Re: 8283 discussion

Ram,

The first "in" in your statement should be "is". Generally I like this 
approach.

But my real question. The generation of a fault should also imply the 
processing/side effects etc didn't or may have occurred. Can we 
capture this semantic as well, or is this behavior too operation 
specific?


On 14 Jan 2010, at 22:51, Ram Jeyaraman wrote:

> It may be useful to state that a fault that is generated may be 
> transmitted. But whether an implementation persists the fault or 
> some information about it in some form is a design choice.  For 
> example, it is possible to have compliant implementations that never 
> persist state.
>
> How about this proposal:
>
> ·       Include changes to fault definitions as proposed to all WS-
> RA specifications.
> ·       Add [1] to the compliance section.
>
> Thanks.
>
> [1] Add to the compliance section of all WS-RA specifications
>
> The term “generate” in used relation to the various faults defined 
> by this specification. This term implies that a fault is produced 
> but does not necessarily imply that it is transmitted. When a fault 
> is generated, a compliant implementation MAY transmit the fault.
>
> From: Gilbert Pilz [mailto:gilbert.pilz@oracle.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2010 10:41 AM
> To: Ram Jeyaraman
> Cc: public-ws-resource-access@w3.org
> Subject: Re: 8283 discussion
>
> I don't want to get into how faults are recorded but it seems to me 
> that an implementation must at least allow for the recording of 
> faults. Whether such logging is enabled or not is a configuration 
> issue.
>
> - gp
>
> On 1/5/2010 9:53 AM, Ram Jeyaraman wrote:
> I am fine with clarifying this from a protocol standpoint without 
> getting into implementation details. For example, from a protocol 
> standpoint, a fault is generated due to a failure of the request. 
> But how the implementation handles the failure (such as whether/how 
> it records that information) is an implementation detail. Thanks.
>
> From: public-ws-resource-access-request@w3.org [mailto:public-ws-resource-access-request@w3.org
> ] On Behalf Of Gilbert Pilz
> Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2010 9:31 AM
> To: Ram Jeyaraman
> Cc: public-ws-resource-access@w3.org
> Subject: Re: 8283 discussion
>
> That's not what I asked. "Request failure" and "processing 
> cessation" are two different things. I assert that our definition of 
> "generate a fault" should state that when a fault is generated (a) 
> processing of the request in which the fault occurs ceases (b) some 
> record of this fault is produced and possibly recorded (depending on 
> log/trace config) (c) a fault message is optionally transmitted (if 
> a response was expected this fault is transmitted in lieu of the 
> response or no response is transmitted).
>
> - gp
>
> On 12/31/2009 3:46 PM, Ram Jeyaraman wrote:
> Is it fair to assume that the act of generating a fault will halt 
> the processing of the request in who's context the fault was 
> generated?
>
> Yes, readers familiar with general fault semantics would conclude 
> that the corresponding request failed when a fault is generated.
>
> From: Gilbert Pilz [mailto:gilbert.pilz@oracle.com]
> Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 1:42 PM
> To: Ram Jeyaraman
> Cc: public-ws-resource-access@w3.org
> Subject: Re: 8283 discussion
>
> Do we need to say anything about what effect generating a fault has 
> on the processing of requests? Is it fair to assume that the act of 
> generating a fault will halt the processing of the request in who's 
> context the fault was generated?
>
> - gp
>
> On 12/15/2009 10:46 AM, Ram Jeyaraman wrote:
> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=8283
>
> Pursuant to the action I took from last meeting, I suggest adding a 
> definition [1] of  what “generate” means in the context of faults.
>
> Thus, to resolve this issue, I suggest:
> Include changes to fault definitions as proposed in the issue.
> Add [1] to the compliance section.
>
> Thanks.
>
> [1] Add to the compliance section of all WS-RA specifications
>
> The term “generate” in used relation to the various faults defined 
> by this specification. This term implies that a fault is produced 
> but does not necessarily imply that it is transmitted.

Take care:

     Dr. David Snelling < David . Snelling . UK . Fujitsu . com >
     Fujitsu Laboratories of Europe Limited
     Hayes Park Central
     Hayes End Road
     Hayes, Middlesex  UB4 8FE
     Reg. No. 4153469

     +44-7590-293439 (Mobile)






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