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Minutes for Monday, 4 January 2016 WAI-PF ARIA Authoring Practices Guide Taskforce

From: Michiel Bijl <michiel@agosto.nl>
Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2016 01:06:08 +0100
Message-Id: <8BF30482-169F-4ED6-BA0D-6583026D1564@agosto.nl>
To: ARIA Working Group <public-aria@w3.org>
Minutes for todays APG call can be found as text in this e-mail and at this url: http://www.w3.org/2016/01/04-aria-apg-minutes.html <http://www.w3.org/2016/01/04-aria-apg-minutes.html>

Thanks to Ann for scribing!

—Michiel

   [1]W3C

      [1] http://www.w3.org/

                               - DRAFT -

            WAI-PF ARIA Authoring Practices Guide Taskforce

04 Jan 2016

   See also: [2]IRC log

      [2] http://www.w3.org/2016/01/04-aria-apg-irc

Attendees

   Present
          AnnAbbott, Bryan_Garaventa, JF, James_Nurthen,
          Jon_Gunderson, Leonie_Watson, Matt_King, Michael_Cooper,
          Michiel_Bijl

   Regrets
   Chair
          Matt_King

   Scribe
          AnnAbbott

Contents

     * [3]Topics
         1. [4]Review example of radio group pattern
            https://rawgit.com/a11ydoer/aria/jemma/practices/examp
            les/radio/radio.html
         2. [5]Review draft of landmark design pattern (John/Ann)
         3. [6]Discuss example development work in progress
     * [7]Summary of Action Items
     * [8]Summary of Resolutions
     __________________________________________________________

   <jamesn> Happy New Year everyone

   <jongund> thnaks

   <scribe> scribe: AnnAbbott

   <jamesn> scribe: annabbott

Review example of radio group pattern
[9]https://rawgit.com/a11ydoer/aria/jemma/practices/examples/radio/ra
dio.html

      [9] https://rawgit.com/a11ydoer/aria/jemma/practices/examples/radio/radio.html

   <MichielBijl> Teleconference cheat sheet:
   [10]http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/wiki/Teleconference_cheat_sheet

     [10] http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/wiki/Teleconference_cheat_sheet

Review draft of landmark design pattern (John/Ann)

   <jongund>
   [11]https://rawgit.com/jongund/aria/master/practices/aria-pract
   ices.html

     [11] https://rawgit.com/jongund/aria/master/practices/aria-practices.html

   <LJWatson> Fragment ID for 2. Landmark design patterns
   [12]https://rawgit.com/jongund/aria/master/practices/aria-pract
   ices.html#aria_landmark

     [12] https://rawgit.com/jongund/aria/master/practices/aria-practices.html#aria_landmark

   Matt thinks widgets should come first, then landmarks

   Ann does not agree

   Matt: start with an example page
   ... refer to Section 4

   <jamesn> rrsq+

   JF: questions whether all content must be within appropriate
   landmark

   Ann: guidance per RSchwerdtfeger

   <Zakim> LJWatson, you wanted to ask about clarity of advice
   regarding HTML5.

   <Zakim> JF, you wanted to ask about editorial of the content,
   specifically "it is imperative that all content reside in a
   semantically meaningful landmark or content will be orphaned
   and

   Matt: browsers and screen readers all handle landmarks
   differently

   <mck> Without landmark roles, keyboard navigation is limited to
   form controls and anchor elements via "endless" tab navigation.
   The use of landmarks roles support

   JamesN: all content musts be in landmarks IF using landmarks

   Matt: landmarks don't help kbd nav except for screen reader
   users

   JGund: landmarks should not be required
   ... landmarks do not solve kbd issues
   ... desire for something simple about landmarks - how to
   balance/support?

   LWatson: what complexity?

   JGund: test tools have lots of rules re: landmarks and HTML 5
   has added to complexity

   <jongund>
   [13]http://fae20.cita.illinois.edu/rulesets/ARIA_STRICT/rc/#id_
   h2_ID_LANDMARKS

     [13] http://fae20.cita.illinois.edu/rulesets/ARIA_STRICT/rc/#id_h2_ID_LANDMARKS

   JF: problem is difference betwen rule and best practice
   ... difference between MUST and SHOULD

   Matt: no MUST in APG tho required is loosely used
   ... pivot point is with ARIA 1.1 and our goal is publish APG
   with ARIA 1.1
   ... APG is guidance, not rules
   ... Jon/Ann make bulleted list of proposed items as basis of
   next discussion

   JGund: rework current so there is something for others to
   comment/review

   JF: not table of contents, but table of structure

   Matt: lead with examples where ever possible

   JGund: example pages is good idea

   Matt: no meeting on Jan 18
   ... review landmarks on Jan 25

   JGund: doesn't think we want to be in business of
   listing/cataloging tools

   Ann: agrees

   JGund: instead rely on/propose to W3C tools group

   Matt: would recommend getting rid of toolkit references

   <JF> +1 to BRyan's suggestion

   Bryan: simply include URL to W3C tools group

   <JF> Bryan, shadi's email is: shadi@w3.org

   <JF> ACTION: bgaraventa1979 to reach out to Shadi to establish
   a link for ARIA tools to be included in the APG due in 2 weeks
   [recorded in
   [14]http://www.w3.org/2016/01/04-aria-apg-minutes.html#action01
   ]

   <trackbot> Error finding 'bgaraventa1979'. You can review and
   register nicknames at
   <[15]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users>.

     [15] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users

   <JF> ACTION: Brian Garaventa to reach out to Shadi to establish
   a link for ARIA tools to be included in the APG due in 2 weeks
   [recorded in
   [16]http://www.w3.org/2016/01/04-aria-apg-minutes.html#action02
   ]

   <trackbot> Error finding 'Brian'. You can review and register
   nicknames at <[17]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users>.

     [17] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/users

   zachim, take up item 3

   zachim, take up agenda item 3

Discuss example development work in progress

   <JF> ACTION: garaventa to reach out to Shadi to establish a
   link for ARIA tools to be included in the APG due in 2 weeks
   [recorded in
   [18]http://www.w3.org/2016/01/04-aria-apg-minutes.html#action03
   ]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-1764 - Reach out to shadi to
   establish a link for aria tools to be included in the apg due
   in 2 weeks [on Bryan Garaventa - due 2016-01-11].

   <bgaraventa1979> John, I think my nick is bgaraventa

   JGund: Jemma isn't here today so hasn't had a chance to meet

   Matt: look at menu and radio group next week (1/11)

   JGund: will work with Jemma on Friday

   Matt: Michiel - will you be ready to review alert next week?

   Michiel: yes

   <jamesn> 1

   Matt: next week toolbar review

   Michiel: should we have breadcrumb design pattern?

   JamesN: yes

   <JF> Matt asked about "toolbar" - I don't see a reference in
   WCAG, but UAAG references it as a single word: 2.3.4 Present
   Direct Commands in User Interface: The user can have any direct
   commands in the UA user interface (e.g. keyboard shortcuts) be
   presented with their associated user interface controls (e.g.
   "Ctrl+S" displayed on the "Save" menu item and toolbar button).
   (Level AA)

   <MichielBijl> Here is a link to the GitHub issue for bread
   crumbs: [19]https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/130

     [19] https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/130

   <JF> [discussion] editorial is to use "toolbar" (all one word)

   <MichielBijl> rssagent, make minutes

Summary of Action Items

   [NEW] ACTION: bgaraventa1979 to reach out to Shadi to establish
   a link for ARIA tools to be included in the APG due in 2 weeks
   [recorded in
   [20]http://www.w3.org/2016/01/04-aria-apg-minutes.html#action01
   ]
   [NEW] ACTION: Brian Garaventa to reach out to Shadi to
   establish a link for ARIA tools to be included in the APG due
   in 2 weeks [recorded in
   [21]http://www.w3.org/2016/01/04-aria-apg-minutes.html#action02
   ]
   [NEW] ACTION: garaventa to reach out to Shadi to establish a
   link for ARIA tools to be included in the APG due in 2 weeks
   [recorded in
   [22]http://www.w3.org/2016/01/04-aria-apg-minutes.html#action03
   ]

Summary of Resolutions

   [End of minutes]
     __________________________________________________________


    Minutes formatted by David Booth's [23]scribe.perl version
    1.144 ([24]CVS log)
    $Date: 2016/01/04 19:30:36 $
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     [24] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/

Scribe.perl diagnostic output

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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Found Scribe: AnnAbbott
Found Scribe: annabbott
Inferring ScribeNick: annabbott
Default Present: Michael_Cooper, jongund, JF, AnnAbbott, Bryan_Garaventa
Present: AnnAbbott Bryan_Garaventa JF James_Nurthen Jon_Gunderson Leonie
_Watson Matt_King Michael_Cooper Michiel_Bijl
Got date from IRC log name: 04 Jan 2016
Guessing minutes URL: [26]http://www.w3.org/2016/01/04-aria-apg-minutes.
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People with action items: bgaraventa1979 brian garaventa

     [26] http://www.w3.org/2016/01/04-aria-apg-minutes.html

WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines.
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Received on Tuesday, 5 January 2016 00:07:01 UTC

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