Wide Review published at https://www.w3.org/TR/ttml-imsc1.0.1/
IMSC 1 Rec available at https://www.w3.org/TR/2016/REC-ttml-imsc1-20160421/
Patent policy call for exclusions sent 2017-02-03, archived at https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2017Feb/0006.html

Editor's draft is directly viewable at http://w3c.github.io/imsc/imsc1/spec/ttml-ww-profiles.html
IMSC Implementation Page: https://www.w3.org/wiki/TimedText/IMSC1_implementation_page.
IMSC Tests repository: https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests

Unicode CLDR discussion
Unicode ticket is at http://unicode.org/cldr/trac/ticket/8915
Pierre's response to the recent update is at http://unicode.org/cldr/trac/ticket/8915#comment:9
Email response from Shervin at Unicode https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2016Dec/0018.html

Merged IMSC pull requests: none
Open IMSC pull requests:
Fix differences of XML and images for fillLineGap<https://github.com/w3c/imsc/pull/234>
New or discussed IMSC issues:
Recommend avoiding tab characters<https://github.com/w3c/imsc/issues/232>
XML Example and corresponding renderings in pictures for itts:fillLineGap don't fit <https://github.com/w3c/imsc/issues/233>
Clarified expected system behavior for ittp:activeArea<https://github.com/w3c/imsc/pull/231>
Remove tabs from examples (issue #225)<https://github.com/w3c/imsc/pull/229>
Required spaces between non-terminal components of styling and parameter attributes (issue #221)<https://github.com/w3c/imsc/pull/230>
Determination of the color in leading in tts:fillLineGap<https://github.com/w3c/imsc/issues/228>
Closed IMSC issues: None

Merged IMSC Tests pull requests:
Fixed spurious linefeed in multiRowAlign1/1.000000.png<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/pull/2>
Adds tests<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/pull/3>
Test `set` with implicit inheritance<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/pull/4>
Feature set+implicit inheritance<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/pull/8>
Open IMSC Tests pull requests:
Adds writingMode and unicodeBidi tests<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/pull/5>
Added timing, named color and zIndex tests<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/pull/6>
New or discussed IMSC Tests issues:
br-in-p-001.ttml ang br-in-span-001.ttml onscreen text misleading<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/issues/9>
ttp:frameRate should be "30" in BasicTiming010.ttml<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/issues/10>
Text is over 4 lines in BasicTiming011.xml<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/issues/11>
White spaces at EOL do not appear in BasicTiming012.xml<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/issues/12>
tts:displayAlign should be `after` in BeginEnd002.ttml<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/issues/13>
Onscreen text misleading at WritingMode004.ttml and WritingMode009.ttml<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/issues/14>
Text not shown at Opacity004.ttml<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/issues/15>
space-preserve-001.ttml states "one line" but two are displayed<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/issues/16>
nested-region-001.ttml should display more descriptive text<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/issues/17>
"." shows with overline in TextDecoration011.ttml<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/issues/18>
FontFamily009.ttml has a spurious space<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/issues/7>
Closed IMSC Tests issues:
multiRowAlign1/1.000000.png has spurious linefeed<https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/issues/1>


Agenda+ HDR in PNG

ID      State   Title   Person  Due Date        Associated with
ACTION-495<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/495>[(edit)]<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/495/edit>     open    Update the ttwg homepage and publications pages for the new repos<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/495> Thierry Michel  2017-04-20

Repo for PQ HDR in PNG: https://github.com/w3c/png-hdr-pq
Draft WG Note: https://w3c.github.io/png-hdr-pq/

Merged pull requests: none
Open pull requests: None
New or discussed issues:
ICC profile has wrong copyright<https://github.com/w3c/png-hdr-pq/issues/2>
ICC profile contents are ignored, magic string used for labelling<https://github.com/w3c/png-hdr-pq/issues/3>
Closed issues:
Typo in repo link<https://github.com/w3c/png-hdr-pq/issues/1>


Agenda+ HTMLCue proposal progress update.

ID      State   Title   Person  Due Date        Associated with
ACTION-441<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/441>[(edit)]<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/441/edit>     open    Kick off the analysis work on the vttcue carrying html idea.<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/441>      Andreas Tai     2015-11-05


See https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2016Apr/0012.html for further information on this, this week.

Also HTML import and HTMLCue?<https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2016Sep/0003.html> email from 2016-09-06.

[placeholder agenda item]

Agenda+ WebVTT review feedback

ID      State   Title   Person  Due Date        Associated with
ACTION-396<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/396>[(edit)]<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/396/edit>     open    Produce evidence of request for wide review for webvtt, for the archive<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/396>   David Singer    2015-04-17      WebVTT 1.0<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/products/8>

Discussion on WebVTT review feedback and next steps.

WebVTT Wide review wiki page: https://www.w3.org/wiki/WebVTT_Wide_Review

Open Pull requests:
Add requirements for region identifier to exist.<https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/pull/201>
Ruby issue264<https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/pull/347>
Merged Pull requests: None
New issues: None
Closed issues: None
Recently discussed issues:
incomplete ruby implementation [I18N-ISSUE-431]<https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/issues/264>
Ruby issue264<https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/pull/347>

Agenda+ AOB

References

Wiki http://www.w3.org/wiki/TimedText




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Received on Wednesday, 24 May 2017 19:57:29 UTC

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