Re: MathML and "Clipboard API and events"

I see. I wasn't aware of that reference since I didn't find it in my
searching. In that case, I don't have any particular objection though I
don't really know what would needs to be sanitized.

Daniel


On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 4:12 PM, Paul Topping <pault@dessci.com> wrote:

>  http://www.w3.org/TR/MathML3/appendixb.html mentions both Mac and
> Windows formats for MathML. ****
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* dcheng@google.com [mailto:dcheng@google.com] *On Behalf Of *Daniel
> Cheng
> *Sent:* Monday, April 15, 2013 3:49 PM
>
> *To:* Paul Topping
> *Cc:* Hallvord Reiar Michaelsen Steen; public-webapps@w3.org
> *Subject:* Re: MathML and "Clipboard API and events"****
>
>  ** **
>
> On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 3:07 PM, Paul Topping <pault@dessci.com> wrote:***
> *
>
>  Why would the answer to this question be dictated by the need to convert
> the MathML format to some other “native” format? I just want my app (native
> or web) to be able to identify the clipboard data type so it can consume
> the data as it sees fit. Conversion to some other format is but one thing
> an app can do with data. If apps can’t identify MathML with confidence,
> they are stuck with ad hoc sniffing of any non-specific data types that
> might contain MathML. I might look at the plain text and XML data types to
> see if they contain “<math>”, for example. ****
>
>  ​Because if there is no native format to convert it too, then every
> browser is likely to do it differently anyway... which means you're stuck
> with ad hoc detection of MathML anyway.****
>
> ** **
>
> Like I said, there's nothing that stops you from setting text/mathml on
> the HTML clipboard today. It just won't have the magic conversion to the
> native type.****
>
>  ****
>
>   ​​****
>
>  ****
>
> In some sense MathML does have a native format on Mac and Windows.
> Microsoft and Design Science (my company) got together years ago and
> defined one. There are some other companies that support it but it seems
> like it is hard to get the word out there with a “standard” offered by
> commercial app vendors.****
>
>  ​I can't find any information about this native format.​ And even if
> there is a native format, that is not the same as having a standard format
> in the native data transfer object (IDataObject on Windows, NSPasteboard on
> Mac).****
>
>  If browsers supported MathML rendering and a distinct MathML clipboard
> type and both were defined by the W3C, it would go a long way to
> establishing a standard that matters and it would get adopted widely.****
>
>  ****
>
> Paul****
>
>  ****
>
> *From:* dcheng@google.com [mailto:dcheng@google.com] *On Behalf Of *Daniel
> Cheng
> *Sent:* Monday, April 15, 2013 1:56 PM
> *To:* Paul Topping
> *Cc:* Hallvord Reiar Michaelsen Steen; public-webapps@w3.org****
>
>
> *Subject:* Re: MathML and "Clipboard API and events"****
>
>  ****
>
> When I suggested formats that implementations ought to support, I
> specifically mentioned image/svg+xml because it was mostly convertible to
> native types (Windows metafile on Windows, PDF on Mac). I don't think
> anyone's implemented this conversion, but it's technically possible.****
>
>  ****
>
> On the other hand, MathML doesn't have a corresponding native equivalent
> on Windows or Mac. You could argue that this is a chicken and egg problem,
> but without any native format equivalents, there's no good way to map that
> data.****
>
>  ****
>
> You should still be able to set MathML in the clipboard if you want. It
> just won't be visible to native apps.****
>
>  ****
>
> Daniel****
>
>  ****
>
> On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 8:44 AM, Paul Topping <pault@dessci.com> wrote:***
> *
>
> Hi Halvord,
>
> Yes, your rewording sounds like a good direction to me. I still worry that
> placing plain text on the clipboard along with MathML will result in a lot
> of apps failing to paste the MathML but doing so would probably be
> considered a bug in such an app.
>
> Thanks for filing the bugs. I suspect that the MathML community would be
> eager to help define what needs to get stripped out of MathML to maintain
> security. However, speaking for myself, I do not know what kinds of things
> are considered dangerous. For example, MathML has markup that lets a math
> expression act as a hyperlink. Do we need to strip that out completely or
> is that dependent on the url? If there are guidelines on what is considered
> dangerous, then we could figure out exactly which MathML constructs need to
> be pruned. Or is there some other procedure for getting this done?
>
> Paul****
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Hallvord Reiar Michaelsen Steen [mailto:hallvord@opera.com]
> > Sent: Monday, April 15, 2013 1:50 AM
> > To: public-webapps@w3.org; Paul Topping
> > Subject: Re: MathML and "Clipboard API and events"
> >****
>
> > Hi Paul, thanks for your comments.
> >
> > > Mathematical information
> > >
> > > This section says "MathML often needs to be transformed to be
> > > copied as plain text, for example to make sure "to the power of"
> > > is shown with the caret "^" sign in a formula plain-text input."
> > > Such a transformation should not be part of a normal copy operation
> > > since that would transfer MathML. My concern is that readers get the
> > > idea that x 2 should always or often be transformed to x^2.
> >
> >
> > What about saying something like
> >
> >
> > "Some applications may want to place plain text alternatives along with
> > MathML formulas on he clipboard, for example to make sure .." ?
> >
> >
> > >  10.  Mandatory data types
> > >
> > > I am surprised not to see a MathML type in this list
> >
> >
> > Well, since you mention it.. I've filed a bug (
> > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=21698 ) in response to
> > your question. If you have comments or information please add (either by
> > replying here or in the bug). Would be great if you could help me
> understand
> > whether allowing an application to write MathML to the clipboard could
> > expose an app to attacks if the MathML markup is pasted without further
> > processing - see also
> > https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=21700
> >
> >
> > --
> > Hallvord R. M. Steen
> > Core tester, Opera Software
> >
> >
> >
> >****
>
>   ****
>
>  ** **
>