Re: Visual indicators

If you exclude icons, how do you recognise that an icon is actionable compared to one that isn't?

When discussing this in the COGA group we had proposed an exception for “a control that is part of a group of controls that has a visual indicator for the group” to address buttons or links that are in menus or blocks of controls such as the examples given earlier in this thread. But it would require an actionable icon in a form to have an indicator.

Abi James

On 29 Apr 2020, at 21:42, David MacDonald <david100@sympatico.ca> wrote:



> AWK: That’s good, but we need to update the text of the SC

I would think that the icon is an image that indicates that it is actionable which is not position or font styling... we could make that clear in the understanding... otherwise we could throw an exception on the end


For each control that is necessary to progress through a process<https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FTR%2FWCAG21%2F%23dfn-processes&data=01%7C01%7Ca.james%40soton.ac.uk%7C8ee887b57cd544970b9008d7ec7ddff4%7C4a5378f929f44d3ebe89669d03ada9d8%7C0&sdata=2IeTama8E0LaBW8zHig7xThuS43FGrr9%2B3i03kwjJlg%3D&reserved=0>, spacing and/or font styling are not the only visual means used to convey that the control is actionable, except for actionable icons.

Cheers,

David MacDonald



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On Wed, Apr 29, 2020 at 3:34 PM Andrew Kirkpatrick <akirkpat@adobe.com<mailto:akirkpat@adobe.com>> wrote:
To address Andrew's comments.
Any icon based control would pass this because it is not relying on font. It is an icon.

AWK: That’s good, but we need to update the text of the SC then because it says:

For each control needed to progress a process, spacing and/or font styling are not used as the only visual means of conveying that the control is actionable.

A button with only an image on it can be a control to progress a process, and might be only set apart from other content by spacing. The SC doesn’t say that it is only text controls.


Cheers,
David MacDonald



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On Wed, Apr 29, 2020 at 10:54 AM Alastair Campbell <acampbell@nomensa.com<mailto:acampbell@nomensa.com>> wrote:
Hi Andrew,

Assuming that we agree on the ‘progress process’ scope, I think those are all ‘initiate’ process links, or are browse links, therefore not in scope.

That is partly my concern, it is quite a narrow scope. In the examples doc:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1I5WTualRt90rwNYFJeuOy_b5un4iMS0tTh1uWXosLaA/edit<https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdocs.google.com%2Fdocument%2Fd%2F1I5WTualRt90rwNYFJeuOy_b5un4iMS0tTh1uWXosLaA%2Fedit&data=01%7C01%7Ca.james%40soton.ac.uk%7C8ee887b57cd544970b9008d7ec7ddff4%7C4a5378f929f44d3ebe89669d03ada9d8%7C0&sdata=ddjEOnLL3vJ90ibEVLF5ewo3DCrhpdo06j2mtThlkYM%3D&reserved=0>

I was struggling to find failing examples (but I didn’t spend long).

-Alastair


From: Andrew Kirkpatrick

Just a few examples to inquire about:


  1.  Buttons like on target.com<https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftarget.com%2F&data=01%7C01%7Ca.james%40soton.ac.uk%7C8ee887b57cd544970b9008d7ec7ddff4%7C4a5378f929f44d3ebe89669d03ada9d8%7C0&sdata=9fLXzuLHjTks%2F3rnDD0p%2BzLxMZ4EzdTU7EB081YOnvk%3D&reserved=0> (in the US anyway) – the cart button is distinct because it is at the top of the page, has a cart image, has spacing to set it apart – does it satisfy this SC?
<image001.png>


  1.  Similarly, very common social media links – pass or fail?
<image002.png>

  1.  On the W3C site there are text links that I think will fail, with the possible exception of the “subscribe” link. Agree? Or do they all pass because it is clear enough that they are in a navigation area (made more clear in this example by the heading “quick links”)?

<image003.png>

Thanks,
AWK

Andrew Kirkpatrick
Head of Accessibility
Adobe

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From: David MacDonald <david100@sympatico.ca<mailto:david100@sympatico.ca>>
Date: Wednesday, April 29, 2020 at 8:52 AM
To: Alastair Campbell <acampbell@nomensa.com<mailto:acampbell@nomensa.com>>
Cc: Patrick Lauke <redux@splintered.co.uk<mailto:redux@splintered.co.uk>>, WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org<mailto:w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>>
Subject: Re: Visual indicators
Resent-From: WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org<mailto:w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>>
Resent-Date: Wednesday, April 29, 2020 at 8:51 AM

As per Alastair's suggestion I've removed the exceptions and as per Rachel's suggestion I've removed the financial/legal scoping.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1WhZAbswvPHs7A3stfqM_ATsaBHPeGbHtARcmaKMck1U/edit?usp=sharing<https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdocs.google.com%2Fdocument%2Fd%2F1WhZAbswvPHs7A3stfqM_ATsaBHPeGbHtARcmaKMck1U%2Fedit%3Fusp%3Dsharing&data=01%7C01%7Ca.james%40soton.ac.uk%7C8ee887b57cd544970b9008d7ec7ddff4%7C4a5378f929f44d3ebe89669d03ada9d8%7C0&sdata=Tnrupvib0p%2BD2%2FO2R6bxEi3mA7kktvLS3p8vwOTVty0%3D&reserved=0>


Cheers,
David MacDonald



CanAdapt Solutions Inc.

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On Wed, Apr 29, 2020 at 8:25 AM Alastair Campbell <acampbell@nomensa.com<mailto:acampbell@nomensa.com>> wrote:
        > a cold reading of what the SC currently says may make developers wonder why it's literally just the progress once you're IN a process, but not the actual control that may INITIATE a process?

Because of this:
        > If squinting hard enough, almost anything you look at on a website/app can be argued to be a "process"?

Ideally, yes, we would want to include initiation controls as well, but it makes the scoping much harder.

I think we could agree that 'browsing' is not a process, but other than that it is a bit muddy until you are in a step-by-step process scenario. Therefore, if we don't include the 'initiate' of a process it is much clearer what is in scope.

If you find any tricky examples, please do pop them into the examples doc.

Cheers,

-Alastair