- From: Ian Hickson <ian@hixie.ch>
- Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2010 18:51:52 +0000 (UTC)
- To: Philippe Le Hegaret <plh@w3.org>, Sean Hayes <Sean.Hayes@microsoft.com>, Geoff Freed <geoff_freed@wgbh.org>, Jonas Sicking <jonas@sicking.cc>
- Cc: "public-html@w3.org" <public-html@w3.org>
On Thu, 22 Apr 2010, Philippe Le Hegaret wrote: > > It seems that this is a reasonable to look at a new format since, in my > opinion, none of the existing formats are satisfying (and yes, that > includes Timed Text). The main problem being that none of them are based > on HTML and CSS. While I agree that the existing formats (or at least, the ones I've looked at) are't especially satisfying, I don't think basing a format on HTML+CSS is an especially good idea either. It would be a very bad idea to require every video playback device in the world to embed an HTML+CSS+DOM+JS+XML user agent, when subtitles are a comparatively simple issue. If we can't reuse an existing format directly, then at most I hope we can reuse an existing format in a backwards-compatible way, so that existing deployed tracks can be reused. Leverging network effects is a big way to ensure adoption -- we don't have a magic wand that causes people to automatically do whatever we say! If anyone has examples of "real world" usage of various subtitle formats, that would be great. Also, there's a lot more to this problem than a format for timed tracks and cues. :-) > I wonder however how you see this work interfacing with > the HTML5 specification, ISSUE-9, and the work in the a11y task force. > Is your intention to bring an alternative proposal for captions to the > task force? If yes, do you have a timeline in mind? My intention is to take the task force's proposal more or less wholesale; that was in fact more or less the request given in the bugs: > > FYI, I've started looking at the timed track bugs: > > > > http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=9452 > > http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=9471 I hope to have the first proposal for how to integrate the proposals into HTML5 in the next few weeks. On Thu, 22 Apr 2010, Sean Hayes wrote: > > I'm not sure what level of integration is being considered, or why CSS > would necessarily be perceived as a benefit, since in my opinion there > will need to be a strong barrier between the HTML and the timed text > environments, for both security reasons and in order that the > video/caption author's intention is not undermined by the HTML page > author. Indeed. On Thu, 22 Apr 2010, Jonas Sicking wrote: > > For what it's wroth, just because CSS is used as a styling technology > both for the page and captions, doesn't mean that any style rules > applied to one of the two also applies to the other. The page > stylesheetes can apply just to the page, and the captions stylesheets > can apply just to the captions. > > It's simply a matter of specifying which style sheets are in scope > where. Indeed. If we have a model where CSS applies to timed track cues, I would expect it to be based on pseudo-elements, not to use the main bulk of style rules in the page. -- Ian Hickson U+1047E )\._.,--....,'``. fL http://ln.hixie.ch/ U+263A /, _.. \ _\ ;`._ ,. Things that are impossible just take longer. `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'
Received on Thursday, 22 April 2010 18:52:22 UTC