- From: Silvia Pfeiffer <silviapfeiffer1@gmail.com>
- Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 18:56:20 +1000
- To: Nigel Megitt <nigel.megitt@bbc.co.uk>
- Cc: Public TTWG List <public-tt@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <CAHp8n2=crX5KzFxEUrBV=DjYktFRF_X5PWmes75UuwL_E9WreQ@mail.gmail.com>
FYI I registered for China meeting, too.
Cheers,
Silvia.
On 27 Sep 2013 01:05, "Nigel Megitt" <nigel.megitt@bbc.co.uk> wrote:
> Minutes at: http://www.w3.org/2013/09/26-tt-minutes.html
>
> [1]W3C
>
> [1] http://www.w3.org/
>
> - DRAFT -
>
> Timed Text Working Group Teleconference
>
> 26 Sep 2013
>
> See also: [2]IRC log
>
> [2] http://www.w3.org/2013/09/26-tt-irc
>
> Attendees
>
> Present
> +44.154.558.aaaa, pal, nigel, Sean, tmichel,
> +1.858.882.aabb, mike, mijordan, Plh
>
> Regrets
> Chair
> SV_MEETING_CHAIR
>
> Scribe
> nigel
>
> Contents
>
> * [3]Topics
> 1. [4]f2f at tpac
> 2. [5]Issues
> 3. [6]aob
> 4. [7]next week
> * [8]Summary of Action Items
> __________________________________________________________
>
> <trackbot> Date: 26 September 2013
>
> f2f at tpac
>
> <tmichel> So far we have the following people registered at the
> TTML WG F2F
>
> <tmichel> Registered as group participant:
>
> <tmichel> Philippe Le Hégaret <plh@w3.org> (W3C Staff) :
> attending Monday
>
> <tmichel> Mark Vickers <mark_vickers@cable.comcast.com>
> (Comcast Corporation) : attending Monday
>
> <tmichel> Glenn Adams <glenn@skynav.com> (Cox Communications,
> Inc.) : attending Monday, Friday
>
> <tmichel> Jean-Pierre EVAIN <evain@ebu.ch> (European
> Broadcasting Union (EBU-UER)) : attending Monday
>
> <tmichel> David Singer <singer@apple.com> (Apple, Inc.) :
> attending Monday, Friday
>
> current list of topics is at:
> [9]http://www.w3.org/wiki/Talk:TimedText/tpac
>
> [9] http://www.w3.org/wiki/Talk:TimedText/tpac
>
> <tmichel> Cyril Concolato
> <cyril.concolato@telecom-paristech.fr> (INSTITUT TELECOM) :
> attending Monday
>
> <tmichel> Pierre-Anthony Lemieux <pal@sandflow.com> (MovieLabs)
> : attending Monday, Friday
>
> <tmichel> Thierry Michel <tmichel@w3.org> (W3C Staff) :
> attending Friday
>
> <tmichel> So that is 7 people attending
>
> <tmichel>
> [10]https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35125/TPAC2013/registrants#T
> T
>
> [10] https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35125/TPAC2013/registrants#TT
>
> I'm likely to register too, assuming we can set goals etc.
>
> sean: add to list: advanced animation and profiles (the latter
> already present)
>
> tmichel: We should aim to have a functionally correct TTML 2
> after the two days
>
> sean: also a working plan for what to do re WebVTT
>
> nigel: what about live TTML?
>
> sean: could be a good opportunity depending on state of work
> that can be presented by EBU
>
> nigel: should be able to present the use cases and potential
> solution areas
>
> tmichel: how should we call this?
>
> nigel: two topics. 1) Distribution of segmented TTML. 2)
> Contribution of live TTML, with handovers etc.
>
> sean: can tmichel and nigel take this agenda forward?
>
> tmichel: yes
>
> nigel: yes
>
> <scribe> scribeNick: nigel
>
> scribeNick is nigel
>
> issue-22?
>
> <trackbot> issue-22 -- window fade in/out not supported? --
> pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [11]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/22
>
> [11] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/22
>
> <tmichel> scribe:nigel
>
> Issues
>
> issue-22?
>
> <trackbot> issue-22 -- window fade in/out not supported? --
> pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [12]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/22
>
> [12] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/22
>
> sean: do we have the mechanics in the new mechanism to meet the
> 708 window fade-in and fade-out requirements?
> ... there are some effects that may not map from 708 to
> animation.
> ... Can we close this issue based on what we can achieve with
> the proposed solution?
>
> mike: it's meaningless to get the effect without meeting 708.
>
> sean: what properties do we need to add to meet all of the 708
> effects?
> ... We need a note on this issue and re-open it.
>
> reopen issue-22
>
> <trackbot> Re-opened issue-22.
>
> action mike to add additional notes to issue-22
>
> <trackbot> Created ACTION-209 - Add additional notes to
> issue-22 [on Mike Dolan - due 2013-10-03].
>
> issue-23?
>
> <trackbot> issue-23 -- intermediate animation of extent --
> pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [13]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/23
>
> [13] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/23
>
> sean: not all of the window effect mechanics are present.
> Propose re-opening unless requirements are actually met.
>
> mike: unaware of this as a 708 requirement
> ... windowOut doesn't map to animation of extent
>
> plh: no recollection why this was raised (back in 2005!)
>
> sean: close this, we'll get the effect anyway with smooth
> animation.
>
> close issue-23
>
> <trackbot> Closed issue-23.
>
> issue-72?
>
> <trackbot> issue-72 -- Smooth scrolling by means of reference
> area offset -- pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [14]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/72
>
> [14] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/72
>
> sean: the required properties don't seem to be present
>
> mike: this needs to be solved with some kind of region property
> animation.
>
> reopen issue-72
>
> <trackbot> Re-opened issue-72.
>
> action on sean to add notes to issue-72 that a property is
> needed to be the subject of animation
>
> <trackbot> Error finding 'on'. You can review and register
> nicknames at
> <[15]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/users>.
>
> [15] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/users%3E.
>
> action sean to add notes to issue-72 that a property is needed
> to be the subject of animation
>
> <trackbot> Created ACTION-210 - Add notes to issue-72 that a
> property is needed to be the subject of animation [on Sean
> Hayes - due 2013-10-03].
>
> issue-159?
>
> <trackbot> issue-159 -- Text orientation in I18n script
> processing -- pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [16]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/159
>
> [16] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/159
>
> sean: this appears to meet my requirements. What about SMPTE's?
>
> pal: will have to check. Each of the SMPTE requests were
> captured in separate tickets.
>
> close issue-159
>
> <trackbot> Closed issue-159.
>
> issue-167?
>
> <trackbot> issue-167 -- allowing attributes that have no
> semantics on specific elements -- pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [17]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/167
>
> [17] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/167
>
> mike: this needs further review
>
> sean: leave as pending review
>
> issue-176
>
> <trackbot> issue-176 -- Adding support for extent and origin
> attributes on block elements -- pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [18]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/176
>
> [18] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/176
>
> sean: glenn has added an inline region element, so it can be
> defined locally and targets its parent element. This is
> analogous to <set> and is similar to adding the attributes.
> ... This solves the inheritance problem. It's a reasonable
> design however the problem is that existing practice has been
> that people have been doing the CPC proposal.
> ... We need further input from the industry to say if this is
> an acceptable solution.
>
> mike: agrees with sean
>
> nigel: does it permit animation of the extent and origin?
>
> sean: yes with an animate element as a child of the region.
> ... this is a big change, so not closing at this point. This
> would be a good agenda item for the f2f to ensure that all the
> semantics work out.
>
> issue-167?
>
> <trackbot> issue-167 -- allowing attributes that have no
> semantics on specific elements -- pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [19]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/167
>
> [19] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/167
>
> mike: not happy with current approach
>
> reopen issue-167
>
> <trackbot> Re-opened issue-167.
>
> action mike to add notes to issue-167 describing unresolved
> issues.
>
> <trackbot> Created ACTION-211 - Add notes to issue-167
> describing unresolved issues. [on Mike Dolan - due 2013-10-03].
>
> issue-178?
>
> <trackbot> issue-178 -- initial values and style set
> calculations are unclear, especially for transformable
> attributes -- pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [20]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/178
>
> [20] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/178
>
> sean: review further and return to this.
>
> issue-183?
>
> <trackbot> issue-183 -- semantics of using profile in a
> document -- pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [21]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/183
>
> [21] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/183
>
> close issue-183
>
> <trackbot> Closed issue-183.
>
> sean: further profiles issues will be created if needed
>
> issue-206?
>
> <trackbot> issue-206 -- Add ttp:profileCombination parameter --
> pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [22]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/206
>
> [22] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/206
>
> sean: want to review further
>
> pal: what is this in response to?
>
> sean: we created this to capture some previous issues uncovered
> with SDP-US
>
> pal: this adds complexity without rationale.
>
> sean: propose leaving open until we've had the f2f session on
> profiles.
>
> pal: I'm adding a note to request more background on this
> issue.
> ... on tpac page.
>
> issue-225?
>
> <trackbot> issue-225 -- tts:fontSize as percentage of container
> dimensions -- pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [23]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/225
>
> [23] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/225
>
> sean: not sure of reason for vmin and vmax
>
> pal: agree, need to know the rationale.
>
> nigel: agree too.
>
> sean: I had the same problem as raised by nigel, need to know
> the unit space in which to do the comparison.
> ... we need clarity over meaning of vmin and vmax
>
> reopen issue-225
>
> <trackbot> Re-opened issue-225.
>
> pal: will add a note for reason for vmin and vmax
>
> issue-259?
>
> <trackbot> issue-259 -- Define "closest" -- pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [24]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/259
>
> [24] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/259
>
> sean: glenn has added in a determination for closest.
>
> issue-259?
>
> <trackbot> issue-259 -- Define "closest" -- pending review
>
> <trackbot>
> [25]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/259
>
> [25] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/259
>
> plh: vmin and vmax are dependent on the size of the root
> element, body. Percentages further down the tree are based on
> the size of the parent.
> ... It gives access to the original extent from anywhere in the
> tree.
>
> sean: What if the pixels aren't logically square - does that
> make a difference in terms of the minimum/maximum choice?
>
> plh: understanding is that it's a comparison of the number of
> pixels.
>
> sean: That's what we are asking for clarification on. What is
> the real world value being compared and why is vmin and vmax
> needed?
>
> pal: concerned this is done without resolving an incompatible
> issue in TTML1.
> ... Until we fix that we can't talk about pixels in any other
> context.
> ... The issue is the mapping of logical to physical pixels.
>
> aob
>
> next week
>
> sean: face to face agenda
>
> pal: plan to have an updated version of the text and image
> profiles based on recent DECE improvements that impacts on some
> of the TPAC issues,
> ... specifically more consistent rendering of fonts.
>
> Summary of Action Items
>
> [End of minutes]
> __________________________________________________________
>
>
> Minutes formatted by David Booth's [26]scribe.perl version
> 1.138 ([27]CVS log)
> $Date: 2013-09-26 15:01:07 $
> __________________________________________________________
>
> [26] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
> [27] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/
>
> Scribe.perl diagnostic output
>
> [Delete this section before finalizing the minutes.]
> This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.138 of Date: 2013-04-25 13:59:11
> Check for newer version at [28]http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/
> scribe/ <http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/>
>
> [28] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/
>
> Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)
>
> Found ScribeNick: nigel
> Found Scribe: nigel
> Inferring ScribeNick: nigel
> Default Present: +44.154.558.aaaa, pal, nigel, Sean, tmichel, +1.858.882
> .aabb, mike, mijordan, Plh
> Present: +44.154.558.aaaa pal nigel Sean tmichel +1.858.882.aabb mike mi
> jordan Plh
>
> WARNING: No meeting chair found!
> You should specify the meeting chair like this:
> <dbooth> Chair: dbooth
>
> Found Date: 26 Sep 2013
> Guessing minutes URL: [29]http://www.w3.org/2013/09/26-tt-minutes.html
> People with action items:
>
> [29] http://www.w3.org/2013/09/26-tt-minutes.html
>
>
> End of [30]scribe.perl diagnostic output]
>
> [30] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* Sean Hayes [Sean.Hayes@microsoft.com]
> *Sent:* 25 September 2013 21:13
> *To:* 'public-tt@w3.org'
> *Subject:* TTML Agenda for 25/09/13
>
> * *
>
> *This meeting is scheduled for at most 60m to close out issues we
> couldn’t get to last week.*
>
> * *
>
> Our teleconference is scheduled with reference to Boston Time, the correct
> time of this teleconference in your locale may change.
>
>
>
> Please check
> http://timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?month=09&day=25&year=2013&hour=10&min=0&sec=0&p1=43
>
>
>
>
> Thursdays 10:00am-12:00am Boston local
>
>
>
> Zakim Bridge +1.617.761.6200, conference 8865 ("TTML")
>
> IRC: server: irc.w3.org, port: 6665, channel: #tt Web gateway to :
> http://www.w3.org/2001/01/cgi-irc
>
>
>
> Chair: Sean Hayes
>
>
>
> Agenda+ Assign Scribe
>
>
>
>
>
> Agenda+ Pending Review Issues
>
> The following issues are candidate for closing.
>
> *ID*
>
> *State*
>
> *Title*
>
> *Raised on*
>
> *Product*
>
> *Open Actions*
>
> ISSUE-22 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/22>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/22/edit>
> window fade in/out
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> window fade in/out not supported?<http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/22>
>
> 2008-12-05
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
> ISSUE-23 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/23>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/23/edit>
> animation
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> intermediate animation of extent<http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/23>
>
> 2008-12-05
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
> ISSUE-72 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/72>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/72/edit>
> smooth scrolling
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> Smooth scrolling by means of reference area offset<http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/72>
>
> 2009-04-24
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
> ISSUE-159 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/159>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/159/edit>
> Text orientation
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> Text orientation in I18n script processing<http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/159>
>
> 2012-02-15
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
> ISSUE-167 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/167>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/167/edit>
> attribute syntax
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> allowing attributes that have no semantics on specific elements<http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/167>
>
> 2012-04-13
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
> ISSUE-176 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/176>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/176/edit>
> extent and origin on blocks
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> Adding support for extent and origin attributes on block elements<http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/176>
>
> 2012-08-23
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
> ISSUE-178 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/178>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/178/edit>
> Inital values
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> initial values and style set calculations are unclear, especially for
> transformable attributes<http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/178>
>
> 2012-08-23
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
> ISSUE-183 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/183>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/183/edit>
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> semantics of using profile in a document<http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/183>
>
> 2012-09-19
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
> ISSUE-206 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/206>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/206/edit>
> profile combination
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> Add ttp:profileCombination parameter<http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/206>
>
> 2013-05-12
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
> ISSUE-225 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/225>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/225/edit>
> Relative tts:fontSize
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> tts:fontSize as percentage of container dimensions<http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/225>
>
> 2013-05-30
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
> ISSUE-259 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/259>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/259/edit>
> Closest
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> Define "closest" <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/259>
>
> 2013-06-27
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
> ISSUE-261 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/261>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/261/edit>
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> signaling docoument profile conformance is separate from decoder
> presentation requirements<http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/261>
>
> 2013-07-11
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
> ISSUE-262 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/262>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/262/edit>
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> tts:extent semantics if value not supported<http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/262>
>
> 2013-07-11
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
> ISSUE-266 <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/266>[image:
> (edit)] <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/266/edit>
>
> PENDING REVIEW
>
> add ability for instance documents to declare what profile(s) it conforms
> to <http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/266>
>
> 2013-08-08
>
> TTML2
>
> 0
>
>
>
>
>
> Tracker (Issues and Actions): http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker
>
>
>
> TTML Wiki
>
> http://www.w3.org/wiki/TimedText
>
>
>
>
>
> ----------------------------
>
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Received on Friday, 27 September 2013 08:56:49 UTC