- From: Abel Braaksma <abel.braaksma@xs4all.nl>
- Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2016 14:32:30 +0200
- To: "Public Joint XSLT XQuery XPath" <public-xsl-query@w3.org>
Please find the minutes between the lines of the agenda. NOTE 1: I have taken the liberty of marking the result of the discussion on whitespace in BracedURILiteral as a "decision" and to mark it a resolution of Bug 29708 (which we couldn't access during the call), which hopefully also resolves the omission of such decision in the earlier minutes of F2F in Prague in 2012, kindly researched and referenced by Michael Dyck in a follow-up mail after the telcon. See also my NOTE in the minutes below. NOTE 2: I did not record an action item for dealing with Benito's mail (nr 16 in June's archive), see minutes below. Summary of new actions: ACTION- A-648-01: in the Serialization XSD, fix the whitespace and make it MSXML4 compatible and fix any other issues that were raised in that thread (see https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0078.html) ACTION-A-648-02: O'Neil to generate a test report running only XQ31 and XP31 tests and to report internally before publishing Summary of decisions: DECISION: (bug 29708) no change to the production(s) or text of BracedURILiteral or EQName w.r.t. whitespace handling DECISION: (A-641-14) To use "the associated expression", without specifying what an "associated expression" is related to, as explained in the mail from Michael Dyck here: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0072.html > From: Andrew Coleman [mailto:andrew_coleman@uk.ibm.com] > Sent: Friday, June 24, 2016 1:50 PM > To: public-xsl-query@w3.org > Subject: DRAFT XML Query/XSL WG Joint Teleconference #648 Agenda 2016- > 06-28 > > DRAFT XML Query/XSL WG Joint Teleconference #648 Agenda 2016-06-28 > > > Andy will chair this meeting. > > PLEASE SEND CORRECTIONS AND ADDITIONS AS SOON AS POSSIBLE SO A > REVISED > AGENDA CAN BE PREPARED IN A TIMELY MANNER! > > Changes in this agenda: > > > > This week, I'd like us to work on the following items: > J4.3 (Serialization) > J4.4 (XPath) > J4.6 (Test suite) > > > Key: > J = Joint Query/XSLT meeting; > Q = Query-only meeting > > > Teleconference connection details > --------------------------------- > > (Member only) > https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-xsl-query/2015Sep/0014.html > > > > SUMMARY OF DECISIONS > ==================== > Note to secretary: Please insert a summary of all decisions made during > this teleconference at this location in the minutes. > > Decisions MUST be clear as to their complete intent. The subject of the > decision should *not* require dereferencing; it is most helpful if > agenda numbers and bug numbers are accompanied by their titles. If a > decision is recorded about the resolution of a bug, the decision must > state exactly what the resolution is (e.g., "Accept the solution in > comment #5", or "Replace the production for XXX with this: <new > production>", or the like. It should be possible to read a decision > months later and be certain what it meant and whether or not it was > properly applied. > > > NEW ACTION ITEMS > ================ > Note to secretary: Please insert all new action items assigned during > this teleconference at this location in the minutes. > > Action items MUST make sense even when they are viewed standalone (that > is, not read in the context of the agenda item where they were > assigned). This explicitly requires that all referents (e.g., "this", > "that") be made clear. Action items such as "Ralph to resolve this > problem" are DISALLOWED. It takes a scribe only a few additional > minutes to ensure that action items are clear, while it takes the entire > WG considerable effort to constantly research the meaning of unclear > action items. The subject of the action item should *not* require > dereferencing; it is most helpful if agenda numbers and bug numbers are > accompanied by their titles. > > > > =================================================== > Joint XML Query Working Group and XSL Working Group > =================================================== > > > J1. Administrative Items > > J1.1 Selection of secretary(s) > > Josh has been asked to take the minutes. Abel has been asked to stand by. Abel takes these minutes > > > NOTE: The chair will confirm the secretary prior to the start of the > meeting. > > > Most recent secretaries (least-recent participants first): > ---------------------------------------------------------- > (This list identifies the most recent three occasions when each > participant acted as Secretary for the Task Force. The person whose > name is at the top of the list should plan to take the minutes at the > meeting identified by this agenda; if that person is unavailable, then > the job will fall to the next person on the list, etc. > > Josh Spiegel - 2016-03-15, 2015-12-01, 2015-09-08 > Abel Braaksma - > Jonathan Robie - 2016-04-12, 2016-01-05, 2015-09-29 > O'Neil Delpratt - 2016-04-19, 2016-02-02, 2015-10-27 > Mike Kay - 2016-04-26, 2016-03-01, 2015-11-10 > Liam Quin - 2016-05-03, 2016-01-19, 2015-10-06 > Tim Mills - 2016-05-10, 2016-03-22, 2015-12-08 > John Snelson - 2016-05-24, 2016-01-12, 2015-07-16 > Michael Sprbrg-McQn - 2016-06-07, 2016-02-09, 2015-10-03 > Michael Dyck - 2016-06-14, 2016-03-08, 2015-11-17 > Adam Retter - 2016-06-21, 2016-01-26, 2015-10-20 > > > > J1.2 Call the Roll -- NOT DONE DURING TELECONFERENCE > > Note to secretary: During the meeting, take a note of the Webex > participants, then list in the minutes those present and those who sent > regrets. All others will be presumed to have been absent without regrets. Present: Andy Coleman Michael Kay O'Neil Tim Mills Abel Braaksma Jonathan Robie C.M. Sperberg-McQueen Michael Dyck Regrets: Liam > > > XML Query WG membership list: > http://www.w3.org/2000/09/dbwg/details?group=18797&order=org > > XSL WG membership list: > http://www.w3.org/2000/09/dbwg/details?group=19552&order=org > > > Regrets: > > > > > J1.3 Approval of agenda > > J1.3.1 Additions, deletions, or corrections? NOTE: BugZilla was down during the call, as a result we didn't go over (most) bugs this meeting > > > > J1.4 Review of recent minutes and administrative items > > J1.4.1 Minutes of meeting #647 (Adam) > https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0058.html > with amendment of attendance list: > https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0059.html Minutes approved as a true record, without amendments. > > > J1.5 Review of action items > > NOTE: Please be prepared to respond quickly on your action items! > > J1.5.1 Outstanding action items > > > ACTION A-641-11 (bug 29592) (array and map prefixes). Action on Tim to > resolve the issue in the way suggested in the bug report. > > Status: Progressing; ETA not specified. Status: closed. > > > ACTION A-645-05: Serialization editors (AC, MSM) to discuss bug 29664 > offline and come back with a proposal. > > Status: Pending; ETA 2016-06-28 MSM mentions that they started a systematic review of all the bugs on Serialization, but with Bugzilla down we cannot do much now and exact status is unknown. Status: Pending New ETA: 2016-07-05 > > > ACTION A-645-06: Serialization editors (AC, MSM) to come back with a > proposal for bug 29665. > > Status: Pending; ETA 2016-06-28 Status: Pending New ETA: 2016-07-05 > > > ACTION A-645-08: TM to test the schema prepared by MSM to address the > issue raised in bug 29658. (Depends on action A-645-07.) > > Status: Pending; ETA not specified. TM mentions it is related to results of the Serialization XSD discussion, which is itself still pending Status: Pending, no new ETA > > > ACTION A-645-09: JS to test the schema prepared by MSM to address the > issue raised in bug 29658. (Depends on action A-645-07.) > > Status: Pending; ETA not specified. Pending for the same reason as A-646-08. Status: Pending, no new ETA > > > ACTION A-646-02: JRobie to make the changes outlined in bug 29683 > comments 2 and 3 (re map lookup). > > Status: Pending; ETA 2016-06-28 Status: Pending New ETA: 2016-07-05 > > > ACTION A-646-06: Jonathan to add comment 0 of bug 29622 to the XPath > spec. > > Status: Pending; ETA 2016-06-28 Status: done See: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0079.html > > > ACTION A-647-01 Michael Kay to close bug > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=29555 and resolve, by > updating the spec in alignment with his comments #15 and #16. > > Status: Pending; ETA not specified. Status: unknown (pending Bugzilla access) New ETA: 2016-07-05 > > > ACTION A-647-02 Jonathan Robie to accept the change in comment #2 of bug > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=29693 from Abel > Braaskma. > > Status: Pending; ETA not specified. Status: done See: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0080.html > > > ACTION A-647-03 O'Neil Delpratt to remove "MAY" tests described in bug > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=29625 and close the > bug. > > Status: Pending; ETA not specified. Status: done No mail to confirm it, but O'Neil confirms it is done. > > > ACTION A-647-04 Michael Kay to remove the function call to local:test() in > the test described by bug > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=29597. > > Status: Pending; ETA not specified. Status: done No mail to confirm it, but Michael Kay found a change in the log that backs it up. > > > ACTION A-647-05 Tim Mills to make the changes to the test as described in > bug > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=29676. > > Status: Pending; ETA not specified. Status: done Bug was closed > > > ACTION A-647-06 O'Neill Delpratt to remove test resolve-uri-28 describer in > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=29381. > > Status: Pending; ETA not specified. Status: done > > > ACTION A-647-07 Jonathan Robie to change the spec to add Tim's proposal in > comment #21 of bug > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=29586. > > Status: Pending; ETA not specified. Status: pending (no BugZilla access) New ETA: 2016-07-05 > > > > J1.5.2 Completed action items > > > ACTION A-640-04: Jonathan Robie to resolve Bug #29277 by making the > changes from comment #20 items 2 and 5. > > Status: Closed; See > https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0045.html > > > ACTION A-641-04 (bug 29277) Jonathan to make the editorial changes > needed. > > Status: Closed; See > https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0045.html > > > ACTION A-643-01: MikeK to update proposal on Bug 29555. > > Status: Closed; See > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=29555#c15 > > > ACTION A-643-05: Andy to investigate how to solve Q2.3.2 Bug 29610 - > Differing namespace definitions for xqt-errors. > > Status: Closed; See > https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0061.html > > > ACTION A-645-07: MSM to prepare a schema with a workaround for the > issue reported in bug 29658 and post it. > > Status: Closed; See > https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0047.html > > > ACTION A-645-10: OND to test the schema prepared by MSM to address the > issue raised in bug 29658. (Depends on action A-645-07.) > > Status: Closed; See > https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0047.html > > > ACTION A-646-03: JRobie to add CMSMcQ's Note from the 646 minutes > to the XPath spec. > > Status: Closed; Reported in last meeting > > > ACTION A-646-05: Tim to clarify the changes he's proposing for bug 29586 > (subtype-itemtype). > > Status: Closed; See > https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0040.html > > > > J1.6 Update on related activities > > J1.6.1 Update on XSLT WG activities (Sharon, MikeK) > > > > J1.6.2 Update on EXPath/EXQuery CG activities (Mike) > > > > J1.7 Future Meetings > > J1.7.1 QT Meeting Schedule > > [V45] Joint XML Query/XSL WG meeting schedule > https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-xsl-query/2016Apr/0000.html At the end of the meeting, Andy asked who would be joining next week's meeting (#649, 2016-06-05). Jonathan Robie said he would probably not be able to attend as it is the day after July 4th celebrations. The meeting next week will take place as planned. > > > > J1.7.2 Future F2F Meetings > > J1.7.2.1 Other future F2F meetings > > (none) > > > J2. Documents For Review > > (none) > > > > J3. Maintenance Issues > > J3.0 The XML Query WG and XSLT WG do not intend to maintains specs > earlier than the 3.0 suite of documents; when the 3.1 suite reaches > Recommendation, maintenance of the 3.0 documents will be terminated. > > This agenda item is reserved for reporting errors and other problems > reported against the 3.0 (later, 3.1) suite of specifications. > > > J3.0.1 Concerns raised by the XSLT working group in regards to potential > completion delays of XSLT 3.0 if XPath 3.0 is made obsoleted by 3.1 > > Status: Pending the outcome of Abel's review of 3.0 bugs/errata. > Any change to the status of the 3.0 specs requires explicit XSL WG > consultation. > > > J3.1 Bugzilla Bugs filed against the 3.0 suite of joint XML Query WG and > XSLT WG documents > > (none) > > > > J4. Active Specification Development > > > ** Note: Full Text 3.1 has been removed from the WG agenda. > If, in the future, there is sufficient interest (i.e. at least two > independent participants to develop the spec and implementations), > then this can be brought back on the agenda. > > > > J4.1 Data Model 3.1 (Norm) > > J4.1.0 Internal working draft > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xpath-datamodel- > 31/html/Overview.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xpath-datamodel- > 31/html/Overview-diff.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xpath-datamodel- > 31/src/changes.txt > > (none) > > > J4.2 Functions and Operators 3.1 (Mike Kay) > > J4.2.0 Internal working draft > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xpath-functions- > 31/html/Overview.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xpath-functions- > 31/html/Overview-diff.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xpath-functions- > 31/src/changes.txt > > (none) > > > J4.3 Serialization 3.1 (Michael Sperberg-McQueen, Andy) > > J4.3.0 Internal working draft > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xslt-xquery- > serialization-31/html/Overview.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xslt-xquery- > serialization-31/html/Overview-diff.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xslt-xquery- > serialization-31/src/changes.txt > > > J4.3.1 Bug 29664 - [SER31] 9.1.17 JSON Output Method: the json-node- > output-method Parameter > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=29664 > > Status: Pending completion of A-645-05 > > > J4.3.2 Bug 29665 - [SER31] JSON escaping > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=29665 > > Status: Pending completion of A-645-06 > > > J4.3.3 Bug 29703 - [SER31] Bring the yes/no etc of the serialization- > parameters schema in line with the way booleans are treated in XSLT's > xsl:output > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=29703 > > Status: Ready to discuss NOTE FROM SCRIBE: new agenda item J4.3.4. J4.3.4 (A-645-07) Discuss the proposed fix for the Serialization XSD and follow-up discussion on proposed changes We briefly discussed the summary of the (long) discussion thread, published by ABr here: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0078.html MSM: asks the WG whether it was a "slip" to allow spaces in the BracedURILiteral MD writes in IRC that he thinks it was a conscious decision at the time ABr mentions that he doesn't like the current whitespace rule but also doesn't see a strong case to change it, esp. in light of 3.0 backwards compatibility NOTE FROM SCRIBE: after the meeting, Michael Dyck summarized that indeed minutes (of F2F Prague, https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-xsl-query/2012Feb/0023.html) show that whitespace was discussed, however, neither those minutes, nor the following offline discussion recorded a formal decision on the matter. See https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0085.html The WG reached consensus that the whitespace rules should not change. DECISION: (bug 29708) no change to the production(s) or text of BracedURILiteral or EQName w.r.t. whitespace handling ACTION- A-648-01: in the Serialization XSD, fix the whitespace and make it MSXML4 compatible and fix any other issues that were raised in that thread (see https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0078.html) > > > > J4.4 XPath 3.1 (Jonathan) > > J4.4.0 Internal working draft > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xquery- > 31/html/xpath-31.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xquery- > 31/html/xpath-31-diff.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xquery- > 31/src/changes.txt > > > J4.4.1 Bug 29700 - [XP31] ws:explicit wording on comments is a tad > unfortunate > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=29700 > > Status: Ready to discuss > > > > J4.5 Grammar Test Applets (Michael Dyck) > > (none) > > > J4.6 QT3 test suite (O'Neil) > > J4.6.1 Status report on test suite, harness, tools > > > J4.6.2 Status of 3.1 tests results > > Status: Currently three implementers submitted results Current results can be found: https://dev.w3.org/2011/QT3-test-suite/ReportingResults31/ AC explains that we need more tests to be able to progress to PR soon and we need to address the "red" parts AC asks if other implementers can send in results JR can submit updated results ABr can submit new results, but states XP31 does currently not have his focus AC suggests to exclude tests that do not belong exclusively in the XP31 realm, in other words, remove XP30 and before tests AC: reasoning, because static-typing is not supported by XP31 processors, but implementability has already been proven, and because nothing changed in this respect, we could limit the tests to only those that work with XP31. MK argues that the static-typing feature is in essence a relic from the past that is now an optional feature. Since nothing changed here, it is ok to leave it out of the report. ACTION-A-648-02: O'Neil to generate a test report running only XQ31 and XP31 tests and to report internally before publishing > > > > J5. Progression of Work > > J5.1 XSLT 3.0, XQuery 3.1, XQueryX 3.1, XPath 3.1, XDM 3.1, F&O 3.1, > Serialization 3.1 > > J5.1.1 Current status > > * In Candidate Recommendation; awaiting implementation reports > > > J5.1.2 Dependencies inhibiting progression > > * Completion of test suite minimum-required-to-declare-victory > > * Sufficient implementation experience and reports thereof > > * Formal response to all comments, responses accepted by commenters > > * PR Transition Request and authorization, PR pub request > > * REC Transition Request and authorization, REC pub request > > > > J5.2 Update 3.0 > > J5.2.1 Current Status > > * In Last Call Working Draft > > At XML Prague, Liam talked to a few people about XQuery Update but found > no great enthusiasm for doing the work. We cannot progress without plans > for a test suite and potential implementers. The WG needs to decide what > to do with this spec. > > Status: Ready to discuss > > > > J5.2.2 Require owner of XQUF 3.0 Test Suite > > > J5.2.3 Dependencies inhibiting progression > > * CR Transition Request and authorization, CR pub request > > * Completion of test suite minimum-required-to-declare-victory > > * Sufficient implementation experience and reports thereof > > * Formal response to all comments, responses accepted by commenters > > * PR Transition Request and authorization, PR pub request > > * REC Transition Request and authorization, REC pub request > > > > J6. Any other business > > J6.1 Consideration of future work > > J6.1.1 QT 3.2 > > The WGs decided that we will finish the 3.1 documents presently under way, > but undertake no new work. Maintenance work should be planned upon for > a > period of time after finishing the specifications. > > > J6.1.2 FT 3.1 > > Currently inadequate interest and resources > > > J6.1.3 Update 3.1 > > Currently inadequate interest and resources > > > > J7. Adjourn > > > > > ======================= > XML Query Working Group > ======================= > > Q1. The XML Query WG does not intend to maintains specs earlier than the > 3.0 suite of documents; when the 3.1 suite reaches Recommendation, > maintenance of the 3.0 documents will be terminated. > > Q1.0 This agenda item is reserved for reporting errors and other > problems reported against the 3.0 (later, 3.1) XML Query WG suite of > specifications. > > > Q1.1 Bugzilla Bugs filed against the 3.0 suite of XML Query WG documents > > (none) > > > > Q2. Active Specification Development > > Q2.1 XQuery Update Facility 3.0 (John) > > Q2.1.0 Internal working draft > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xquery-update- > 30/html/Overview.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xquery-update- > 30/html/Overview-diff.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xquery-update- > 30/src/changes.txt > > * The WG needs to obtain implementation experience with this document. > > > Q2.2 XQuery Update Facility 3.0 Requirements and Use Cases (Andy) > See > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/requirements/xquery-update- > 30/html/Overview.html > > * The WGs need to be certain that this document is completed > (red/yellow/green bullets on requirements, all the use cases intended to > be published) and a decision made to advance it to WG Note. > > > Q2.3 XQuery 3.1 (Jonathan) > > Q2.3.0 Internal working draft > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xquery- > 31/html/xquery-31.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xquery- > 31/html/xquery-31-diff.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xquery- > 31/src/changes.txt > > (none) New agenda items, per being incapable of accessing BugZilla, we decided to discuss the following: Q2.3.1 Discussion A-641-14 https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0010.html JR explained the following productions: [128] PostfixExpr ::= PrimaryExpr (Predicate | ArgumentList | Lookup)* [131] Predicate ::= "[" Expr "]" JR argues that we don't have the relation of base expression vs subexpression. The question so rises, what is an "associated" expression if we do not have such association MD comments that expressions more or less have a sibling relationship, not a parent-child relationship JR suggests to use "enclosed expr" but retracts, as it is not "enclosed" The discussion on finding the right terminology to use here went on a while between MD an JR Decision: To use "the associated expression", without specifying what an "associated expression" is related to, as explained in the mail from MD here: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0072.html No new action item, done in situ by Jonathan Robie. > > > Q2.4 XQueryX 3.1 (Josh) > > Q2.4.0 Internal working draft > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xqueryx- > 31/html/Overview.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xqueryx- > 31/html/Overview-diff.html > http://www.w3.org/XML/Group/qtspecs/specifications/xqueryx- > 31/src/changes.txt > > > (none) > > > Q3. Test Suite Development > > Q3.1 Update Facility 3.0 Test Suite (????) > > * Need test suite developer/manager > > * Need tests > > > > Q4. Any other business ABr asked whether someone could respond to the mail from Benito van der Zander (https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xsl-query/2016Jun/0016.html). Benito requests in that mail whether he can send in XPath 2.0 and/or XPath 3.0 results still and whether they would be published, The WG briefly discussed the possibility of re-publishing a report with added results from Benito and/or also Exselt (Abel Braaksma's processor). Some members expressed concern that some tests on XP30 have since been updated or added, leading to differences in reports compared to the current reports. O'Neil explained that a ZIP version of the CVS repo of that time is available as a snapshot, this would allow vendors to send in reports using the exact same test set as was used for generating the XP30/XQ30 reports. No decision was made, to be postponed to a later date. Andy said he would need to take a look at that mail for possible later discussion and/or to answer Benito. > > > > Q5. Adjourn The meeting was adjourned.
Received on Wednesday, 29 June 2016 12:34:06 UTC