- From: Jonathan Mayer <jmayer@stanford.edu>
- Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2012 23:23:15 +0200
- To: "Aleecia M. McDonald" <aleecia@aleecia.com>
- Cc: Dobbs, Brooks <Brooks.Dobbs@kbmg.com>, "public-tracking@w3.org (public-tracking@w3.org)" <public-tracking@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <AB55F750B9834F27B0306BA8940ECDED@gmail.com>
Aleecia, I'm often uncertain what to make of comments on the list that aren't followed up. At times, to be sure, that's been a signal that many in the group agree. But on more than a few occasions it's just meant that others didn't spot the message, didn't understand it, or didn't see value in further debate. (An example of the last: my ISSUE-137 thread with Roy about service provider status.) Whatever the import of radio silence, I completely agree with this resolution approach of explicitly surfacing the issue on a call. Best, Jonathan On Tuesday, September 4, 2012 at 10:29 PM, Aleecia M. McDonald wrote: > Hi Brooks, > > As you can imagine, I don't expect we'll get this resolved in 15 minutes. This has been one of those "third rail" issues. There are strong opinions we should not have any definition at all. There are a few prior views that drew strong disagreement. What I do not know is what other opinions there are on David's text, since no one responded to it, which typically signals agreement. I'd like to get a sense of that, so we can hear each other and understand where the main perspectives are today. I also don't want us to spend what could be infinite time on this issue. We'll check in, see where it stands, see if there is productive action to take, and not get stuck. > > Aleecia > > On Sep 4, 2012, at 12:55 PM, "Dobbs, Brooks" <Brooks.Dobbs@kbmg.com (mailto:Brooks.Dobbs@kbmg.com)> wrote: > > Aleecia, > > > > Re the agenda below, I understand your fear that defining "tracking" is quite likely to be a lengthy process (and I am sure not without its pain points), but in fairness isn't this the core of what we are doing? Doesn't limiting its discussion to 15 (or 20) minutes seems a bit unusual considering how long we have spent on other far more trivial topics? > > > > -Brooks > > > > > > -- > > > > Brooks Dobbs, CIPP | Chief Privacy Officer | KBM Group | Part of the Wunderman Network > > (Tel) 678 580 2683 | (Mob) 678 492 1662 | kbmg.com (http://kbmg.com) > > brooks.dobbs@kbmg.com (x-msg://7621/brooks.dobbs@kbmg.com) > > > > <image[94].png> > > > > This email – including attachments – may contain confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient, > > do not copy, distribute or act on it. Instead, notify the sender immediately and delete the message. > > > > From: "Aleecia M. McDonald" <aleecia@aleecia.com (mailto:aleecia@aleecia.com)> > > Date: Tuesday, September 4, 2012 1:07 PM > > To: W3 Tracking <public-tracking@w3.org (mailto:public-tracking@w3.org)> > > Subject: Agenda for 5 September 2012 call > > Resent-From: <public-tracking@w3.org (mailto:public-tracking@w3.org)> > > Resent-Date: Tuesday, September 4, 2012 1:07 PM > > > > Chair: Aleecia > > Main topic: We will be finally getting to some issues that have been on prior agendas, plus a few more. If you have prepared for past calls, the new work here is to review the links under (d) for new business. > > > > --------------------------- > > Administrative > > --------------------------- > > > > 1. Selection of scribe > > > > --------------------------- > > Old business > > --------------------------- > > > > 2. Review of overdue action items: http://www.w3.org/2011/tracking-protection/track/actions/overdue?sort=owner > > > > 3. Quick check that callers are identified > > > > 4. Any questions on the following quick summary of where we are on issues we've been talking about for the past month, but will not take up on the 5 Sept call: > > - Issue-45, Companies making public commitments with a "regulatory hook" for US legal purposes > > STATUS: waiting on an open action. We will have three proposed resolutions. > > * "In order to be in compliance with this specification, a third party must make a public commitment that it complies with this standard. A "public commitment" may consist of a statement in a privacy policy, a response header, a machine-readable tracking status resource at a well-known location, or any other reasonable means." (text Roy can live with since it omits the original final sentence of "This standard does not require a specific form of public commitment," which is no longer correct.) > > * Awaiting text from David Wainberg, action-246 > > * Silence > > > > - Issue-123, third parties should be prohibited from acting or representing themselves as first parties > > STATUS: postponed while we work through party definitions > > > > - Issue-49, > > STATUS: Awaiting text from Shane, action-161 > > As per http://www.w3.org/2012/08/22-dnt-minutes, Shane was to update this text to reflect third parties acting on behalf of third parties. We mistakenly left this as pending review without a new due date, so it dropped out of sight. It should have been due last week, but I've set it due for 5 Sept with a note to Shane. Since the due date was wrong, he'll have an automatic extra week if he is unable to get this done by the 5th (that is, in 24 hours.) > > - Once texts are complete, we compare them side-by-side > > - We acknowledged on the Aug 1 call that these proposals are likely to go through the decision process with a call for objections. We need alternatives we can adopt into the document. > > > > - Issue-64, renamed from "How does site-preference management work with DNT" to "How do we describe non-identifiable data" and set to OPEN, as agreed on the 22 August call. We will need to work through the exact language but agree on the direction here. > > STATUS: one of many open issues, no longer in limbo as "postponed." > > > > --------------------------- > > New business > > --------------------------- > > > > 5. New business > > > > (a) ACTION-208 on Ian Fette: Draft a definition of DNT:0 expression -- issue-148 > > Text under discussion (after a few edits): http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tracking/2012Jun/0314.html > > Suggestion for addition http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tracking/2012Jun/0421.html which may not work: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tracking/2012Jun/0428.html > > Counter-proposal: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tracking/2012Jun/0313.html > > > > (b) Specify "absolutely not tracking" (ISSUE-119) > > ACTION-110 on Ninja Marnau: Write proposal text for what it means to "not track" > > Text: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tracking/2012Feb/0362.html > > Counter-proposal from Roy: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tracking/2012Feb/0403.html > > Several people suggested changes, mostly "let's call this something other than 'not tracking' please." One suggestion there: "Exceeds the compliance standard and does not collect and retain any data" > > > > (c) Buried in this discussion (of "absolutely not tracking") was David Singer's attempt to define tracking: "Tracking is the retention or use, after a transaction is complete, of data records that are, or can be, associated with a single user." (I'd append: ", user agent, or device.") Unlike every other time someone has made the attempt, the one and only reply was in support. Does that mean we can live with this? [Note that issue-5 is currently raised] > > Procedural NOTE: We are going to time box this discussion. After 15 minutes, if we are not having a productive conversation, we will take another five minutes to assign any actions that come out of the discussion at its current state and move on. > > > > (d) Issue-148, What does DNT:0 mean? > > One text, action-208, http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tracking/2012Jun/0266.html > > > > Second text for action-209: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tracking/2012Jun/0321.html > > Suggested refinement to text, which seemed acceptable: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tracking/2012Jun/0327.html > > Two additional concerns without proposed text: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tracking/2012Jun/0335.html, http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tracking/2012Jun/0364.html > > > > Next steps: we talk through both of these alternatives. Can we find something that satisfies the group by making modifications to one of the texts? If not, are these texts final? > > > > (e) Issue-25, Possible exemption for research purposes > > In Seattle, this dropped from our list of permitted uses. Research can, of course, always be done with consent. > > PROPOSAL: we close this issue as outdated. > > > > > > > > --------------------------- > > > > 6. Announce next meeting & adjourn > > > > ================ Infrastructure ================= > > > > Zakim teleconference bridge: > > VoIP: sip:zakim@voip.w3.org > > Phone +1.617.761.6200 passcode TRACK (87225) > > IRC Chat: irc.w3.org (http://irc.w3.org/), port 6665, #dnt > > > > ***** > > > > >
Received on Tuesday, 4 September 2012 21:26:53 UTC