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Re: Final Linked Data Glossary (was Re: def'n of resource?)

From: Biplav Srivastava <sbiplav@in.ibm.com>
Date: Thu, 23 May 2013 16:19:19 +0530
To: Sandro Hawke <sandro@w3.org>
Cc: Dave Reynolds <dave.e.reynolds@gmail.com>, public-gld-wg@w3.org
Message-ID: <OF5192CB79.24647D80-ON65257B74.003A6460-65257B74.003B72AF@in.ibm.com>
I think the WG should have its own take of the 5* and also refer to TBL's
description. We can do the proprietary name / other hair-splitting for
clarity but thinking about the potential readers of the glossary, they
would want/ appreciate both versions - (a) currently unambiguous and
neutral descriptions, and (b) the original one for reference.


  From:       Sandro Hawke <sandro@w3.org>                                                                                         
  To:         Dave Reynolds <dave.e.reynolds@gmail.com>, public-gld-wg@w3.org                                                      
  Date:       23/05/2013 04:04 PM                                                                                                  
  Subject:    Re: Final Linked Data Glossary (was Re: def'n of resource?)                                                          

Dave Reynolds <dave.e.reynolds@gmail.com> wrote:

>I'm OK with this but I'm confused why we are doing this rewrite at all.
>The original version on Tim's DesignIssues page [1] seems perfectly
>usable to me:
>1. Available on the web (whatever format) but with an open licence, to
>be Open Data
>2. Available as machine-readable structured data (e.g. excel instead of
>image scan of a table)
>3. as (2) plus non-proprietary format (e.g. CSV instead of excel)
>4. All the above plus, Use open standards from W3C (RDF and SPARQL) to
>identify things, so that people can point at your stuff
>5. All the above, plus: Link your data to other people’s data to
>I'm not sure what value is been added by saying the same thing in
>slightly different words.
>[OK I know there was some pushback on the mention of excel in #3, I
>would be OK with deleting "instead of excel" in the interests of side
>stepping that. But as I say, I guess I'm OK with the versions in this
>thread too.]

I can live with Tim's text if excel is changed to "application-dependent
xml", but I do find point five in that text very misleading.    Do you
consider some RDF to be linked data if the only working URLs are in
owl:import or rdfs:seeAlso triples?

      - Sandro

>[1] http://www.w3.org/DesignIssues/LinkedData.html (towards the bottom,
>*not* the mug picture)
>On 23/05/13 04:01, Sandro Hawke wrote:
>> On 05/22/2013 07:12 AM, Sandro Hawke wrote:
>>> In general, the glossary is great, but the current text on 5 star is
>not okay.
>>> I can live with dropping it (for now), or just pointing to Tim's
>page, but not the current definition which never even mentions RDF.
>> Bernadette asked me to make another suggestion for the wording.  I
>> see how my earlier suggestions were a bit verbose for this context.
>> First, a reminder what Tim says 4-stars and 5-stars mean:
>> 4:  RDF Standards
>> 5:  Linked RDF
>> That's a little terse (so it could fit on the mug).  As a middle
>> how about:
>> *4: Publish data on the Web as RDF (eg Turtle, RDFa, JSON-LD, SPARQL)
>> 5: In your RDF, have the identifiers be links (URLs) to useful data
>> Okay?   Can we live with that?
>>        -- Sandro
>>   Bernadette Hyland <bhyland@3roundstones.com> wrote:
>>>> Hi,
>>>> Remaining feedback folded in especially in relation to definition
>>>> "Resource", addition of "Web Resource" and fixing 5 star LOD
>>>> definition.  Also updated normative references in doc.
>>>> Linked Data Glossary Draft 21-May 2013 [1] is ready for publication
>>>> once run through one last PubRules check.  (Last week the WG
>>>> to publish as a WG Note.)
>>>> NB:  Editorial changes are to keep tone consistent with rest of the
>>>> document, however were not intended to alter the proposed meaning.
>>>> this unintentionally happened, please notify asap.  Reference to
>>>> 3986 was made elsewhere so I dropped from below proposal so as to
>>>> sound repetitive.
>>>> Again, we're striving for simplicity and for this to be a glossary
>>>> terms for Web developers, not the anointed per se.
>>>> All OK now per your feedback??
>>>> -----%<-------
>>>> 90. Resource
>>>> In an RDF context, a resource can be anything that an RDF graph
>>>> describes. A resource can be addressed by a Unified Resource
>>>> (URI). See also Resource Description Framework (RDF) 1.1 Concepts
>>>> Abstract Syntax [RDF11-CONCEPTS]
>>>> 127. Web Resource
>>>> A web page addressed by a URL. Examples include: an HTML web page,
>>>> image offered by a web server, or a dataset accessible by a URL. A
>>>> Resource may have different representations. For example, an RDF
>>>> database might be accessed at a single URL using multiple syntaxes,
>>>> such as RDFa, JSON-LD, and Turtle. See also Hypertext Transfer
>>>> HTTP/1.1 [RFC2616].
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Bernadette Hyland
>>>> [1]https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/gld/raw-file/default/glossary/index.html

>>>> On May 8, 2013, at 5:48 AM, Dave
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> On 08/05/13 05:39, Bernadette Hyland wrote:
>>>>>> Hi Sandro,
>>>>>> The editors have folded in all comments received in relation to
>>>> LD
>>>>>> Glossary.  Please see latest version. [1]
>>>>>> For Thursday's telecon, would you create a diff previously
>>>> for
>>>>>> publication (April) & the May 7th (current).  Also, need a new
>>>>>> Overview.html file run through PubRules.  I'm done until we get
>>>> further
>>>>>> feedback.  Thanks for your help on this.
>>>>>> ---
>>>>>> Regarding "Resource", I've simplified to include only one
>>>> definition.
>>>>>>   In keeping with my new mantra, "keep it simple", how does this
>>>>>> sit with you & others?
>>>>> Personally I prefer Sandro's suggestion. I imagine that at least
>>>> people reading the glossary will be aware of the notion of REST and
>>>> might expect something more like the entry for Web Resource. Having
>>>> both solves that problem.
>>>>> However, it's not something I would argue strongly over.
>>>>> Dave
>>>>>>     89. Resource
>>>>>> In an RDF context, a resource can be anything that an RDF graph
>>>>>> describes. A resource can be addressed by a Unified Resource
>>>> Identifier
>>>>>> (URI)

>>>>>> Keep in mind that this LD Glossary is a starting point for those
>>>> to
>>>>>> Linked Data.  We don't want to scare people, it is the 'welcome
>>>> basket'
>>>>>> not the definitive guide for the working LD expert (which is
>>>>>> elsewhere on the W3C site).
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> Bernadette

>>>>>> Sandro wrote:
>>>>>>> I've thought about more than most people have thought about food
>>>>>> PS.  Clearly you haven't met my 15 year old son who pretty much
>>>>>> thinks about food ;-)
>>>>>> On May 7, 2013, at 7:15 PM, Sandro Hawke <sandro@w3.org
>>>>>> <mailto:sandro@w3.org>> wrote:
>>>>>>> def'n of resource?
>>>>>>> Bernadette and I were working on actually publishing the
>>>>>>> which the group approved for publication, and I noticed a little
>>>> problem:
>>>>>>>         86. Resource
>>>>>>>     A resource is anything that can be addressed by a Unified
>>>> Resource
>>>>>>>     Identifier (URI)
>>>>>>>     ...
>>>>>>>         93. Resource
>>>>>>>     A resource is a network data object or service that can be
>>>>>>>     identified by an HTTP URI. Resources may be available in
>>>> multiple
>>>>>>>     representations (e.g. multiple languages, data formats,
>>>> and
>>>>>>>     resolutions) or vary in other ways. See details from RFC
>>>>>>>     for details on Uniform Resource Identifiers. See details
>>>> RFC
>>>>>>>     2616bis for details on Uniform Resource Identifiers.
>>>>>>> The definition of Resource is something I've thought about more
>>>> than
>>>>>>> most people have thought about food.  I suggest we call the
>>>> one
>>>>>>> "Web Resource", and explain, like this:
>>>>>>>     *Resource*
>>>>>>>     (Not to be confused with _Web Resource_)  An entity.
>>>> that
>>>>>>>     something is a resource says nothing at all about it,
>because by
>>>>>>>     the definition of the term, everything is a resource.    For
>>>> more
>>>>>>>     details see Uniform Resource Identifier (URI): Generic
>>>> (RFC
>>>>>>>     3986) [1] and Resource Description Framework (RDF) 1.1
>>>> [2].
>>>>>>>     *Web Resource*
>>>>>>>     Anything which is addressed by a URL; roughly speaking, a
>>>>>>>     page.  Examples include: an HTML web page, an image offered
>by a
>>>>>>>     web server, or a dataset available for access at some URL.
>>>>>>>     resource may change its state over time and have different
>>>>>>>     representations of the same state.  For example, a webcam
>>>>>>>     offer both JPEG and PNG versions of its current image, at
>>>> same
>>>>>>>     URL, using content negotiation, or an RDF database might be
>>>>>>>     accessed at one URL using multiple syntaxes, such as RDFa,
>>>>>>>     JSON-LD, and Turtle.   For more details see Hypertext
>>>>>>>     Protocol -- HTTP/1.1 [3]
>>>>>>>     Sometimes Web Resources are just called "Resources".  In
>>>>>>>     contexts, this can cause unnecessary confusion.  The
>>>> is
>>>>>>>     related to the distinction between URLs (which identify Web
>>>>>>>     Resources) and URIs (which identify Resources in general),
>>>>>>>     discussed inhttp://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3305#page-3

>>>>>>>     [1]http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3986

>>>>>>>     [2]
>>>> http://www.w3.org/TR/rdf11-concepts/#resources-and-statements

>>>>>>>     [3]

>>>>>>> I hope that works for folks.    Bernadette made some other
>>>> so
>>>>>>> we're going to ask the WG for approval again before publishing.
>>>> I'll
>>>>>>> be sending along a pointer to the new version and the diffs once
>>>>>>> have it passing pubrules.
>>>>>>>          -- Sandro

Sent from my Android phone with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

Received on Thursday, 23 May 2013 10:50:01 UTC

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