Fw: Layout Tables in Forms

Tables for layout is something I have not centrated much effort on so far. 
Header relationships were the hot topic when I began my research. But I 
intend to look into layout tables as well to see if there are patterns which 
would help identify them and therefore avoid running header association 

Below are some examples of forms laid out using tables sent to me yesterday. 
These layouts are claimed to be impossible using currently supported CSS.

These particular form layouts seem very user-hostile to me. But I'm not 
sufficiently interested to create a variant. Maybe some other people are?

Somewhat related is the "Heuristic Tests for Data Tables" thread, where 
identifying layout tables was mentioned a few times:


Ben 'Cerbera' Millard
Collections of Interesting Data Tables

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "David Dailey" <david.dailey@sru.edu>
To: "Ben 'Cerbera' Millard" <cerbera@projectcerbera.com>
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 5:21 PM
Subject: /offlist -- Re: Hierarchies with tabular data...

> Hello Ben,
> Your collection of interesting data tables reminds me of several things:
> 1. Take a look at 
> http://srufaculty.sru.edu/david.dailey/javascript/stringtimer.html
> In it I use tables to create images with the sole purpose of measuring 
> time efficiency of browser string handling efficiency. The table of single 
> pixel wide colors, just happens to be the most efficient way of embedding 
> large amounts of HTML content into a finite amount of real estate.
> 2. As is evident in the above page, I often use tables rather than CSS to 
> layout quick interfaces. I know that is a no-no from the perspective of 
> "good modern" design, though for complex and heterogeneous collections of 
> colspans and rowspans for moving cells around -- I will challenge a good 
> CSS coder to a footrace when it comes to making a wildly heterogeneous 
> layout to cover the equivalent of  this eleven celled table:
> <table border="1">
> <tr>
>     <td rowspan="4">A</td>
>     <td colspan="3">B</td>
>     <td rowspan="2">C</td>
>     <td>D</td>
> </tr>
> <tr>
>     <td>E</td>
>     <td>F</td>
>     <td rowspan="2">G</td>
>     <td rowspan="2">H</td>
> </tr>
> <tr>
>     <td rowspan="2" colspan="2">I</td>
>     <td>J</td>
> </tr>
> <tr>
>     <td colspan="3">K</td>
> </tr>
> </table>
> I am not sure I can imagine a data set (in the classical analysis of 
> design statistical sense) which would correspond to such a geometry, but I 
> can certainly imagine the prototype of a control panel for a 
> user-interface.
> Take a look at the layout of 
> http://srufaculty.sru.edu/david.dailey/javascript/animator20.html as an 
> example.
> I teach programming rather than web design and as such am not very 
> conversant in CSS -- however I have been told by some more expert with CSS 
> than I, that layouts such as the above, cannot yet be performed within 
> CSS2 (but perhaps they will be in CSS3).
> If this claim is correct, then I believe we have a large category of use 
> cases for tables that transcend those that are used for data alone: 
> layouts not yet doable, or those not easily doable in CSS.
> I'd appreciate your response, since I really don't know if my claim here 
> has any validity. If it doesn't then I will learn something. If it does, 
> then is such an argument worth raising before the larger group as a whole?
> regards,
> David Dailey
>>Ben 'Cerbera' Millard
>>Collections of Interesting Data Tables
> -- 
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Received on Thursday, 18 October 2007 23:17:03 UTC