W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-vocabs@w3.org > January 2014

Re: tracking issues about Actions?

From: Sam Goto <goto@google.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2014 21:30:53 -0800
Message-ID: <CAMtUnc45um6Dp7johNtaMvxu93rmjzmLmx498dV6OWB8TnLeyQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: ☮ elf Pavlik ☮ <perpetual-tripper@wwelves.org>
Cc: "public-vocabs@w3.org" <public-vocabs@w3.org>
On Mon, Jan 27, 2014 at 12:48 PM, ☮ elf Pavlik ☮ <
perpetual-tripper@wwelves.org> wrote:

> On 01/27/2014 05:56 PM, Sam Goto wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 4:25 PM, ☮ elf Pavlik ☮
>> <perpetual-tripper@wwelves.org <mailto:perpetual-tripper@wwelves.org>>
>>
>> wrote:
>>
>>     Howdy!
>>
>>     I start working again on projects where I would like to use Action
>>     subtree. Maybe also try to experiment with them integrated with
>>     Hydra API http://www.hydra-cg.com/spec/__latest/schema.org/
>>
>>     <http://www.hydra-cg.com/spec/latest/schema.org/>
>>
>>
>> Neat. May I ask what the use case is?
>>
> Sure! I play with developing various open source components (currently
> mostly prototyping some in javascript) for building distributed
> environments of apps (human interfaces) and daemons (local and remote
> services) supporting real time geo-aware collaboration scenarios. Web page
> from one very early test deployment: http://dspace.elevate.at/
>
> In conceptual model People can interact with various *POIs* (Points of
> Interest). Types of POIs currently include *Person*, *Place*, *Vehicle* and
> possibly we can add other ones making sense here like *IndividualProduct*.
> I also use concept of *Party*, somehow similar to online chartrooms. People
> using compatible, #unhosted style apps, can connect with those apps to
> multiple Parties on any number of remote origins - *Portals*. Everyone also
> controls independent, self-hosted/friend-hosted *Pod* - Personal Data
> Space, #IndyWeb / #PersonalClouds style to **stay in full control over
> one's own data**. For example I can publish my own position updates to such
> personal Pod and others participating in the same Parties can subsribe to
> real time updates directly to my Pod, which makes Portals responsible only
> for 'introducing' participants and they can even shut down after making
> introduction between People. I plan to approach in similar way a feed of my
> *Actions* (ActivityStreams).
>
> For very precise example we can use: PhotographAction
> "elf Pavlik took photo of Alice, in café erde, using his PDA"
>
> {
>   "@id": "https://wwelves.org/perpetual-tripper/actions/
> aade1722-f53e-400b-b7c0-70f7a2550ad5"
>   "@context": "http://schema.org",
>   "@type": "PhotographAction",
>   "endTime": {
>     "@value": "2014-01-27T19:31:22"
>     "@type": "http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema#dateTime"
>   },
>   "agent": {
>     "@id": "https://wwelves.org/perpetual-tripper",
>     "@type": "Person",
>     "name": "☮ elf Pavlik ☮"
>   },
>   "object": {
>     "@id": "https://example.net/people/alice",
>     "@type": "Person",
>     "name": "Alice"
>   },
>   "location": {
>     "@id": "http://cafeerde.com/",
>     "@type": "FoodEstablishment",
>     "name": "café erde"
>     "geo": {
>       "latitude": 47.069602,
>       "longitude": 15.435891
>     }
>   },
>   "instrument": {
>     "@id": "https://wwelves.org/perpetual-tripper/stuff/elfdroid",
>     "@type": "IndividualProduct",
>     "name": "elfdroid"
>   },
>   "result": {
>     "@id": "https://wwelves.org/perpetual-tripper/photos/
> 258378dc-3eef-42a6-8e3c-f48b42b39d6f"
>     "@type": "Photograph"
>   }
> }
>
> It comes from interaction:
>
> 0. Earlier I used *CheckInAction* which I sent to my personal Pod so it
> shows up in my activity stream. I also sent this *CheckInAction* to small
> Portal hosted by http://cafe-erde.com/ which enables others who don't
> follow my activity stream to still discover my presence. café erde Portal
> sent me back list of People who have earlier annonced themselves present in
> this Place, including Alice. In this case I already follow Alice's
>  activity stream on her Pod, so our devices would know about each other
> present even without café erde Portal, just by using our existing
> Friend2Friend relation :)
> 1. I open an app
> 2. Select my current location: café erde
> 3. Select from list of people present here: Alice
> 4. Select from actions available for Alice: 'Take Photo'
> 5. Click!
> 6. My PDA posts image data to my personal Pod, which returns permanent URI
> 7. I use this photo URI on my #IndyWeb domain for "result" object in my
> PhotographAction example: "@id": "https://wwelves.org/
> perpetual-tripper/photo/258378dc-3eef-42a6-8e3c-f48b42b39d6f"
> 8. I also store my PhotographAction on my Pod, which gives me independent
> permanent URI for this Action: "@id": "https://wwelves.org/
> perpetual-tripper/actions/aade1722-f53e-400b-b7c0-70f7a2550ad5"
>
> now i can do some more online socializing
> 9. I have option to publish it to my public activity stream, or to some
> restricted feeds, I could create dedicated feed even just for my stay at
> this place and share it only with other people present here.
> 10. I also can send this action to café erde Portal in case it didn't
> start following my activity stream after I checked in...
> 10. I can send this action as well to any number of restaurant ranking
> directory services which provide API accepting: PhotographAction.
> 11. I could reference this photograph taken in my ReviewAction submitted
> to (syndicated with) !any number of chosen by me services!.
>
> {
>   "@id": "https://wwelves.org/perpetual-tripper/actions/
> 8d244fc0-b87f-4006-8f7a-d476959f75c8",
>   "@type": "ReviewAction",
>   "endDate": ...,
>   "location" ...,
>   "resultReview": {
>     "@id": "https://wwelves.org/perpetual-tripper/reviews/
> 0e4f8dd1-cb0a-436a-95a7-9c2451c0c559"
>     "@type": "Review"
>   },
>  "result": {
>     "@id": "https://wwelves.org/perpetual-tripper/photos/
> 258378dc-3eef-42a6-8e3c-f48b42b39d6f"
>     "@type": "Photograph"
>   }
> }
>
> From interaction perspective it should work as easy as have my list of
> restaurant directory services. And after taking photo in Place matching the
> scope of given directory, app gives me list of checkboxes asking which
> services i want to *syndicate* my reviews with.
>
> Since I can only control apps running on my device and daemons running on
> my pod. I need to use very generic APIs for 3rd party services which I
> would like apps and daemons I use to interact with. When all such services
> can 'understand' common *real world* Actions, it seems much more
> approachable to design for such environment where no one has full control
> over all the interacting components...
>
> In general we aim that everyone can accomplish same results in many
> different way. Depending on one's own preference and interoperability of
> components involved in given interaction.
>
> As side note I currently combine RESTful HTTP with The Bayeux Protocol for
> HTTP based pub/sub (real time). At the same time keeping it generic enough
> so one can plug in options like XMPP pub/sub or for some cases use
> Webfinger etc.
>
> BTW how can I link from Photograph back to Action it came as *resultOf*?
> Same applies to any *Thing* which comes as *result* of an Action.
>
>
Ugh, we don't have currently any way to link one action from another. There
is some design that was done for http://schema.org/Event, which we could
potentially leverage.


>
>
>> You might want to take a look at a few demos/prototypes I've been
>> building with examples, which should give you a concrete idea of where
>> things are going.
>>
>> http://code.sgo.to/crawler/yaap.html#url=http://code.sgo.to
>>
> In Chromium Version 30.0.1599.101 (227552) in javasctipt console:
> Uncaught TypeError: Cannot read property 'length' of undefined yaap.js:266
>
> Firefox 24.0 shows me JSON-LD with links but when I click one I get
> SyntaxError: JSON.parse: unexpected character
> var parent = JSON.parse(e.target.parentElement.innerText);
>

I may have fixed that (although i didn't try with your specific version of
chrome). Try again?


>
>
>>
>>
>>     I wonder if we should try to bounce Actions specific feedback back
>>     and forth over this mailing list or use some issue tracker to keep
>>     track on every issue separately?
>>
>>
>> Lets use this mailing list for the moment, until it gets too
>> verbose/noisy.
>>
>>
>>     Some of them I already have mentioned but possibly my email have
>>     drowned in archives of this list ;)
>>     http://lists.w3.org/Archives/__Public/public-vocabs/2013Nov/
>> __0200.html
>>
>>     <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-vocabs/2013Nov/0200.html>
>>
>>     Once I get back on playing with Actions I expect gathering more
>>     feedback and would like to pipe it into some workflow where we can
>>     track it and resolve in some reasonable time. If I could choose way
>>     for tracking issues, as for today I would go with github issue
>>     tracker :)
>>
>>     Other suggestions?
>>
>>
>> The default public-vocabs process for filling bugs is fine for the
>> moment. You can reach out to me personally too at goto@google.com
>> <mailto:goto@google.com>, in case you feel more comfortable talking to a
>> smaller audience too :)
>>
> Ok, let's try that!
> Looking at issues which I raised in
> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-vocabs/2013Nov/0200.html they
> still look not addressed :(
>
>
Yep, sorry, that's my fault :( I'll get to it as soon as I'm done
publishing a baseline spec.


> cheers!
>
Received on Tuesday, 28 January 2014 05:31:21 UTC

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