W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-tt@w3.org > August 2017

{agenda} TTWG Meeting 2017-08-31

From: Nigel Megitt <nigel.megitt@bbc.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2017 10:12:19 +0000
To: Timed Text Working Group <public-tt@w3.org>
Message-ID: <D5CC353E.4783F%nigel.megitt@bbc.co.uk>
This meeting is scheduled for up to 90m. Please be ready for a prompt start at 10:03am Boston time.

Our teleconference is scheduled with reference to Boston Time, the correct time of this teleconference in your locale may change.

Check https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?iso=20170831T10&p1=43

Thursdays 10:03am-12:00pm Boston local

Joining details:

see https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-tt/2016Oct/0009.html
(members-only link – if you can't see this and wish to join please contact me)

Agenda+ Assign Roles

Chairs: Nigel Megitt

Scribe: usually Nigel – open to offers!

Regrets: None

Activity since last meeting:
See individual agenda items for recent activity on specific products

Cross-product TTWG board: http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/board/
We are still using tracker for actions unrelated to issues.
Please do not add or modify issues in tracker!

IMSC: https://github.com/w3c/imsc/pulse
TTML1: https://github.com/w3c/ttml1/pulse
TTML2: https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pulse
TTML Profile Registry: https://github.com/w3c/tt-profile-registry/pulse
TTML-WebVTT mapping: https://github.com/w3c/ttml-webvtt-mapping/pulse
WebVTT: https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/pulse

Agenda+ Prioritise discussion for this meeting and look ahead

Check-point for order of topics – I'd suggest, subject to reordering:
1. TPAC advanced planning
2. TTML2 Horizontal Review
4. TTML issue assignment and progress tracking
5. TTML1 & TTML2 issues, actions, PRs, editorial actions etc
6. WebVTT feedback (David Singer to Chair if present)
7. HDR in PNG (placeholder)
8. Progress on HTMLCue proposal (placeholder)
9. AOB – please notify of any other AOB now!

Reminder re future milestones and meetings:

September meetings:

Thursday 7th September: TTWG phone meeting ? Hour(s) - NM doubtful
Thursday 14th September: TTWG phone meeting ? Hour(s)
Thursday 21st September: TTWG phone meeting ? Hour(s)
Thursday 28th September: TTWG phone meeting ? Hour(s)

IMSC 2 and TTML2 publication events: see the timeline of upcoming work at https://www.w3.org/wiki/TimedText/Publications#Timeline_of_TTML2_and_IMSC2_work

Agenda+ TPAC 2017 Advanced planning

As Chair I have completed the WBS survey, requesting:

Attendance for ~10 people.
No preference for date, meet on any two days.
Flexible about days.
Joint meeting with CSS WG and with Web and TV IG.
Avoid overlap with Web and TV IG.
Permit observers.
Not member confidential.
Estimate ~6 attending technical plenary.
Estimate ~3 attending AC sessions Tuesday and Thursday.


We will jointly meet the Web & TV IG on the Monday, and have invited CSS WG to attend our meeting on the Friday, times to be confirmed.

Agenda+ TTML2 Horizontal Review

The CSS WG has been invited to meet us at TPAC on the Friday.

Collate list of the issues we want to open with CSS WG

This is at https://www.w3.org/wiki/TTML/CSSRequirements

We also need to explain what the use case is for the features, rather than just each styling feature itself.

TAG, CSSWG and Privacy feedback needs processing into TTML2 issues.

CSS Review of TTML2, threads: FW: TTML2 horizontal review with CSS<https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2016Dec/0013.html> and Fwd: Subtitle/caption styling + TTML + CSS<https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2016Dec/0019.html>

Internationalisation review by r12a has generated several issues on TTML2 and comments on existing issues (see below), this week mainly about alignment with relatively recent CSS developments.

CSS 2.2 request for reviews from TTWG et al: Pre-announcement of CR for CSS 2.2 & request for reviews<https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2016Dec/0017.html> When can we schedule a review and gather feedback?

Agenda+ IMSC (now incorporates Unicode ticket)

IMSC Tests released as v1.0.0 at https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests/releases/tag/v1.0.0 .

IMSC1.0.1 Internationalisation issues (if Richard and/or Addison are able to attend)

IMSC 1.0.1
IMSC 1.0.1 WD for Wide Review published at https://www.w3.org/TR/ttml-imsc1.0.1/
IMSC 1 Rec available at https://www.w3.org/TR/2016/REC-ttml-imsc1-20160421/
Patent policy call for exclusions sent 2017-02-03, archived at https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2017Feb/0006.html

Editor's draft is directly viewable at http://w3c.github.io/imsc/imsc1/spec/ttml-ww-profiles.html
IMSC Implementation Page: https://www.w3.org/wiki/TimedText/IMSC1_implementation_page.
IMSC Tests repository: https://github.com/w3c/imsc-tests

Unicode CLDR discussion
Unicode ticket is at http://unicode.org/cldr/trac/ticket/8915
Pierre's response to the recent update is at http://unicode.org/cldr/trac/ticket/8915#comment:9
Email response from Shervin at Unicode https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2016Dec/0018.html

Merged IMSC pull requests:
Clarify extent units<https://github.com/w3c/imsc/pull/252>
Fixes incorrect namespace prefixes<https://github.com/w3c/imsc/pull/251>
Open IMSC pull requests: None
New or discussed IMSC issues: None
Closed IMSC issues:
Wrong namespace prefixes<https://github.com/w3c/imsc/issues/250>
Mixed units in tts:origin and tts:extent value<https://github.com/w3c/imsc/issues/249>
Merged IMSC Tests pull requests: None
Open IMSC Tests pull requests: None
New or discussed IMSC Tests issues: None
Closed IMSC Tests issues: None

Agenda+ TTML issue assignment and progress tracking (20 minutes maximum)

We have now published the WD for WR however there are still many issues open, and we intend also to apply multiple fixes as already agreed for TTML1.

At the moment of writing this agenda, there are:

TTML1 issues:

  *   3 open issues with no milestone, none marked as discussed and agreed
  *   37 open issues in "3rd Ed" milestone, 15 marked as discussed and agreed
  *   11 open issues in "3rd Ed Test Suite" milestone, none marked as discussed and agreed

TTML2 issues:

  *   2 open issues on the Editor's CR Work List milestone, none of which has a PR and one of which is marked as "works for me";
  *   58 open issues with no milestone, none of which has a PR open label.
  *   the "Group's WR action required list" and Editor's WR Work List milestones have been deleted.

Agenda+ TTML1 & TTML2 issues, actions, PRs, editorial actions etc

ID      State   Title   Person  Due Date        Associated with
ACTION-443<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/443>[(edit)]<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/443/edit>     open    Prepare a document showing mapping arib ruby extension features to ttml2 for use as a liaison document to arib.<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/443>   Glenn Adams     2016-08-26      TTML2<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/products/4>
ACTION-462<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/462>[(edit)]<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/462/edit>     open    Create issue on ttml2 to add "mapping from other versions and profiles of ttml"<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/462>   Glenn Adams     2016-04-28      TTML2<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/products/4>
ACTION-503<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/503>[(edit)]<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/503/edit>     open    Send a reminder to groups for ttml2 review by 8th september<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/503>       Thierry Michel  2017-08-17      TTML2<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/products/4>

Most recent WD published at https://www.w3.org/TR/2017/WD-ttml2-20170630/

Merged TTML1 Pull Requests: None
Merged TTML2 Pull Requests:
Remove HLG HDR step 8 superscript 5b<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/398>
Ednote font variant position<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/407>
Add audio element to @animate application list (#401).<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/408>
Add note clarifying typical Mongolian usage pattern with ruby positio…<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/pull/409>
Open TTML1 Pull Requests: None
Open TTML2 Pull Requests: None
New TTML1 Issues: None
New TTML2 Issues:
Add Privacy of Preference text as in IMSC<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/402>
Security and privacy re external resources<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/403>
Reference CORS, Fetch etc<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/404>
Privacy review umbrella issue<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/405>
Add equivalent CSS properties to style attributes<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/406>
Closed TTML1 Issues: None
Closed TTML2 Issues:
Should we allow more overhang for Chinese?<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/261>
It should be easier to specify direction for RTL script users <https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/263>
How to space base characters where shiftRuby kicks in for group ruby?<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/258>
Error in HLG HDR appendix step 8<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/397>
Metadata examples do not include xml:lang (editorial) <https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/271>
animate attribute element list omits audio<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/401>
Default ruby position may be on the wrong side for tblr (eg. mongolian)<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/254>
Discussed TTML1 Issues: None
Discussed TTML2 Issues:
rubyAlign withBase<https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues/248>

Focus topic(s) for this week


Iterate through open issues with no PR – decide action to take on each, e.g. defer to CR, defer to TTML.next, close etc.

If there are any issues that we decide need to be resolved before WR a proposal for the fix is needed ASAP (basically, it's too late already unless it can easily be agreed by the group).

Current open issues: https://github.com/w3c/ttml1/issues and https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/issues
See spreadsheet of editorial actions at https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/blob/master/spec/ednotes.xlsx
Edit/build instructions now in README in ttml2/spec/ at https://github.com/w3c/ttml2/blob/master/spec/README.md

Agenda+ WebVTT review feedback

ID      State   Title   Person  Due Date        Associated with
ACTION-396<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/396>[(edit)]<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/396/edit>     open    Produce evidence of request for wide review for webvtt, for the archive<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/396>   David Singer    2015-04-17      WebVTT 1.0<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/products/8>
ACTION-502<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/502>[(edit)]<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/502/edit>     open    Explain to david that we need a more consistent disposition of comments for webvtt.<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/502>       Thierry Michel  2017-08-10      WebVTT 1.0<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/products/8>

Discussion on WebVTT review feedback and next steps.

What are the WG's views on the dispositions generated by the CG?

Resolve to publish a new WD? (not strictly necessary)

WebVTT Wide review wiki page: https://www.w3.org/wiki/WebVTT_Wide_Review

Open Pull requests: None
Merged Pull requests:
Prepare a new WD.<https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/pull/351>
Allow empty identifier for regions in the data model<https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/pull/354>
Editorial: Clarify CSS escapes in an example<https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/pull/356>
Ask for web-platform-tests in CONTRIBUTING.md<https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/pull/357>
New issues:
Need tests for :cue-region(id) pseudo-class<https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/issues/355>
Closed issues:
Unclear requirements around VTTRegion id<https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/issues/353>
What are "CSS character escape sequences"?<https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/issues/352>
Use [Exposed] consistently<https://github.com/w3c/webvtt/issues/358>
Recently discussed issues: None

Agenda+ HDR in PNG [placeholder agenda item]

We published this Note at https://www.w3.org/TR/png-hdr-pq/ (republished 25th July incorporating fix for typo)

Repo for PQ HDR in PNG: https://github.com/w3c/png-hdr-pq
Draft WG Note: https://w3c.github.io/png-hdr-pq/

Merged pull requests: None
Open pull requests: None
New or discussed issues: None
Closed issues: None

Agenda+ HTMLCue proposal progress update. [placeholder agenda item]

ID      State   Title   Person  Due Date        Associated with
ACTION-441<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/441>[(edit)]<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/441/edit>     open    Kick off the analysis work on the vttcue carrying html idea.<https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/441>      Andreas Tai     2015-11-05

See https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2016Apr/0012.html for further information on this, this week.

Also HTML import and HTMLCue?<https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2016Sep/0003.html> email from 2016-09-06.

See also the notes from the TAG meeting (see agenda item above) at which the inability to instantiate TextTrackCue objects in most browsers was mentioned.

Agenda+ AOB


Wiki http://www.w3.org/wiki/TimedText
Received on Wednesday, 30 August 2017 10:12:45 UTC

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