- From: Chris Lilley <chris@w3.org>
- Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 18:12:35 +0100
- To: www-style@w3.org
Hello www-style,
Minutes are at
http://www.w3.org/2009/03/25-css-minutes.html
and below as text
[NEW] ACTION: everyone come up with an opinion on Bert's email [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/03/25-css-minutes.html#action01]
RESOLUTION: Make a joint CSS SVG task force, Doug to set it up, specs of common interest to send comments there, will be *public read-write*
RESOLUTION: publish updated WD of css3-layout
RESOLUTION: keep grammar and prose as is for 2.1, defer issue to css3
CSS WG telcon
25 Mar 2009
[2]Agenda
[2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2009JanMar/0204.html
See also: [3]IRC log
[3] http://www.w3.org/2009/03/25-css-irc
Attendees
Present
glazou, fantasai, +1.858.216.aaaa, plinss, Bert, sylvaing,
alexmog, ChrisL, Melinda_Grant, arronei, +47.21.65.aabb,
Howcome, Shepazu, Cesar_Acebal
Regrets
Steve_Zilles, David_Baron, Tona_Henderson, Emily_Walters,
David_Singer
Chair
Daniel
Scribe
fantasai
Contents
* [4]Topics
1. [5]Agenda
2. [6]F2F Meeting in the Fall
3. [7]Agenda Items
4. [8]Follow-up on @import
5. [9]Implementation Status Reports
6. [10]:not() and pseudo-elements
7. [11]CSS+SVG Task Force
8. [12]Publishing Template Layout module
9. [13]Wording for Issue 24
10. [14]Others
* [15]Summary of Action Items
_________________________________________________________
wow
Skype works over this connection
I am so impressed
<glazou> fantasai: : so you'll be on the call?
I think so
unless the connection to w3c is significantly worse than to skype
test call
<glazou> ok
<glazou> Zakim: IPCaller is fantasai
melinda, I made a number of edits to css3-page, but I haven't
checked in yet
melinda, don't have net access under linux from here, hopefully will
get a chance next week
<melinda> fantasai, k, cool.
<scribe> ScribeNick: fantasai
fantasai doesn't have email access this week
<melinda> fantasai, I may have a few locally that we'll need to
merge in...
Agenda
F2F Meeting in the Fall
glazou: deadline for 18th of March for TPAC was extended to April 2
... The number of groups planning to meet is already above
expectations
... joint meeting with SVG Open?
chrisl: That was a fallback if the main meeting didn't go through
glazou: I guess we have to find another location for the f2f
... We still have time to find another spot for the TPAC
alexmog: Why?
glazou: THere's not enough room at TPAC, too many groups
alexmog: I thought we were going to go with SVG Open because the
groups we wanted to meet with weren't going to be at TPAC
chrisl: They downsized the venue
Agenda Items
glazou: I was too busy to read all the comments
... Anybody have anything to add, please ask now
Bert: Is howcome's draft ready for publication or not?
... GCPM or multicol?
howcome: They're not done yet, will be done next week
Bert: css3-namespaces?
fantasai: not done yet
<glazou> shepazu: can you be on the call ?
<glazou> for item 5 on agenda
glazou: anything else?
... Sylvain?
<shepazu> sure
sylvain: We wanted to know if another CSS2.1 draft would be
published soon
<glazou> thx
sylvain: Also wanted to know if anything about test suite will be on
the agenda for June F2F
... So we know whether to budget in Arron
glazou: June F2F agenda is open for suggestions
... please suggest something more detailed than just "Test Suite"
... Holiday season starts in June, so please plan your hotels earlyu
Follow-up on @import
glazou: Is this resolved? I saw Sylvain follow-up on this on the
mailing list
sylvain: I believed we solved this in Tokyo
Implementation Status Reports
glazou: Mozilla and Antenna House posted detailed implementation
reports to www-style
<ChrisL> these are for css 2.1, or for 3?
<melinda> Chris, both
glazou: I think David Baron has in mind some coordination among
browsers
... wrt implementation of CSS features for the Web
... I encourage other browser vendors to do the same
... If Opera, Microsoft, Apple can send this information to
www-style as well, that would be very cool
:not() and pseudo-elements
glazou: There's a clarification to make in the spec
[16]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2009Mar/0193.html
[16] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2009Mar/0193.html
glazou: Sylvain posted a clarification
... I think David posted something else
<glazou>
[17]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2009Mar/0195.html
[17] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2009Mar/0195.html
glazou: fantasai also said that she expects a future version of
Selectors to accept more in :not() than a simple selectors
... Sylvain, which proposal do you prefer?
... I think David's proposal is more complete
sylvain: My proposal was just a clarification
glazou: Is everyone ok with David's proposal?
<glazou> #The negation pseudo-class, :not(X), is a functional
notation taking a simple selector (excluding the negation pseudo-
<glazou> #class itself) as an argument. It represents an element
that is not represented by the argument.
<glazou> #Note: Appending a pseudo-element to a simple selector
results in a selector; selectors are not valid negation pseudo
<glazou> #class arguments.
Peter: The note doesn't clarify that a pseudo-element by itself is
not a simple selector
fantasai proposese addding a Note that says "SInce pseudo-elements
are not simple selectors, they are not a valid argument to :not9)"
minus the typos :)
RESOLUTION: sylvain+fantasai's proposal accepted
CSS+SVG Task Force
Shepazu to summarize
Doug: This basically started as something regarding transforms and
animations
... David Singer thought it would be a good idea for general
coordination
... It would also involve animations, transitions, other little
issues that might pop up
... I'm just suggesting we make a mailing list
... So we don't have to keep cross-posting
glazou: Dean Jackson says he's ok with a mailing list, but not a
sub-group
Doug: THere isn't really any formaility to a task force
chrisl: It's just somewhere that we can post to
Melinda: My question, this has started off as being specific to
2d-3d transforms
... but then became more general
... If it was just about transofrms, then I wouldn't want to
subscribe
... If it's more general, maybe discussion of
image-fit/image-scaling
... Then I need to subscribe
... Wheres' the efficiency benefit
ChrisL: It's avoiding cross-posting and diverging threads
glazou: My problem with the separate group
... is that the wg memebers are supposed to keep track of everything
that's going on, even if it's not of direct concern to them
Doug: My concern wrt transforms, especially
... we are both working on different proposals that may end up being
the same proposal
... If people are sending feedback ...
... The SVG WG has already gotten feedback about our trnasforms
module
... It's got sent to the public SVG mailing list
... At what point are we going to be able to .. I'm concerned that
emails going to get sent to both lists
... separately
... And we're not going to coordinate
... For SVG group, we just can't track everything that flows
throught he www-style list
ChrisL: It's much more efficient for someone from the csswg to
subscribe to just the joint task force list, and not to all the svg
lists
Doug: For those of us that are subscribed to both lists, it's a big
savings for the SVG group so we dont' ahve to track everything
... I'm sure you can have the joint mailing list shoved in a filter
so it comes to your attention with CSS
... Also, if you're not interested in transforms you don't have to
mointor the list for the next few months
Melinda seems to be ok with this
glazou: Open mailing list, or just publicly-viewable
agreement on open
public read-write
discussion of what David thinks
Doug: For specifications like transforms and animations and things
like that
... That might be the default mailing list for sending comments
... I can understand why csswg might not want that, but just a
suggestion. SVG group is ok with that
Melinda: I think if the CSSWG agrees to establish that new mailing
list, I don't see why we wouldn't want to direct comments there
Doug: We could have a wiki if we wanted, I dont' think it's
necessary
discussion of names for the list
<sylvaing> svg-css-mafia
www-svg-css-coord
public-fx
RESOLUTION: Make a joint CSS SVG task force, Doug to set it up,
specs of common interest to send comments there, will be *public
read-write*
Publishing Template Layout module
Bert: I think it's time for an update
... I think I sent also the changes
... I removed the part about tabbed layout. interesting, but not so
urgent... people aren't talking about it at least
... Also updated the title
... That's why I want to publish it
fantasai: I thought it was called Template Layout MOdule?
RESOLUTION: publish updated WD of css3-layout
Wording for Issue 24
<glazou> [18]http://wiki.csswg.org/spec/css2.1#issue-24
[18] http://wiki.csswg.org/spec/css2.1#issue-24
It was accepted to fix the problem, but not exactly what wording
iirc
<glazou> hi mollydotcom
<mollydotcom> am I an hour off again?
yeah
<glazou> yes :)
fantasai:
[19]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2008Dec/0091.html
... There were two woriding proposals there
[19] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2008Dec/0091.html
<glazou> mollydotcom: leave the norwegian TZ :)
fantasai: We discussed them and Bert wanted to write another one
that was clearer on how the two interact
<mollydotcom> it's the Arizona Time Zone
<CesarAcebal> I'm afraid I have had the same error with the hour
than Molly. In Spain we are not still in Summer Time until this
weekend. Sorry!
<glazou> np CesarAcebal
fantasai: to answer Sylvain's question, we need to solve this issue
before publishing CSS2.1 again, because we regressed the text with
the last resolution
<glazou>
[20]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2009JanMar/0212.h
tml
[20] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2009JanMar/0212.html
Bert summarizes his email
<glazou> fantasai, I can't hear you
fantasai: It shouldn't be limited to selectors
... We want all statements to fall under the matching brackets rule
... including @statmeents
... I don't think the reuqirement to "match" brackets and quotes is
hard to understand, it's good enough for now I think
... but it needs to apply to statements and to declarations
<scribe> ACTION: everyone come up with an opinion on Bert's email
[recorded in
[21]http://www.w3.org/2009/03/25-css-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - everyone
Others
[22]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2009JanMar/0207.h
tml
[22] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2009JanMar/0207.html
glazou, dbaron had good comments on those
see above
linked above
[23]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2009JanMar/0207.h
tmlhttp://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2009JanMar/0207.ht
mlhttp://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2009JanMar/0207.htm
l
[23] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2009JanMar/0207.htmlhttp://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2009JanMar/0207.htmlhttp://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2009JanMar/0207.html
er
[24]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2009JanMar/0207.h
tml
[24] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-css-wg/2009JanMar/0207.html
<glazou> mollydotcom: see above
<ChrisL> it seems to be the usual way to remove things, set the
attribute to ""
<glazou>
[25]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2009Feb/0256.html
[25] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2009Feb/0256.html
dbaron's comment: I think this could be tossed out as a "not all
requirements are
expressed in the formal grammar". It's a nice-to-have (and perhaps
somewhat complicated to get right, so maybe not worth it), but I
don't think it's a bug in the spec.
glazou: another issue where the grammar is completed by the prose
... we will always have these sort of things
... not worth the time and complexity grammar to fix
peter: why not fix in css3
glazou: ok, we leave for css3.. but not 2.1
bert: which are you talking about now?
glazou: points bert at url
Bert: So far I havent' seen anything that I would like to change in
the grammar
glazou: So Yves posted at least 2 issues here
... Specifically about 2.1, do we want to change something?
RESOLUTION: keep grammar and prose as is for 2.1, defer issue to
css3
<glazou> ==> tracker
<ChrisL> adjourned
Meeting closed.
chrisl, could you also make sure last week's minutes made it to the
mailing list?
k, thanks :)
<plinss> ChrisL: +1.858 was me, don't know why Zakim listed me
twice...
<mollydotcom> Bert?
<plinss> same for Howcome, he was +47.21
<Bert> Hi Molly
<mollydotcom> Hi! I just wanted to touch base with you regarding any
web site needs
<mollydotcom> I sent an email, but I know you're busy - but I'm
available to help
<Bert> Yes, I'm going to answer. I put something on line for you to
look at.
<mollydotcom> oh good, if you could just email me now at
mollyh@opera.com for that, I'll be happy to take a look!
<mollydotcom> I'm trying to streamline all CSS WG related items into
that address now
<glazou> it should be møllyh@opera.com
<mollydotcom> Hahaha
<mollydotcom> I really wanted molly@opera.com but they couldn't do
it
<mollydotcom> my alternative was mholzschlag@opera.com
<mollydotcom> so I figured mollyh was the best middle ground :)
Summary of Action Items
[NEW] ACTION: everyone come up with an opinion on Bert's email
[recorded in
[26]http://www.w3.org/2009/03/25-css-minutes.html#action01]
[End of minutes]
--
Chris Lilley mailto:chris@w3.org
Technical Director, Interaction Domain
W3C Graphics Activity Lead
Co-Chair, W3C Hypertext CG
Received on Wednesday, 25 March 2009 17:13:02 UTC