Re: Revisiting RDF-star semantics (was Re: Why is the RDF-star working group standardising RDF 1.2 and SPARQL 1.2?)

Thomas,

You are repeating the same two issues that you seem to have with TEPs that you already tried to point out during the CG. Can you please elaborate on them a bit more because a) I still don't get them and b) we have some new people here who haven't been in the CG.

One of your two points is that "the semantic extension has to be invoked per property per graph" and that "a property [cannot] be declared to always make quoted triples referentially transparent."
I guess what you mean by this is that, if one wants to communicate to a receiver of an RDF-star graph that a particular property is meant to be a TEP, then that property needs to be declared to be a TEP (please confirm if my interpretation of your sentence here is correct). Yes that needs to be done. But the same is true for properties that are, e.g., transitive or symmetric. So, you don't like owl:TransitiveProperty and owl:SymmetricProperty either?

Your other point is that a "property [cannot] be used in the same graph on referentially opaque quoted triples AND on referentially transparent quoted triples." Yes, that's true as well. But what is the issue with it? Why would you want to use the very same property with two different meanings? To me, your complaint here is the same as complaining that one cannot use the same property (within the same graph) as both a transitive property and a non-transitive property. Why do you want to do that?

Olaf

Feb 1, 2023 22:14:04 Thomas Lörtsch <tl@rat.io>:

> 
> 
>> On 1. Feb 2023, at 17:58, Antoine Zimmermann <antoine.zimmermann@emse.fr> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Le 01/02/2023 à 17:55, Thomas Lörtsch a écrit :
>> [...] Almost all of them would have to employ the TEP mechanism to be semantically sound. [...]
>> 
>> 
>> Excuse my ignorance but what's TEP?
> 
> Transparency Enabling Properties, the semantic extension proposed by the CG to lift the syntactic constraints on quoted triples and implement referentially transparent quoted triples, see Sections 6.4.5 'Selective referential transparency' [0] and 7.2 'Extended vocabulary' [1] of the RDF-star CG report.
> 
> Note that the semantic extension has to be invoked per property per graph. Neither can a property be declared to always make quoted triples referentially transparent nor can one property be used in the same graph on referentially opaque quoted triples AND on referentially transparent quoted triples.
> 
> [0] https://eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fw3c.github.io%2Frdf-star%2Fcg-spec%2F2021-12-17.html%23selective-ref-transparency&data=05%7C01%7Colaf.hartig%40liu.se%7Cf3b81f50831b4ce1057308db04993e66%7C913f18ec7f264c5fa816784fe9a58edd%7C0%7C0%7C638108828446915944%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=fyuhJaB72a7H9kj1ahiWJQerUYRuM6efFfovtECRbuE%3D&reserved=0
> [1] https://eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fw3c.github.io%2Frdf-star%2Fcg-spec%2F2021-12-17.html%23extended-vocabulary&data=05%7C01%7Colaf.hartig%40liu.se%7Cf3b81f50831b4ce1057308db04993e66%7C913f18ec7f264c5fa816784fe9a58edd%7C0%7C0%7C638108828446915944%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=K09Hg9%2B95WCCOha%2FAk8cNrLhQlZucVvO6Rja5CdZ5wg%3D&reserved=0
> 
> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Antoine Zimmermann
>> École des Mines de Saint-Étienne
>> 158 cours Fauriel
>> CS 62362
>> 42023 Saint-Étienne Cedex 2
>> France
>> Tél:+33(0)4 77 49 97 02
>> https://eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.emse.fr%2F~zimmermann%2F&data=05%7C01%7Colaf.hartig%40liu.se%7Cf3b81f50831b4ce1057308db04993e66%7C913f18ec7f264c5fa816784fe9a58edd%7C0%7C0%7C638108828446915944%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=H8A%2F92r6yUyU1Eo1bjAiXsoSNG3FuHQNZ8ebrrq8OxM%3D&reserved=0
>>

Received on Wednesday, 1 February 2023 23:26:58 UTC