Re: Focus visible - "unobscure" bullet

Hi Alastair,

I had a look at your example in different browsers / viewport width 
scenarios.

As written and with the fourth bullet added, this SC would be really 
difficult to evaluate as the behaviour differs in different browsers and 
viewport widths (Chrome managing to keep the focus visible whatever the 
viewport width, Edge mostly so, but Firefox suffering from the focus 
fully disappearing behind sticky content). And how to assess this when 
only a part of the focus is visible is fat from clear-cut, unfortunately.

I remember Mikes argument in the call that all four bullets must be met 
but think the implication in bullet 4 that "the item with focus is not 
entirely hidden by author-created content" seems to imply that the SC is 
CAN be met as long as some part of the element (even just the top edge) 
- and thereby only a part of its focus (if it is an outline / border)  - 
is visible. To then also apply the first bullet (minimum area) and 
conclude that content fails as there are situations where only a part of 
a thin focus outline is visible is not something I would expect the 
average reader of such an SC to do. How much is visible, under which 
conditions, in which browser? Will it add up to the surface area 
required in bullet 1 or not?

When the 4. bullet allows for such cases and these routinely violate the 
condition in the 1. bullet (unless the author has chosen a very thick 
outline, or a top bar, ior similar), I feel there is something wrong 
with the way these four bullet points stack up.
Arguing, like Mike does, that ALL four bullets need to be met makes 
assessment a very fuzzy exercise as you wuld find your meet the SC in 
some browsers all the time, in other browsers only at certain viewport 
widths, in still others (Firefox) not at all.

Detlev


Am 25.06.2020 um 00:56 schrieb Alastair Campbell:
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> Michael Gower introduced a variation on the survey question, which was 
> to add a (different) 4^th bullet aimed at preventing the sticky 
> heading/footer issue.
>
> I’d like to get the group’s opinion whether that solves the problem 
> with three examples.
>
> Given the current SC text:
>
> https://raw.githack.com/w3c/wcag/wcag22-focus-visible-enh-updates/understanding/22/focus-visible-enhanced.html
>
> Add the bullet:
>
> “Unobscured: The item with focus is not entirely hidden by 
> author-created content"
>
> (Notice this bullet applies to the element, the previous bullets apply 
> to the focus indicator.)
>
> And consider three scenarios, *which of these pass/fail*?
>
>  1. A link (and its focus indicator) that is *completely* hidden by a
>     sticky footer as you tab down.
>
>  2. A link (and its focus indicator) that is *partially* hidden by a
>     sticky footer as you tab down.
>
>  3. A focus indicator is that is hidden by it’s wrapper, permanently
>     so scrolling is not a factor.
>
> For the last scenario, I included that as part of the test page here:
>
> https://alastairc.uk/tests/wcag22-examples/sticky-footer4.html
>
> And a screenshot of the partially hidden focus indicator:
>
> Two images, one has an outer border along 2 sides.
>
> Answers to the pass/fail on the 3 scenarios would be very helpful in 
> resolving this…
>
> Kind regards,
>
> -Alastair
>
> -- 
>
> www.nomensa.com <http://www.nomensa.com/> / @alastc
>

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Detlev Fischer
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