[Minutes] 2 Feb 2004 TAG teleconf (xmlChunk-44, I18N issues)

Hello,

Minutes of the TAG's 2 Feb 2004 teleconf are available
as HTML [1] and as text below.

 _ Ian

[1] http://www.w3.org/2004/02/02-tag-summary.html

========================================================

                 Minutes of 2 February 2004 TAG teleconference

1. Administrative (20min)

    1. Roll call: SW, TBL, DC (Scribe), NW, CL, PC, RF, MJ, IJ. Regrets:
       DO, TB
       The TAG welcomed the newest TAG participant: Mario Jeckle. Mario
       is involved in Web Services Choreography, some Semantic Web stuff,
       and a Grid services project, as well as other Working Groups (XML
       Schema, WSA, DI, XMLP).
    2. Resolved to accept minutes of the [8]26 Jan teleconf
    3. Accepted this [9]agenda
    4. Reminder: No meeting 16 Feb.
    5. Proposed next meeting: 9 Feb 2004 Videoconf. See [10]agenda
       proposal from SW
       [DanC_desk]

      [8] http://www.w3.org/2004/01/26-tag-summary.html
      [9] http://www.w3.org/2004/02/02-tag.html
     [10] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Feb/0001.html

                ... discussion of whether namespaceDocument-8 merits
                discussion time... seems to merit ~ 1/2 hr...
                ... noting TBray's regrets
                SW reviews 9Feb agenda proposal... we seem to be closing
                about 2 or 3 issues per year; perhaps clustering would
                help
                DC: initial reaction: let's move admin out of our time
                together
                SW: pls help me flesh out the technical stuff. DC: will
                do/try
                PC: how about pending last call comments?
                DanC_desk: please don't put Ian in the critical path for
                responding to comments

  1.1 Technical Plenary

    1. Liaisons: In principle agreements and scheduling (see [11]email
       from Stuart):
         1. I18N
         2. XML Schema
         3. SVG
         4. HTML. See [12]notes from IJ
         5. Voice. See [13]notes from IJ
         6. XML Core
         7. WSDL
    2. Action SW 2003/11/15: Take to tech plenary committee the TAG's
       proposal. See [14]proposal from Stuart.
    3. TAG ftf meeting observer requests (see [15]email from SW)
    4. [16]TAG 2 Mar 2004 ftf meeting page

     [11] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Jan/0080.html
     [12] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Jan/0078.html
     [13] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Jan/0087.html
     [14] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Jan/0072.html
     [15] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Jan/0074.html
     [16] http://www.w3.org/2004/03/02-tag-mtg.html

   [DanC_desk]

          SW: CL, do you expect I18N stuff to merit ftf time in Cannes?
          CL: no, I suppose not
          SW: SVG?
          CL: the SVG WG wants to meet and talk about linking, mixed
          namespaces
          ACTION CL: propose a time for SVG/TAG to meet in Cannes
          SW: XML Core? I suppose not

   [Zakim]
          Chris, you wanted to say "I thought we decided not to discuss
          linking at tp"

   [DanC_desk]
          CL, RF express interest in presenting webarch to Tech Plenary
          SW: I expect TAG members participate in other panels for the
          next few hours
          1.1/3 TAG ftf meeting observer requests
          SW: sent mail; no negative commentary; intend to say OK to the
          few requests I see
          1.1/4 TAG 2 Mar 2004 ftf meeting page. noted.

  1.2 TAG meeting schedule in 2004

    1. Action PC 2004/01/05: Propose meeting schedule for next 4 (or so)
       TAG ftf meetings. Due: 23 Jan 2004. ([17]Proposal from PC)

     [17] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Jan/0077.html

   [DanC_desk]
          PC in sum: May (week before AC/WWW conf), ...
          PC I see responses from just three...
          CL I think I replied...
          SW: in sum, ftf May, July, Nov

   [Chris]
          CL actually replied privately to Paul and will send a reply to
          the list

   [Norm]
          Note that XML 2004 is in November this year

   [DanC_desk]
          TBL: possible conflict with Ottowa

   [timbl]
          [18]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Jan/0077.html

     [18] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Jan/0077.html

   [DanC_desk]
          NW: 12-14 May is what I see from PC's mail
          SW: I see conflicts with that
          NW: I propose 24-26 May.

   [Stuart]
          [19]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Jan/0097.html

     [19] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Jan/0097.html

   [DanC_desk]
          "Wed-Fri May 12-14, F2F, Location TBD, (host TBD)" --
          [20]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Jan/0097.html
          PC: so we're still collecting input.

     [20] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Jan/0097.html

2. Technical (70min)

   See also [21]open actions by owner and [22]open issues.

     [21] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/actions_owner.html
     [22] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html?view=normal&closed=1

  2.1 Update on findings

     * [23]qnameAsId-18
          + 14 Jan 2004 draft finding "[24]Using Qualified Names (QNames)
            as Identifiers in Content"
          + Action CL, TB, TBL 2004/01/26: Read finding.
            CL, TBL: No progress.
     * [25]contentTypeOverride-24:
          + 27 Jan 2004 draft finding "[26]Client handling of MIME
            headers"
          + See [27]comments from SW
          + See [28]comments from RF (arrived after meeting).
          + PC: I'm working on IJ's request for specific wording.
            Discussion of whether choice of browser is relevant to giving
            assent
     * [29]siteData-36
          + "[30]There is no such thing as a Web site"

     [23] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html#qnameAsId-18
     [24] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/qnameids-2004-01-14
     [25] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/open-summary.html#contentTypeOverride-24
     [26] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/mime-respect-20040127.html
     [27] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2004Feb/0007.html
     [28] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2004Feb/0008.html
     [29] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html#siteData-36
     [30] http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2004/01/08/WebSite36

  2.2 New issue: xmlChunk-44

     * Action TBL 2004/01/05: Propose a new issue regarding
       canonicalization to www-tag ([31]Done). PC to respond with
       pointers to relevant specifications ([32]Done).

     [31] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2004Jan/0013.html
     [32] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2004Jan/0015.html

   [DanC_desk]
          SW: I wonder if this is something we should perhaps encourage
          XML Core to take this up
          TBL: yes, that is the question...
          TBL reviews [33]0013...]

     [33] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2004Jan/0013.html

   [DanC_desk]
          timbl: [... coordination... which group needs what? etc. ...]

   [Norm]
          Can I suggest that someone setup a meeting with SemWeb CG,
          I18N, and me?

   [DanC_desk]
          TBL and PC discuss canonicalization, equivalence ...
          PC: ... fn:deep-equal in XQuery ... one man's equal is another
          man's unequal...
          ... more discussion ...
          ... schema-aware canonicalization, wisdom thereof...
          DC parenthetically: I'm tempted to summarize input from PC and
          TBL as: yes, pls make this a TAG issue. clearly they're happy
          to talk about it in the presence of other TAG members.

   [timbl]
          Yes, defining a more acceptable canonicalization which picks
          up, for example, the language, base, and namespaces and puts if
          necessary a wrapper is a possible solution to this problem.

   [Zakim]
          DanC_desk, you wanted to offer to think out loud

   [timbl]
          Straw poll: New issue?
          Defn of issue:
          [34]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2004Jan/0013.ht
          ml

     [34] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2004Jan/0013.html

   [timbl]
          Need for a canonicaliztion at the XML + NS syntax level.

   [Chris]
          yes, that is clear enough (the discussion on the telcon was not
          clear enough to poll on)

   [DanC_desk]
          CL: based on 113, looks worth a TAG issue

   [Ian_]
          (next available # is 44)

   [Chris]
          its an issue. 'how long is a piece of string' is an issue, but
          that doesn't mean there is a single answer.
          Is the answer to "is x=y" is "why do you need to know"

   [Ian]
          Description? Short name?

   [DanC_desk]
          PROPOSED: xmlChunk-44

   [timbl]
          Support for XMLChunk-44: NW, RF, PC, DC, TBL, SW, MJ, CL

   [DanC_desk]
          RESOLVED. there is a new issue: xmlChunk-44

   [timbl]
          A new issue is born, and takes its place in the crowd of
          issues.
          Title: "Chunk of XML" - Canonicalization and equality

   [Chris]
          +1 to meeting with xml core

   [DanC_desk]
          PC: reconsider our disinclination to meet with XML Core in
          Cannes?

   [timbl]
          Metadata for issues list: iss:xmlChunk_44 dc:title "Chunk of
          XML - Canonicalization and equality"; mtg:raised
          <[35]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2004Jan/0013.h
          tml>; mtg:discussed <>.

     [35] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2004Jan/0013.html

   [Norm]

   ACTION NW: Coordinate joint meeting with XML Core, notably around
   xmlChunk-44.

  2.3 Follow-up on Internationalization Issues

     * [36]charmodReview-17
         1. [37]actions
         2. TAG finding related to adoption of Charmod? See [38]mail from
            TBL
     * [39]URIEquivalence-15
     * [40]IRIEverywhere-27

     [36] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html#charmodReview-17
     [37] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/actions.html#charmodReview-17
     [38] http://www.w3.org/mid/361483C6-96E6-11D7-9C47-000393914268@w3.org
     [39] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html?view=normal&closed=1#URIEquivalence-15
     [40] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html#IRIEverwhere-27

   [Chris]

          [41]http://www.w3.org/2002/06/charmod-lastcall2/

     [41] http://www.w3.org/2002/06/charmod-lastcall2/

   [Stuart]
          [42]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Feb/0008.html

     [42] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Feb/0008.html

   [DanC_desk]
          CL: reviews 0008, proposes we accept C128

   [Norm]
          That was from long ago, Stuart. It sounded reasonable to me.

   [DanC_desk]
          ACTION CL: respond as proposed
          DC: If we made a decision, Connolly abstained.

     _________________________________________________________________

   The TAG did not discuss topics below this line at this meeting.

  2.4 Follow-up on namespaceDocument-8

     * [43]namespaceDocument-8
         1. [44]RDDL2 Background from Tim Bray.
         2. [45]grokRDDL.xsl mapping to RDF from Dan Connolly.

     [43] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html#namespaceDocument-8
     [44] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2004Jan/0045.html
     [45] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2004Jan/0026.html

3. Issues

   Issues that are open and that we expect to close by the end of last
   call:
     * [46]rdfmsQnameUriMapping-6
     * [47]whenToUseGet-7
     * [48]contentTypeOverride-24

     [46] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html?view=normal&closed=1#rdfmsQnameUriMapping-6
     [47] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html?view=normal&closed=1#whenToUseGet-7
     [48] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html?view=normal&closed=1#contentTypeOverride-24

4. Status report on these findings

   See also [49]TAG findings
     * [50]abstractComponentRefs-37:
          + 30 Oct 2003 draft finding "[51]Abstract Component References"
     * [52]contentPresentation-26:
          + 30 June 2003 draft finding "[53]Separation of semantic and
            presentational markup, to the extent possible, is
            architecturally sound"
     * [54]metadataInURI-31

     [49] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/findings
     [50] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html#abstractComponentRefs-37
     [51] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/abstractComponentRefs-20031030
     [52] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/open-summary.html#contentPresentation-26
     [53] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/contentPresentation-26-20030630.html
     [54] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/open-summary.html#metadataInURI-31

5 Other action items

     * Action RF 2003/10/08: Explain "identifies" in RFC 2396.
     * Action DC 2003/11/15: Follow up on KeepPOSTRecords with Janet Daly
       on how to raise awareness of this point (which is in CUAP).
     * Action CL 2003/10/27: Draft XML mime type thingy with Murata-san

     _________________________________________________________________


    Ian Jacobs for Stuart Williams and TimBL
    Last modified: $Date: 2004/02/03 04:11:33 $

-- 
Ian Jacobs (ij@w3.org)   http://www.w3.org/People/Jacobs
Tel:                     +1 718 260-9447

Received on Monday, 2 February 2004 23:26:15 UTC