- From: Ivan Herman <ivan@w3.org>
- Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2007 11:56:40 +0200
- To: ~:'' ありがとうございました。 <j.chetwynd@btinternet.com>
- CC: Benjamin Nowack <bnowack@semsol.com>, semantic-web@w3.org
- Message-ID: <47109658.1080605@w3.org>
~:'' ありがとうございました。 wrote: > Ivan, > > [1] Doug proposes including text with opacity="0", it's also necessary > to add title and desc for each file. And, as I said, it should be visibility="hidden" instead... but the essence is the same. > > As you say it is certainly necessary to add RDF metadata, for machines > one wants copyright info but also something that makes it as easy as > possible for users to find and understand. Yep. > > should text and paths be surrounded by an anchor link to > http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/ ? > Well... I am not sure. Applications using the SVG as, say, part of their own SVG figures might be a bit bothered by that, they may want to have a better control (eg, for the target) on how they want to use a link on the logo. > [2] This loses much of the potential of font, for the present. > That is, unfortunately, true, and I have been bitten by this problem several time already. This is a problem with all the W3C logos (that are all available in SVG, too). But Doug seems to be optimistic that the problem will, eventually, go away! FWIW, I have made the changes on all the SW logos on my local machine already. I wait to see if somebody has a good add-on to what we have, and I can then upload them either later today or on Monday. thanks for all this Ivan > regards > > Jonathan Chetwynd > Accessibility Consultant on Media Literacy and the Internet > > [1] http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/attachment.cgi?id=493 > http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5190 > > > [2] This still doesn't take account of users preferences, or language. > It seems clear that the user with specific needs should be able to > render any SVG text in a font of their choice using a style sheet. > Similarly some software, perhaps on mobile phones might have 'fixed > fonts' and not be able to render the glyphs provided. eg safari, camino > and mozilla use different default fonts. > If that much is agreed, then W3C has no absolute control over the > rendering in any case. > Are examples in other languages to be allowed, eg greek japanese russian > etc? > > my concern is as expressed elsewhere that the licence should be broader, > preferably PD. > but in any case so that the graphic can be displayed alone. > ie for symbol users, rather than readers. > > http://www.w3.org/TR/SVG-access/#ReUsingText > http://www.w3.org/TR/SVG-access/#Fonts2 > > -- > > On 12 Oct 2007, at 17:07, Ivan Herman wrote: > > Dear Jonathan, > > let me give some backgroun explanation and propose a solution to see if > that would work with you. > > It is true that, in an ideal world, SVG should include texts as, well, > texts, and not in geometry. And the specification of SVG allows that. It > is also possible to add a description of a font (or the characters that > are used from a font) into the SVG file itself to ensure a proper > rendering on all environment, independently of the fonts being stored > locally. > > The very practical problem, however, is that a number of SVG players > (eg, Mozilla) do not understand (yet, hopefully!) those text statements > with font descriptions. In order to have the logo displayed properly, we > had to go back to the original design, do a version that turned the > characters into geometry, and export that into SVG. > > However: what I would propose to do is to add RDF metadata into the SVG > file (this is perfectly possible, too) that would include dc terms > including a description containing the text of the logo (plus, eg, > copyright info). Is this agreeable to you? This is something that could > be done within a few days (alas, it should be done individually in a > text editor:-) > > Ivan > > ~:'' ありがとうございました。 wrote: >> >> Benji, >> >> I'm not at sure this is trivial, I'd like to see what the Comm and SW >> WGs suggest. >> I've asked the SVG WG to propose or point to an example of excellence. >> >> presumably they should contain some CC licence information, or at least >> a pointer to the copyright notice, etc. >> >> who might be appropriate to discuss this with? >> who created the original design? >> >> one further concern is translation, in their current form it doesn't >> seem possible, due to both the design and copyright restrictions. Our >> users for instance cannot read, but might well benefit from the symbol >> in understanding something of it's meaning in a future context. >> >> regards >> >> >> Jonathan Chetwynd >> Accessibility Consultant on Media Literacy and the Internet >> >> I'm also considering how to annotate the weather symbols I published >> recently on wikipedia. >> >> >> >> On 12 Oct 2007, at 14:11, Benjamin Nowack wrote: >> >> >> Hi Jonathan, >> >> thanks for the hint. I didn't create the SVGs, and I personally wouldn't >> have the relevant skills to add the textual information, but I'm sure >> the Comm team is more than happy to replace the files if someone sends >> them properly annotated ones. Or is that a trivial task? I think it's >> great that they provide SVGs at all. >> >> Cheers, >> Benji >> >> On 11.10.2007 15:56:13, ~:'' ããããšãããããŸãã〠wrote: >>> I've only had a chance to have a brief look at the new logo. >>> >>> Benji >>> >>> I like the SVG graphic But.... >>> It does have significant defects. >>> >>> the text-rendering is defined but there is no text. >>> in fact the file has literally not a single content identifier of any >>> sort. >>> unless the file is rendered it is literally impossible to tell what >>> it might be. >>> pace those that render in their minds... >>> >>> The Web Accessibility Initiative WCAG guidelines suggest this is not >>> good practice. >>> >>> I'd hope the SWEO and Comm teams might also include relevant semantic >>> information. >>> >>> regarding the exceptionally restrictive copyright restrictions it >>> might be relevant to review Lawrence Lessig on Dojinshi. >>> >>> apologies if this seems heavy handed, or I got the wrong end of the >>> stick >>> as I say in a rush.. >>> >>> regards >>> >>> >>> Jonathan Chetwynd >>> Accessibility Consultant on Media Literacy and the Internet >>> >>> Michael Schneider wrote: >>> >>>> http://www.w3.org/2007/10/sw-logos.html >>> >>> >> >> >> > -- Ivan Herman, W3C Semantic Web Activity Lead Home: http://www.w3.org/People/Ivan/ PGP Key: http://www.ivan-herman.net/pgpkey.html FOAF: http://www.ivan-herman.net/foaf.rdf
Received on Saturday, 13 October 2007 09:56:48 UTC