Re: EOCred: Identify the level of a credential

Again, a short comment because of the time,

On 16/02/18 17:42, Richard Wallis wrote:
> Based on similar experiences in other Schema.org extension areas, when 
> it has become complex/difficult to gain consensus on a particular 
> point, especially with an initial proposal:
>
> I suggest that we agree on a property name for this (these) concepts 
> and create it with a range of Text and a suitable, not too specific, 
> description.
>
I think we are close to consensus, and I think that consensus depends on 
some level of precision. Also as Nate said level make most sense when 
defined in relation to each other. Describing this level with reference 
to something like SCQF makes sense to people, describing it with 
relation to a vaguer term like "Bachelors degree" caused confusion. This 
seems like a perfect match to DefinedTerm / DefinedTermSets.

Phil


> After some use in the real world, we can then review that usage and 
> come up with enhanced propert(ies) definition, range, etc. as part of 
> a further following proposal.
>
> At this current stage translating the forgoing discussions in this 
> email trail into a concise description, that will be understandable to 
> the Schema,org community that will receive, and hopefully accept, our 
> proposals seems a challenge too far for this initial release.
>
> ~Richard
>
> Richard Wallis
> Founder, Data Liberate
> http://dataliberate.com
> Linkedin: http://www.linkedin.com/in/richardwallis
> Twitter: @rjw
>
> On 16 February 2018 at 17:39, Nate Otto <nate@ottonomy.net 
> <mailto:nate@ottonomy.net>> wrote:
>
>     Thanks for digging in to get more precise on level here.
>
>     I like how the SCQF reasons about levels of accomplishment. A
>     Credential can recognize a level of accomplishment, a level of
>     performance, or both. A Course could be "at" a level of
>     accomplishment in terms of difficulty or prerequisite knowledge &
>     skills. These are good use cases to target, and if I think of
>     "educationalLevel", this would be the sense of level that would
>     fit best, versus "level of performance", even though it would be
>     possible to split hairs further between the two categories I
>     started with, which we could abbreviate to "accomplishment level
>     recognized" and "accomplishment level required".
>
>     This vocabulary's ability to describe level of accomplishment
>     should be distinct from trying to talk about level of performance
>     and not use the same property, in my opinion.
>
>     Fritz,
>     I'm a little wary of "A string, term or URL". That's amazingly
>     broad to the point where it would likely make it very difficult to
>     serve the comparison use cases.
>
>     What feels important to me about understanding the level of
>     accomplishment of a credential is its position relative to other
>     credentials, learning opportunities, etc. I am not confident I get
>     that across a range of credentials unless they all use specific
>     URLs pointing to level definitions like the ones from the SCQF.
>
>     On one hand, one string property is nice and simple, on the other
>     hand, it doesn't serve comparison use cases well unless all the
>     credentials you'd like to compare use a very specific scheme
>     established outside the scope of this vocabulary known to the
>     consumer.
>
>     Maybe I changed my mind on using alignment, particularly because
>     AlignmentObject already has the "alignmentType" property, which
>     includes "educationalLevel" as an option. We could suggest
>     something like this, adding a numerical levelNumber property and
>     using a URL either for educationalFramework or targetUrl (a little
>     wary of targetUrl because I would think that should represent a
>     URL of the exact level that alignment is desired for, but maybe
>     somebody can ease my mind on this point)
>
>     {
>     "@context": "http://schema.org",
>     "@type": "Credential",
>     "alignment": [{
>     "educationalFramework": "http://pinballsorcerers.org/levels/2
>     <http://pinballsorcerers.org/levels/2>",
>     "alignmentType": "educationalLevel",
>     "levelNumber": 2
>     },
>     {
>     "educationalFramework":
>     "https://ec.europa.eu/ploteus/content/descriptors-page
>     <https://ec.europa.eu/ploteus/content/descriptors-page>",
>     "alignmentType": "educationalLevel",
>     "levelNumber": 7
>     }
>     ]
>     }
>
>     It does seems like we're not going to be able to model this nearly
>     as well to serve comparison use cases with a bare text string.
>     Only human eyeballs could make sense of the difference between
>
>     "educationalLevel": "Pinball Wizard Level 1: Nub" and
>     "educationalLevel": "Pinball Wizard Level 6: Ultimate Extra Baller"
>
>     Nate
>
>

-- 

Phil Barker <http://people.pjjk.net/phil>. http://people.pjjk.net/phil
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