- From: Karen Coyle <kcoyle@kcoyle.net>
- Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2010 14:57:33 -0800
- To: "public-xg-lld@w3.org" <public-xg-lld@w3.org>
The minutes of this week's meeting are available online at:
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/16-lld-minutes.html
They are also below in text format.
- kc
****** As Text ********
[1]W3C
[1] http://www.w3.org/
LLD XG
16 Dec 2010
[2]Agenda
[2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2010Dec/0054.html
See also: [3]IRC log
[3] http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-lld-irc
Attendees
Present
emma, kefo, antoine, kcoyle, marcia, TomB, rsinger, LarsG,
markva, jodi, pmurray, michaelp, edsu, rayd, uldis
Regrets
Gordon, Alex_C, Jeff, Felix, Kim, Alex_H, Monica, Joachim,
Kai, Marcia, Martin
Chair
Emmanuelle
Scribe
Karen
Contents
* [4]Topics
1. [5]Administration
2. [6]final report
3. [7]use cases
4. [8]topics -- things other than use cases
* [9]Summary of Action Items
_________________________________________________________
<emma> Previous: 2010-12-09
[10]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/09-lld-minu
tes.html
[10]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/09-lld-minutes.html
<uldis> hi emma, i'm Uldis Bojars
<uldis> we talked on email that i should introduce me at the start
of the telco -- but i have difficulty connecting to the telco phone
line
<emma> Scribe: Karen
<emma> scribenick: kcoyle
<uldis> antoine: i promised to introduce myself to the group, but
have difficulty connecting to the telco bridge. sorry that i won't
be able to participate in voice, at least for the beginning of the
call
Administration
RESOLUTION: Minutes accepted
No telecons for the next two weeks
Next call will be January 6, 2011
Final report
There is the lingering terminology issue that needs to be resolved
proposed in cologne:
[11]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2010Dec/0005.h
tml
[11] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2010Dec/0005.html
PROPOSED: to adopt the terminology proposed in Cologne for the
future draft report
markva: "dataset" refers to a third type of thing, such as sets of
bib records
... values int hose records would be value vocabularies
<TomB> +1 to support
[12]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-lld/2010Dec/0095.html
, noting Antoine's reply at
[13]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-lld/2010Dec/0097.html
[12] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-lld/2010Dec/0095.html
[13] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-lld/2010Dec/0097.html
emma: antoine suggested 'reference dataset'
antoine: some things like name authority are not thought of in the
library world as vocabularies, but datasets
markva: antoine is talking about exceptions to markva's typology,
but these exceptions do not make a difference
antoine: it's a question of scope
markva: 1- bib records, 2 - values used in those records from
vocabularies, 3- properties and classes
... 1 - dataset, 2 value vocabularies 3 metadata element set
<jodi> it's always about the exceptions though ;(
<Zakim> TomB, you wanted to reinforce that these are being
classified based on use - not an air-tight typology, as per Mikael
tomB: we want to come up with 3 intuitively recognizable concepts
without expecting that things will fall neatly into a single
category
<michaelp> Couldn't a dataset be seen as a combination/selection of
entities from value and element vocabularies?
tomB: things could be used in different ways
<Zakim> antoine, you wanted to support flexibility with MARC
relators
tomB: support distinction between dataset and value vocabulary, even
though some sets of URIs can be used in more than one way
antoine: there could be flexibility between group 1 and 2, such as
marc relators
... possible confusion in use of the term "value" -- some people
have strong association with skosxl label
tomB: we should not try to be more precise than: value vocabulary is
a set of terms that are/may be used as values
... includes skos concepts and dcmi "type"s
<edsu> not sure if it's totally relevant, but danbri announced the
Linked Datasets with the voiD Vocabulary w3c note which could
provide some foundation for talking about "dataset":
[14]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/semantic-web/2010Dec/0161.ht
ml
[14] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/semantic-web/2010Dec/0161.html
<TomB> +1 for Mark's proposal
discussing marks' summary:
[15]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-lld/2010Nov/0121.html
[15] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-lld/2010Nov/0121.html
tomB: we agree that data models are not a special category, e.g.
FRBR
<Zakim> antoine, you wanted to comment on possible dataset
confusion?
antoine: ref. edsu link above, use of "dataset" is dangerous
emma: datasets are about instances of descriptions
<TomB> is wondering whether both element sets and value vocabularies
could be seen as datasets
<markva> hard to hear, typing in background
<Zakim> TomB, you wanted to ask whether element sets are also
datasets?
emma: we are defining terms for our report, not other contexts
tomB: what is NOT a dataset? we could have element sets and value
vocabularies and they are both datasets
... dataset could be everything that isn't in the other 2
categories; dataset is the more general term
edsu: note talks about vocabularies; as per antoine, "dataset" is
any triples, so it's very open
tomb: element set is "dataset," ed?
markva: "dataset" is ambiguous; we should keep our audience in mind:
librarians -- we want to communicate with them
<jodi> 'bibliographic dataset' is more restrictive, because
librarians might see that as excluding archival data, say
emma: value vocabs, metadata datasets... these are datasets
... 3 defs: value vocabs, metadatasets, dataset
<scribe> ACTION: Mark to add these definitions to the wiki page
[recorded in
[16]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/16-lld-minu
tes.html#action01]
<TomB> edsu, this typology seems consistent with your point at
[17]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-lld/2010Nov/0101.html
, where "element sets" = "RDF vocabulary"
[17] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-lld/2010Nov/0101.html
RESOLUTION: to use these three terms as defined in our report
<Zakim> TomB, you wanted to suggest we discuss the definitions on a
future call
tomB: put these defintions on future call
<kcoyle> I'm available
<markva> great!
<TomB> value vocabulary, metadata element set, dataset
RESOLUTION: the three terms are: value vocabulary; metadata element
set, and dataset
<Zakim> TomB, you wanted to suggest that Mark post the definitions
to the list, not just wiki page
<markva> OK!
tomB: asks mark to also post the definitions to the list
use cases
use case work has due date of the end of December
<emma> [18]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Cluster_BibData
[18] http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Cluster_BibData
Reporting on cluster work... Bibliographic Data Cluster: created
page and posted to mailing list
No one here to report on authority data
<michaelp> Yes, we think so.
vocabulary alignment cluster: will report in January
archive data cluster: nothing new; probably will not finish by end
of december
<edsu> lol (on mute)
<TomB> "it's always good to try" :-)
citation cluster: kai has been thinking about vocabulary;
essentially done
<pmurray> Agreed. I think the citation group is done for the moment.
<markva> not clear which action?
<emma> ACTION: Kai and Ed to curate citations cluster for end of
December [recorded in
[19]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minu
tes.html#action03] [DONE]
[19]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minutes.html#action03
<edsu> kai's diagram example:
[20]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Cluster_Citations#Illu
strative_Example
[20]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Cluster_Citations#Illustrative_Example
<markva> unmute me
digital objects cluster: nothing to report
all cluster tasks except citation cluster continue
emma: there are now templates for the use case cluster pages to
follow
<uldis> TomB: no, not yet
Welcoming Uldis!
<TomB> welcome, Uldis!
Uldis: is working with national library of Latvia on linked data
<TomB> Uldis's introduction:
[21]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2010Dec/0047.h
tml
[21] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2010Dec/0047.html
What cluster for Uldis? answer: Any that are still ongoing.
<Zakim> jodi, you wanted to ask about unclustered use cases +
pending social uses
jodi: there are several use cases that are not in clusters
... there are uses that not yet have use cases; should we have a
miscellaneous cluster?
... or add them to an existing cluster?
... there are things we wanted to take into account, such as more
social activities around bibliographic data, social uses of
bibliographic data
... should we add these?
<antoine>
[22]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/UseCaseNotes#Things_th
at_should_be_covered_by_use_cases ?
[22]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/UseCaseNotes#Things_that_should_be_covered_by_use_cases
<jodi>
[23]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2010Nov/0077.h
tml
[23] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2010Nov/0077.html
<jodi> yes, antoine, that's what I'm referring to
<jodi> the list email is what's
[24]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/index.php?title=UseCas
eNotes&oldid=2128
[24]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/index.php?title=UseCaseNotes&oldid=2128
emma: if there are missing use cases that were not covered in the
f2f meeting, we need volunteers to contribute these use cases, but
it needs to be done soon
<Zakim> antoine, you wanted to ask about social web
<jodi> so, more specifically: Link Social Bibliography to a
Bibliographic Network, Find stuff in several collections
<jodi> and Find e-books see
[25]http://efoundations.typepad.com/efoundations/2010/07/finding-ebo
oks.html
[25]
http://efoundations.typepad.com/efoundations/2010/07/finding-ebooks.html
<jodi> so those are the 3 use cases I see in "social uses"
antoine: asking if Uldis was involved in social web incubator group,
and could take this on?
<jodi> we also have 3 use cases that aren't clustered, here:
[26]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Use_Cases#Not_yet_clus
tered:
[26]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Use_Cases#Not_yet_clustered:
<jodi> of those, "using circulation data" could possibly go into
"social uses"
problem is that we don't have use cases for these... use cases need
to be written
<markva> what do the shepherds of those UCs think where they should
go? Jodi, Gordon, William
uldis: would like to team up with someone to do this
<jodi> Uldis, I'm happy to help with them
<scribe> ACTION: Uldis and Jodi to create social uses cluster
[recorded in
[27]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/12/16-lld-minu
tes.html#action03]
emma: We should put a call on the list to ask others to contribute
to these use cases
<jodi> In terms of the not yet clustered, does 'digitized map
archive' belong in heterogeneous data?
emma: unclustered cases... let's try to put them into existing
clusters
<jodi> circulation data is about what gets used. hard to know where
to put it...
<markva> UC can also belong to several clusters; dont see problem
with that
<jodi> and library address data is different again
<uldis> antoine: indeed. i own the 'digitized map archive' use case.
though i am not certain which of existing clusters it fits best
Topics -- things other than use cases
<emma> [28]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Use_Case_SEO
[28] http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Use_Case_SEO
<rsinger> ?
<scribe> ACTION: Emma and Antoine to create use case
DATA.SEARCH-OPTIMIZATION [DONE] [recorded in
[29]http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-lld-minutes.html#action04]
[29] http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-lld-minutes.html#action04
<emma> sorry I've been kicked out !!
<pmurray> Did we lose our chair?
yes, we did lose you
shall we end? are we close enough?
<markva> captain overboard!
<markva> antoine, might you step in?
<rsinger> yes
<uldis> yes
<TomB> antoine is taking over to wrap up...
<scribe> completed use case is unclustered
all other actions continue
emma: reminds us to update events page
this is our way of recording the outreach of the group
Call ends
<jodi> see you next year! :)
<kefo> bye
<antoine> bye, happy new year to everyone!
<uldis> happy holidays to everyone! :)
<michaelp> See you next year
<edsu> Bonne année :-D
Summary of Action Items
[NEW] ACTION: Mark to add these definitions to the wiki page
[recorded in
[30]http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-lld-minutes.html#action01]
[NEW] ACTION: Uldis and Jodi to create social uses cluster [recorded
in [31]http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-lld-minutes.html#action03]
[PENDING] ACTION: Monica and JISC colleagues to introduce and
discuss JISC work on next call [recorded in
[32]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/11/25-lld-minu
tes.html#action02]
[PENDING] ACTION: Volunteers to send login information (openid
credentials) to William Waite to curate CKAN [recorded in
[33]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/11/25-lld-minu
tes.html#action04]
[PENDING] ACTION: Jeff to write one or two paragraphs on VIAF design
discussions [recorded in
[34]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/11/18-lld-minu
tes.html#action06]
[PENDING] ACTION: Karen and Emma to curate archive cluster for end
of december [recorded in
[35]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minu
tes.html#action02]
[PENDING] ACTION: Antoine and Michael to curate vocabulary alignment
cluster for end of december [recorded in
[36]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minu
tes.html#action07]
[PENDING] ACTION: Gordon and Martin to curate bibliographic data
cluster for end of december [recorded in
[37]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minu
tes.html#action05]
[PENDING] ACTION: Jeff and Alexander to curate authority data
cluster for end of december [recorded in
[38]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minu
tes.html#action06]
[PENDING] ACTION: Mark (and Jodi and Asaf) to curate digital objects
cluster for end of december [recorded in
[39]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minu
tes.html#action04]
[PENDING] ACTION: Alex, Jeff, Martin, MichaelP elaborate on general
purpose IT architecture for dealing with linked data with caching
feature [recorded in
[40]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/24?lld?minu
tes.html#action04]
[PENDING] ACTION: for each use case champion: on the Vocabularies
page, link to each URL use case that uses it [recorded in
[41]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23?lld?minu
tes.html#action01]
[PENDING] ACTION: GordonD and Antoine to study use cases that relate
to vocabulary merging use case [recorded in
[42]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/24-lld-minu
tes.html#action01]
[PENDING] ACTION: Everyone to update the Events page
(http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/wiki/LLD/Events) on the wiki regularly
[recorded in
[43]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/24-lld-minu
tes.html#action05]
[32]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/11/25-lld-minutes.html#action02
[33]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/11/25-lld-minutes.html#action04
[34]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/11/18-lld-minutes.html#action06
[35]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minutes.html#action02
[36]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minutes.html#action07
[37]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minutes.html#action05
[38]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minutes.html#action06
[39]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minutes.html#action04
[40]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/24%E2%80%91lld%E2%80%91minutes.html#action04
[41]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23%E2%80%91lld%E2%80%91minutes.html#action01
[42]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/24-lld-minutes.html#action01
[43]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/24-lld-minutes.html#action05
[DONE] ACTION: Emma and Antoine to create use case
DATA.SEARCH-OPTIMIZATION [recorded in
[44]http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-lld-minutes.html#action04]
[DONE] ACTION: Kai and Ed to curate citations cluster for end of
December [recorded in
[45]http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minu
tes.html#action03]
[44] http://www.w3.org/2010/12/16-lld-minutes.html#action04
[45]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/10/23-lld-minutes.html#action03
[End of minutes]
_________________________________________________________
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--
Karen Coyle
kcoyle@kcoyle.net http://kcoyle.net
ph: 1-510-540-7596
m: 1-510-435-8234
skype: kcoylenet
Received on Thursday, 16 December 2010 22:58:07 UTC