Re: PROV Dictionary

[Written before I read some later comments.  I'm still sending the message, but 
it's probably overtaken by later discussion.]

On 20/12/2012 14:49, Luc Moreau wrote:
>
> Hi Curt,
>
> What if e1 belongs to two dictionaries,  with keys k1 and k2, respectively?

I'd disallow that.  If necessary, use two separate entities.  Maybe leading to 
something like:

   entity (e)
   entity(e1, [prov:key=k1, prov:val=e])
   entity(e2, [prov:key=k2, prov:val=e])

(etc...)

#g
--

>
> On 12/20/2012 02:44 PM, Curt Tilmes wrote:
>> hadMember(c,e) can't have additional attributes or other arguments.
>>
>> You could do something like:
>>
>> entity(d, [prov:type='prov:Dictionary'])
>> entity(e1, [prov:key='k1'])
>> hadMember(d, e1)
>>
>> This adds prov:key to the 'prov:' namespace, but that should be ok,
>> since we've said Notes can do so.
>>
>> We could make it a little more specific to Dictionaries with "prov:dictkey='k1'".
>>
>>
>> I'm also not sure what to do with multiple membership like:
>>
>> d = [(k1, e1), (k2, e1)]
>>
>> (Just give it two "prov:key"s?)
>>
>> Curt
>>
>> On 12/20/2012 09:23 AM, Tom De Nies wrote:
>>> Hello Luc,
>>>
>>> I understand your concern, and it's something we can address before
>>> proceeding. During the last telecon, we motivated our desire to redesign
>>> the original memberOf relation of Dictionary. Basically, we'd like
>>> consistency with Collection membership.
>>>
>>> Would the notation hadMember(d1, e1, "k1") address you concern? (without
>>> the brackets)
>>> In essence, this adds one attribute to the Collection membership for
>>> Dictionary. It also would mean minimal changes througout the document.
>>>
>>> Tom
>>>
>>> On Dec 20, 2012 3:07 PM, "Luc Moreau" <l.moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk
>>> <mailto:l.moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk>> wrote:
>>>
>>>     Hi Tom and Sam,
>>>
>>>     Sorry for the delay.
>>>     I have some concerns about the proposed membership relation.
>>>
>>>     PROV requires members of a collection to be entities.
>>> http://www.w3.org/TR/2012/CR-prov-dm-20121211/#concept-collection
>>>
>>>     Given this, your relation
>>>     hadMember(d, ("k1", e1))
>>>     seems to indicate that ("k1",e1) is also an entity.
>>>
>>>     It's not how I had initially envisaged this to work. I see e1 as an
>>>     entity
>>>     belonging to the dictionary d, with "k1" it's key.
>>>     So, in my view, we have:
>>>     hadMember(d,e1)
>>>     but not
>>>     hadMember(d,("k1",e1))
>>>
>>>     If ("k1",e1) is an entity, what is its identifier?
>>>
>>>     Grammatically, hadMember(d,("k1",e1)) is not compatible with the
>>>     prov-n notation, since the second argument of hadMember has to
>>>     be a qualified name (the identity of the member).
>>>
>>>     To me, it's important that we address this issue, before going into
>>>     a review.
>>>
>>>     Luc
>>>
>>>
>>>     On 12/18/2012 04:03 PM, Tom De Nies wrote:
>>>>     Specific questions we have for reviewers are:
>>>>
>>>>     1. Is the notation of Dictionary concepts clear & acceptable for
>>>>     you? (in PROV-N and PROV-O)
>>>>     2. Are the constraints acceptable, or are they too loose/too strict?
>>>>     3. Are you happy with the solution to the issue regarding
>>>>     completeness? (Tracing back to an EmptyDictionary)
>>>>     4. Is the note ready to be published as FPWD?
>>>>
>>>>     We would like to end the internal review after the first week of
>>>>     the new year.
>>>>
>>>>     Thanks everyone, and happy holidays!
>>>>
>>>>     Tom
>>>>
>>>>     2012/12/18 Sam Coppens Ugent <sam.coppens@ugent.be
>>>>     <mailto:sam.coppens@ugent.be>>
>>>>
>>>>         Hello everybody,
>>>>
>>>>         The Dictionary Note
>>>> (http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/prov/raw-file/default/dictionary/prov-dictionary.html)
>>>>         has been finalised for review. Feedback on the note is welcome.
>>>>         Could everybody also check the authors of the document? If
>>>>         someone is missing, let us know.
>>>>
>>>>         Thanks a lot!
>>>>
>>>>         Best Regards,
>>>>
>>>>         Sam & Tom
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>     --
>>>     Professor Luc Moreau
>>>     Electronics and Computer Science   tel:+44 23 8059 4487
>>> <tel:%2B44%2023%208059%204487>
>>>     University of Southampton          fax:+44 23 8059 2865
>>> <tel:%2B44%2023%208059%202865>
>>>     Southampton SO17 1BJ email:l.moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk
>>> <mailto:l.moreau@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
>>>     United Kingdomhttp://www.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~lavm
>>>
>>
>>
>

Received on Saturday, 29 December 2012 18:26:42 UTC