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[MINUTES] W3C CCG Verifiable Credentials for Education Task Force Call - 2021-03-15 12pm ET

From: W3C CCG Chairs <w3c.ccg@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 11:45:28 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: <6050fcc8.1c69fb81.25b5b.a1e3@mx.google.com>
Thanks to Brent Shambaugh for scribing this week! The minutes
for this week's CCG Verifiable Credentials for Education Task Force telecon are now available:

https://w3c-ccg.github.io/meetings/2021-03-15-vc-education 

Full text of the discussion follows for W3C archival purposes.
Audio from the meeting is available as well (link provided below).

----------------------------------------------------------------
CCG Verifiable Credentials for Education Task Force Telecon Minutes for 2021-03-15

Agenda:
  https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-credentials/2021Mar/0073.html
Topics:
  1. Introductions & Reintroductions
  2. Announcements & Reminders
  3. Milestone 1 (High level concepts) Checkin
  4. Milestone 2 (Issuer) Checkin
Organizer:
  Kim Hamilton Duffy and Wayne Chang and Heather Vescent
Scribe:
  Brent Shambaugh
Present:
  Kim Hamilton Duffy, Anthony Camilleri, Brent Shambaugh, Kayode 
  Ezike, Nate Otto, Phil Long, Keith Kowal, Stuart Sutton, Franki 
  Schafrik, Adam Lemmon, Dmitri Zagidulin, Jim Goodell, John 
  Gasper, Jeff McCullough, Jim Kelly, Juan Caballero, Kerri Lemoie, 
  Marty Reed, Simone Ravaoli, Matt Lisle, James Chartrand, Stuart 
  Freeman, Timothy Ruff, Taylor Kendall, David Ward, Jarlath 
  O'Carroll, Nick Hathaway
Audio:
  https://w3c-ccg.github.io/meetings/2021-03-15/audio.ogg


Topic: Introductions & Reintroductions

<kimhd> Nothing

Topic: Announcements & Reminders

<kimhd> IIW  
Kim Hamilton Duffy: 
  https://www.eventbrite.com/e/internet-identity-workshop-iiwxxxii-32-2021a-tickets-131551119941?aff=ebdssbonlinesearch
<kimhd> Submit use cases!

Topic: Milestone 1 (High level concepts) Checkin

<kimhd> Discussion follows.
Anthony Camilleri:  Discussing these concepts for awhile, and 
  these are the concepts. Does anyone need a quick reminder 
  overview of these concepts. I will take silence as good. Does 
  anyone want to add a concept? [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton 
  Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  Let's go and dive into descriptions and let's 
  go one by one. It currently reads an activity. An activity 
  describes something. So and activity describes something someone 
  has done, conducted a mooc, ..., spent 6 years working as a lion 
  trainer, I love our examples. Does everyone agree with this 
  activity. Let's start with [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Brent Shambaugh is scribing.
Anthony Camilleri:  The extent seems to be an involvement. this 
  is someone who has spent 6 years being a lion tamer, but is no 
  [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  The idea is to plan current enrollment or 
  current activity or so on. I don't think the high level concept. 
  When we go to describe what is in an activity... activity can 
  contain sub activity.... [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  If I want to describe what a lion tamer has 
  done during those years, I don't think I should limit. [scribe 
  assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Kayode Ezike:  During a lion tamer you can acquire activities, 
  you can also be involve, you can terminate but you can still have 
  the activity credentials you've acquired... [scribe assist by Kim 
  Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  I would argue that key ... it depends on how 
  we model,, the activity is tied to verbs...you worked as a lion 
  tamer...you are student...you are a member of the association... 
  [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  I am trying to keep this at a high level, if 
  we are going to think about distintiction.... I wonder if 
  involvement....involvment more about describing role than 
  activity. [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Nate Otto:  Having opened this ... career as a lion tamer as 
  something that someone ... a role or [scribe assist by Kim 
  Hamilton Duffy]
Phil Long:  That's a key thing, thinking about circumstances ... 
  person involved in it now, or is someow past. A classic, is I am 
  student, currently in, or is it something I took 4 years ago. 
  [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Nate Otto:  Activity doesn't neccessarily have an expiration 
  date. [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  I have been comments about expiration... make 
  sure it is still there....dump at the bottom page. invovlement 
  describes current and future role in organization. [scribe assist 
  by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Phil Long:  What is the... [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  Thinking ...is  (???) [scribe assist by Kim 
  Hamilton Duffy]
Phil Long:  That makes a lot more sense [scribe assist by Kim 
  Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  Something someone has a result of 
  participating. my only comment is compentancy is a certain set of 
  word. hundreds of ... the only one I am asking is can we be okay 
  with competancy and forever hold out piece. In that case are we 
  okay with, I also typing as we write. can one add an info block 
  of activity. [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Nate Otto:  I am a little bit uncomfortable that competancy may 
  arise from an activity that may be defined. Compentency ... 
  [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  Can you type [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton 
  Duffy]
Keith Kowal:  Wouldn't it be easier to start with terms from 
  credential engine... apprentinceship [scribe assist by Kim 
  Hamilton Duffy]
Stuart Sutton:  Apprenticeship can be [scribe assist by Kim 
  Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  These ... would you consider earning a 
  participation badge a competancy.... [scribe assist by Kim 
  Hamilton Duffy]
Phil Long:  I would consider the ability to run a marathon to be 
  a competancy. run the marathon 30 years ago or last week. earning 
  the badge is a recognition type. [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton 
  Duffy]
Phil Long:  I would agree that I would not consider them 
  competncies.... we understnad that there may be many 
  definitions...we [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Nate Otto:  This bucket [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  Reaching a certain level of achievement ... 
  we need competanct recognition as certain copetancey or skill ... 
  this seems very logical skill [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton 
  Duffy]
Phil Long:  Someone say to look a comptetancy from a ce 
  defition...I suppose tht could be put at the bottom as part of 
  the parking lot notes. [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Nate Otto:  Be the same defintion pretty wall.. [scribe assist by 
  Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Nate Otto:  Copy and paste.. [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton 
  Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  Would be happy updating the entire ctdl 
  defition, but I will leave that [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton 
  Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  (Don't know about the us) arguing about 
  outcome vs. skill, but I agree that both keeps everyone happy 
  [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  Comment now and then we will .. [scribe 
  assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  And then this leaves us with recognition 
  type. [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  Okay this is , this is the point where 
  according to the rules of this meeting I have to leave you, and 
  then kimhd will come...all we have left is subject and issuer... 
  this will work quite elegantly I hope [scribe assist by Kim 
  Hamilton Duffy]
Franki Schafrik:  Looking at the term profiency...we were trying 
  to use profiency term, I have a particular outcome, bachelors of 
  engineering doesn't mean I am at the same level as my peers 
  [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Nate Otto:  Sounds like a profiency is a bit closer to 
  competancy... not necessary to put proficiency in recognition 
  type... [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  It is 15 minutes left, they seem to be going 
  well. they seem to be deep in debate [scribe assist by Kim 
  Hamilton Duffy]
Franki Schafrik:  Additional comment as a data person, and not as 
  someone with a background in education, at least as we do an 
  electonic learning record, someone audited a class and then they 
  come bakc later and take the exams [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton 
  Duffy]
Franki Schafrik:  Go back...which one leads to the grrested 
  profiency [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Nate Otto:  Take out of definition, because these are high level 
  concepts. don't want to deal with this at this point. [scribe 
  assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  What might go int oa defintion type or 
  competancy....not say ... lower level than high level? [scribe 
  assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  Same thing, type at the bottom so we don't 
  lose it... I would super appreciate it... [scribe assist by Kim 
  Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  Subject and issuer. subject is the clearest 
  possible so if you agree we ... the subject of the ... is the 
  subject of the credentials.... guardianship... [scribe assist by 
  Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  Come to issuer. we are not going. we need to 
  make sure that the issuer describes the organization... varying 
  from the 23c defition. making claims about the subject. the 
  issuer signing the credential is not neccasrily the person who 
  ...sorry mental block ...the organization who is making the claim 
  about the student...IT ...signing the crednail...  issuer the 
  organization issuring the credential (not it they don't know 
  anything) ... would be [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Keith Kowal:  Would be problematic to move awat from the2 w3c 
  defintion... I think we have that with the signer. the issuer is 
  the one who [scribe assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]
Kim Hamilton Duffy:  We were right at the good stuff and we 
  wanted to power through... we introduced the idea that name is 
  actually required.. the other key part is we made progress on 
  multiple issuers. you can create emergent with multiple issuer. 
  then we defined with custom joined issuer types. if you see this 
  type...relying would see multiple sig...trust uiver a or royal 
  college of B...if they want to do both...we just say expect an 
  array of signatures.. nothing: essentially finished 6 
  concepts...put more work on distinguishing work vs 
  involvement...competancy as stayed same.... recognition type now 
  particular level of achievement.... employment, actucuty biw 
  someonething someone has done. involvement now role. recogition 
  type... defintion type now ...formal recognition type... sibject 
  we didn't touch ... issuer orgnanziat [scribe assist by Kim 
  Hamilton Duffy]
Phil Long:  Should it be called recognition, think about possible 
  types..recognition on its own should be [scribe assist by Kim 
  Hamilton Duffy]
Anthony Camilleri:  Then we will try it for recognition alone... 
  basiclaly is the next meeting is we should adopt the PR. [scribe 
  assist by Kim Hamilton Duffy]

Topic: Milestone 2 (Issuer) Checkin

Kim Hamilton Duffy: Updated PR is here: 
  https://github.com/w3c-ccg/vc-ed-models/pull/37
Received on Tuesday, 16 March 2021 18:45:44 UTC

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