- From: Erik Dahlstrom <ed@opera.com>
- Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2009 22:28:08 +0100
- To: public-svg-wg@w3.org
In html format:
http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html
or as text:
[1]W3C
[1] http://www.w3.org/
- DRAFT -
SVG Working Group Teleconference
19 Jan 2009
[2]Agenda
[2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2009JanMar/0050.html
See also: [3]IRC log
[3] http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-irc
Attendees
Present
heycam, anthony, ed
Regrets
Chair
heycam
Scribe
erik
Contents
* [4]Topics
1. [5]ISSUE-2201
2. [6]ISSUE-2199
3. [7]ISSUE-2103?
4. [8]ISSUE-2203
5. [9]www-svg feedback
6. [10]animate-elem-82-t query,
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0026.ht
ml
7. [11]testsuite
* [12]Summary of Action Items
_________________________________________________________
<trackbot> Date: 19 January 2009
<scribe> scribe: erik
<scribe> scribeNick: ed
ISSUE-2201
ISSUE-2201+
ISSUE-2201?
<trackbot> ISSUE-2201 -- Return value of
SVGAnimationElement.getStartTime unclear -- OPEN
<trackbot> [13]http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/issues/2201
[13] http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/issues/2201
<heycam>
[14]http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#getStartT
ime-return-value
[14] http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#getStartTime-return-value
CMC: wasn't sure if we decided if we return a value for the interval
if it wasn't active at the moment (so the next interval)
ED: just wondering which is more intuitive to authors
AG: what does batik do?
CMC: think something slightly different, actually returns NaN
... Opera currently will do the current interval whether if it's
active or not
... if we returned the start time of the current interval if they're
not active scripts could still compare that against the document
time to determine if that's active or not
... don't mind either way
AG: do we want to wait for jwatt to have his opinion?
CMC: brian brought up the discussion originally
... he also asked on svg-developers if anyone used this, and what
they thought
... no replies yet
ED: it may be that sometimes it's tricky to time the call such that
the getStartTime is when the interval is active, and you might
expect to get something instead of an exception if the next interval
is computed
CMC: what about the duration one?
ED: that's getSimpleDuration, so the name says pretty much what it
does
CMC: difficult do decide given that there's other timing things that
are not exposed
... given that we can expose a bit more information by having it
return the current interval and that you can compare against the
documenttime, and that you can call it on beginevent, it should be
safe to du the "current interval"
AG: i'm fine with that, opera would have to change?
ED: yes, to raise the exception
<scribe> ACTION: heycam to change the
[15]http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#getStartT
ime-return-value erratum to use "current interval" and to move the
item to proposed [recorded in
[16]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html#action01]
[15] http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#getStartTime-return-value
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2407 - Change the
[17]http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#getStartT
ime-return-value erratum to use \"current interval\" and to move the
item to proposed [on Cameron McCormack - due 2009-01-26].
[17] http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#getStartTime-return-value
ISSUE-2199
ISSUE-2199?
<trackbot> ISSUE-2199 -- Underlying transform value erratum now
conflicts with 1.2T -- RAISED
<trackbot> [18]http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/issues/2199
[18] http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/issues/2199
<heycam>
[19]http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#cleanup-w
ording-underlying-value
[19] http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#cleanup-wording-underlying-value
CMC: i've updated this to bring in the text in 1.2T
... copied the text and changed some links from SMIL to SMIL
Animation
... I've brought it back to draft to review it again
AG: doesn't look like a big behavioural change
CMC: it's not really explicit in the text, but this text implies
that when you're doing the scale transofrmation animation and the
scale is zero (like in a to animation and you need to know the
starting value)
... it's not explicit in tiny 1.2 either anymore
... we used to have a table
... but was removed before moving to CR
... based on comments from DOH
AG: wasn't much in the spec before anyway
CMC: yes, this was rather undefined
... no tests in the 1.1 testsuite that rely on the underlaying value
AG: I've no problem changing that to proposed
ED: one thing I was wondering about was if the references affects
this at all
CMC: the first link there is just describing the from-to calculation
ED: right, this is probably close enough
... and good to use similar wording
CMC: how do we do tests for errata items?
AG: we should add tests in the 1.1F2/tests/svg directory going
forward
CMC: we'll have to release the testsuite again, right?
AG: right
CMC: so maybe we could publish the second edition spec along with a
new snapshot of the testsuite
<heycam>
[20]http://www.w3.org/2003/01/test-cases/text-intro-06-t.svg
[20] http://www.w3.org/2003/01/test-cases/text-intro-06-t.svg
ED: that sounds good yes
CMC: the links should point to the right place though, they don't
currently
... we should move the old tests over
<scribe> ACTION: heycam to create a test for
[21]http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#cleanup-w
ording-underlying-value (check if we have a test for it in the 1.2T
testsuite) and then move the erratum to proposed [recorded in
[22]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html#action02]
[21] http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#cleanup-wording-underlying-value
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2408 - Create a test for
[23]http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#cleanup-w
ording-underlying-value (check if we have a test for it in the 1.2T
testsuite) and then move the erratum to proposed [on Cameron
McCormack - due 2009-01-26].
[23] http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#cleanup-wording-underlying-value
ISSUE-2103?
ISSUE-2103?
<trackbot> ISSUE-2103 -- i18n comment 3: Inline -progression typo --
CLOSED
<trackbot> [24]http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/issues/2103
[24] http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/issues/2103
ISSUE-2203
ISSUE-2203?
<trackbot> ISSUE-2203 -- color-profile "local" IDL attribute erratum
incorrect -- RAISED
<trackbot> [25]http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/issues/2203
[25] http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/issues/2203
<heycam>
[26]http://www.w3.org/mid/20090116032239.GB3580@arc.mcc.id.au
[26] http://www.w3.org/mid/20090116032239.GB3580@arc.mcc.id.au
CMC: this was raised by me a while ago
... I think i was incorrect in raising it
... it was for the IDL and there's an attribute named "_local"
... and "local" is a keyword in IDL
... so the underscore is actually needed
... like the comment said
ED: ok, let's remove the errata item
CMC: yes, that's probably safe to do
<scribe> ACTION: AG to remove the color-profile "local" IDL
attribute erratum for SVG 1.1 (addressing ISSUE-2203) [recorded in
[27]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html#action03]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2409 - Remove the color-profile \"local\"
IDL attribute erratum for SVG 1.1 (addressing ISSUE-2203) [on
Anthony Grasso - due 2009-01-26].
www-svg feedback
<heycam>
[28]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0024.html
[28] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0024.html
CMC: for these methods what happens if you call them before the
timeline is started
ED: so I think I was able to answer his first question about
animationsPaused
... though we could possibly clarify it
CMC: for beginElementAt
... we should add the offset to time zero I think
AG: yes, makes it less confusing I think
CMC: would be consistent to do it that way I think
... my suggestion would be if you did "beginElementAt(5)" it would
be five seconds after the document timeline started, not from when
it was called if it was called before the timeline started
ED: that would probably be the most intuitive yes
CMC: and then we'd get the timelineBegin from 1.2T if you wanted to
start the timeline earlier
[29]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0029.html
[29] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0029.html
CMC: it's a bit weird to fix up the starttime to be some negative
time
... that's jwatts suggestion to run the animation before the
timeline has started
ED: the ElementTimeControl API is slightly different in 1.2T,
something to note
... IMHO it's a bit strange to not look at 1.2T when implementing
SVG SMIL support from scratch
<scribe> ACTION: heycam to reply to
[30]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0024.html to
say what we decided and that we've made erratum for it [recorded in
[31]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html#action04]
[30] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0024.html
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2410 - Reply to
[32]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0024.html to
say what we decided and that we've made erratum for it [on Cameron
McCormack - due 2009-01-26].
[32] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0024.html
<heycam>
[33]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0026.html
[33] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0026.html
animate-elem-82-t query,
[34]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0026.html
[34] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0026.html
CMC: brian points out that this test was copied over from 1.1, but
it relied on the behaviour that we changed in 1.2T based on DOH's
comments
AG: this test has always had issues related to it
... was it even approved?
CMC: does say so
... presumably we've changed the definition of paced to something
we're happy with in tiny
... and this test should be removed and/or changed from the tiny 1.2
testsuite at least
... but should we also look at changing what's in 1.1?
... or just leave it
... opera does the 1.2T way right?
ED: since this issue went back and forth a number of times I'm not
sure if we decided to hold off on changing anything
CMC: this test in the 1.2T testsuite, we should eitehr change it or
remove it
... only some subtests rely on the pacing, don't know which
<scribe> ACTION: review 1.2T/tests/animate-elem-82-t.svg and make
sure the positions are correct for the paced animations, and move
the test back to draft/unapproved for now [recorded in
[35]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html#action05]
<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - review
<scribe> ACTION: ED to review 1.2T/tests/animate-elem-82-t.svg and
make sure the positions are correct for the paced animations, and
move the test back to draft/unapproved for now [recorded in
[36]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html#action06]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-2411 - Review
1.2T/tests/animate-elem-82-t.svg and make sure the positions are
correct for the paced animations, and move the test back to
draft/unapproved for now [on Erik Dahlström - due 2009-01-26].
testsuite
AG: haven't started writing the xslt stylesheet yet
ACTION-2385
AG: most things can be copied across, but some empty fields need to
be filled out
CMC: so once that's done the testsuite will be in good shape for
adding tests to it
AG: you can do that now anyway, we can make the xsl look for certain
elements and only change tose
CMC: we haven't copied over the tests yet have we?
AG: we did
... but they're still using the old template
... i've been organizing the last bits of the f2f, so I'll have more
time this week to look at it
... if anyone wants to make a new test just use the new template
<anthony> [37]http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/templates/
[37] http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/templates/
AG: there are some new fields
... the testdescription field allows references to the spec to be
put in
... and which parts of the spec is being tested
... and because multiple parts can be tested you can put multiple
references
... tehre's a field for pass criteria
... the approved attribute has been removed, it's only using status
now
CMC: does testdescription need to be there?
AG: probably not
... will give an example
<anthony>
[38]http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/text-tspan-02-b.sv
g
[38] http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/test/svg/text-tspan-02-b.svg
ED: what about future specs, we might not have a full absolute link?
AG: good point
... we could make an xslt for publication
ED: we already put some spec links into the harness, based on naming
convention
AG: that's based on sectionnames, so with xlink:href you can point
to a specific place in the spec
Summary of Action Items
[NEW] ACTION: AG to remove the color-profile "local" IDL attribute
erratum for SVG 1.1 (addressing ISSUE-2203) [recorded in
[39]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html#action03]
[NEW] ACTION: ED to review 1.2T/tests/animate-elem-82-t.svg and make
sure the positions are correct for the paced animations, and move
the test back to draft/unapproved for now [recorded in
[40]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html#action06]
[NEW] ACTION: heycam to change the
[41]http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#getStartT
ime-return-value erratum to use "current interval" and to move the
item to proposed [recorded in
[42]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html#action01]
[NEW] ACTION: heycam to create a test for
[43]http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#cleanup-w
ording-underlying-value (check if we have a test for it in the 1.2T
testsuite) and then move the erratum to proposed [recorded in
[44]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html#action02]
[NEW] ACTION: heycam to reply to
[45]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0024.html to
say what we decided and that we've made erratum for it [recorded in
[46]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html#action04]
[NEW] ACTION: review 1.2T/tests/animate-elem-82-t.svg and make sure
the positions are correct for the paced animations, and move the
test back to draft/unapproved for now [recorded in
[47]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html#action05]
[41] http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#getStartTime-return-value
[43] http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/errata/errata.xml#cleanup-wording-underlying-value
[45] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2009Jan/0024.html
[End of minutes]
_________________________________________________________
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$Date: 2009/01/19 20:59:17 $
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[48] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
[49] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/
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Present: heycam anthony ed
Agenda: [51]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2009JanMa
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Found Date: 19 Jan 2009
Guessing minutes URL: [52]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/19-svg-minutes.html
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[51] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2009JanMar/0050.html
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--
Erik Dahlstrom, Core Technology Developer, Opera Software
Co-Chair, W3C SVG Working Group
Personal blog: http://my.opera.com/macdev_ed
Received on Monday, 19 January 2009 21:28:52 UTC