Re: ISSUE-131 (Code outside browser): Executing code outside of browser in 8.3.2.3 is vague / scary [All]

On many platforms, the acrobat reader opens the PDF within the browser
chrome (same tab on firefox).

I think this is an important requirement from an user's perspective that
they be notified when a plugin tries to execute things outside the
contract established between the user and the browser. I understand that
it is going to be extremely hard in getting it right. But until the
browser vendors/implementers raise a red flag on this, I support the
retention of this bullet. :)

I did recently mention the case of the Adobe flash plugin automatically
upgrading itself due to the new Flex software intentions. The user has
no control over the upgrade. Just because a flash movie requires an
upgraded plugin, does not mean the user has no say in consenting to the
plugin upgrade. :)

Ian Fette wrote:
> As per our 12/12 meeting, I am proposing removing the third bullet under
> 8.3.2 - "Web user agents MUST inform the user and request consent when web
> content attempts to install or execute software outside of the browser
> environment". There are many things that make this hard / impossible to get
> right, and even harder to actually get the intended effect without being
> totally annoying.
> 
> For instance, when you load a PDF, Acrobat Reader is launched outside of the
> browser context. Yet I don't really want a dialog box every time I browse to
> a PDF, I just want to see the PDF. Same thing when I click on a mailto: link
> - it's going to get shell executed, and software (my MUA) is going to run
> outside the browser. Or if there's an embedded video that causes the windows
> mediaplayer plugin to do some funky COM stuff outside of the browser -
> again, I really don't want dialog boxes here. I understand the intent and
> think it's probably a good one, but it's really hard to actually get it
> right in words, and I think it's something that browsers are doing pretty
> well anyways.
> 
> I'm not going to rehash everything in this email, please see the 12/12 notes
> for a full review of the conversation (
> http://www.w3.org/2007/12/12-wsc-minutes.html ). In that meeting, I said I
> would email back on this issue and propose that the best way to resolve it
> is to simply remove the bullet point, unless anyone feels strongly about it.
> If you do feel strongly about it, then please come up with some alternate
> text.
> 
> Thanks,
> Ian
> 
> On Nov 6, 2007 8:36 AM, <michael.mccormick@wellsfargo.com> wrote:
> 
>> The "install" part is very important, but the "execute" part is a rabbit
>> hole we probably don't want to go down.
>>
>> For example, when I point IE at a resource of MIME type ms/xls, Excel
>> launches outside the browser as a helper app.  It would be annoying if I
>> got constant warning messages every time I pull up a XLS, PDF, etc.
>> Constant warnings = ignored warnings.
>>
>> I do want to be warned when a page tries to install a plugin like
>> Acroread, but not every time that plugin runs.  Same for helpers,
>> toolbars, extensions, ActiveX controls, etc.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: public-wsc-wg-request@w3.org [mailto:public-wsc-wg-request@w3.org]
>> On Behalf Of Web Security Context Working Group Issue Tracker
>> Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2007 9:50 AM
>> To: public-wsc-wg@w3.org
>> Subject: ISSUE-131 (Code outside browser): Executing code outside of
>> browser in 8.3.2.3 is vague / scary [All]
>>
>>
>>
>> ISSUE-131 (Code outside browser): Executing code outside of browser in
>> 8.3.2.3 is vague / scary [All]
>>
>> http://www.w3.org/2006/WSC/track/issues/
>>
>> Raised by: Ian Fette
>> On product: All
>>
>> 8.3.2.3 says "Web user agents MUST inform the user and request consent
>> when web content attempts to install or execute software outside of the
>> browser environment."
>>
>> This is a bit vague and probably not what we intend. For instance, when
>> you navigate to a PDF on a browser using Acrobat Reader w/NPAPI plugin,
>> what happens is that there is a plugin running in the browser, and then
>> Acrobat Reader launches in the browser, and there's a ton of IPC between
>> the plugin and Reader running in the background (which is doing the
>> heavy lifting). This is executing software outside of the browser
>> environment, yet I don't think this is really what we were intending to
>> warn users about. At least, I will scream if I get a popup every time I
>> navigate to a PDF. Seriously.

Received on Wednesday, 2 January 2008 17:23:56 UTC