RE: Action item: Tabindex technique

Hi, Yvette.

Something about using the data table for the form controls just occurred
to me.I was just looking at your example again with your most recent
comments in mind.

First, it's good that you used the title attribute here. JAWS,
Window-Eyes, and Home Page Reader should all handle that well.

But I just realized something about the data table and JAWS: once in
"Forms" mode, JAWS won't report the row or column headers anymore: it
will only report the title for each input element.

I think this is probably OK for your example, because you've been
careful to put all the necessary information into the title attribute.

In fact, it may even be a bonus! In table navigation mode, screen
readers would report headers that change as the user moves from column
to column or row to row. (I think the title attribute will also be
read.) In forms mode (which HPR calls Controls mode), the AT would read
the title attribute.

Still, I wonder if the tab order problem isn't an artifact of the
decision to use a table for this form. I think the form could be
implemented using fieldset and legend, with each fieldset inside a div;
CSS could be used to position the divs side by side and the tab order
wouldn't be an issue. (I think so, anyway-- but I haven't tried it so I
might be missing something obvious.) I'm not sure this matters--
certainly a lot of people use tables the way they example does, and your
technique works well for that scenario.

So let's talk about it on Tuesday, and if everyone agrees we can put it
out for survey.

John



"Good design is accessible design." 
John Slatin, Ph.D.
Director, Accessibility Institute
University of Texas at Austin
FAC 248C
1 University Station G9600
Austin, TX 78712
ph 512-495-4288, f 512-495-4524
email jslatin@mail.utexas.edu
web http://www.utexas.edu/research/accessibility/


 


-----Original Message-----
From: public-wcag-teamb-request@w3.org
[mailto:public-wcag-teamb-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Yvette Hoitink
Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 10:30 am
To: public-wcag-teamb@w3.org
Subject: RE: Action item: Tabindex technique


Hi John,

I'm glad you like the technique.

I liked your suggestion to add an explanation that elements with a
tabindex will receive focus before the other elements. I checked the
spec and elements that do not have a tabindex or a tabindex with value 0
will be navigated next, in the order in which they occur in the delivery
unit. I have added this information to the technique.

You asked whether my technique to use a data table for the form was
acceptable. I had the same doubts which is why I added title attributes
to the input fields. We had already decided in 1.3.1 that using the
title attribute was a sufficient technique for labelling interactive
elements. So even if using a data table is not sufficient to label the
interactive elements, the title attribute should cover it.

Yvette Hoitink
Heritas, Alphen aan den Rijn, the Netherlands
E-mail: y.p.hoitink@heritas.nl
WWW: http://www.heritas.nl 




> -----Original Message-----
> From: public-wcag-teamb-request@w3.org 
> [mailto:public-wcag-teamb-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of John M Slatin
> Sent: vrijdag 17 februari 2006 16:26
> To: Yvette Hoitink; public-wcag-teamb@w3.org
> Subject: RE: Action item: Tabindex technique
> 
> 
> Thanks, Yvette!
> 
> This looks very good.
> 
> I added a Status section at the top, to help us (and Ben) keep track 
> of the technique as it moves toward acceptance.
> 
> I have one suggestion and one question.
> 
> Suggestion:
> Add a sentence/note explaining that all elements (or is it all 
> focusable
> elements?) with tabindex will receive focus before *any* element that 
> does not have tabindex.
> 
> So for example, if the form controls in your example have tabindex, 
> but the links in the navbar do not have tabindex, users would have to 
> tab through the form in order to reach the navbar.
> 
>  But it occurs to me I don't know what would get focus immediately 
> after tabbing through the form: would it be to the next focusable 
> element in the code? Or would it be the first focusable element in the

> delivery unit?
> 
> But that wasn't the question I wanted to ask. Here's the question:
> 
> I notice that the form is contained within a data table. I've done 
> this myself, but I want to make sure we all agree that this is 
> acceptable practice for WCAG 2.0.
> 
> I think it is: there are logical relationships here, not just between 
> individual form controls and their labels, but between groups of form 
> controls.
> 
> So: is it OK to use the table here? Or do we want to insist on using 
> <fieldset> to group related controls, with CSS to control layout; and 
> would that be an alternative way to make the tab order work properly?
> 
> Thoughts, anyone?
> 
> Thanks!
> John
> 
> 
> "Good design is accessible design." 
> John Slatin, Ph.D.
> Director, Accessibility Institute
> University of Texas at Austin
> FAC 248C
> 1 University Station G9600
> Austin, TX 78712
> ph 512-495-4288, f 512-495-4524
> email jslatin@mail.utexas.edu
> web http://www.utexas.edu/research/accessibility/
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: public-wcag-teamb-request@w3.org 
> [mailto:public-wcag-teamb-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Yvette Hoitink
> Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 6:18 am
> To: public-wcag-teamb@w3.org
> Subject: Action item: Tabindex technique
> 
> 
> Hello everyone,
> 
> Last Tuesday, we discussed using tabindex to specify a taborder that 
> does not follow the order the elements are placed in the code. We 
> decided that in some cases, it was a sufficient technique (for example

> for navigating forms column-by-column), just as long as relationships 
> in the content were still followed. I created a technique for that in
> 2.4.7:
> <http://trace.wisc.edu/wcag_wiki/index.php?title=Creating_a_lo
> gical_tab_
> orde
> r_through_links%2C_form_controls%2C_and_objects>
> 
> Comments are welcome as always!
> 
> Yvette Hoitink
> Heritas, Alphen aan den Rijn, the Netherlands
> E-mail: y.p.hoitink@heritas.nl
> WWW: http://www.heritas.nl
> 
>

Received on Friday, 17 February 2006 20:51:06 UTC