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RE: DNT:1 and "data append"

From: JC Cannon <jccannon@microsoft.com>
Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2013 23:24:51 +0000
To: Jeffrey Chester <jeff@democraticmedia.org>
CC: Chris Pedigo <CPedigo@online-publishers.org>, Rigo Wenning <rigo@w3.org>, "public-tracking@w3.org" <public-tracking@w3.org>, "ifette@google.com" <ifette@google.com>, David Singer <singer@apple.com>
Message-ID: <BB17D596C94A854E9EE4171D33BBCC8105EF46C3@TK5EX14MBXC239.redmond.corp.microsoft.com>
For #1 doesn't the spec say you can't use 3rd-party data captured when DNT is enabled? There is not DNT signal for offline data and DNT does not apply to 1st parties so this scenario should be allowed unless you want to change the spec.

For #2 there is not DNT signal in the offline state so it won't apply to the 3rd-party data. As DNT does not apply to 1st-parties, the user's profile won't have a DNT signal (which one would be used anyway?). To answer your question John, yes, append would occur after the user has left the site and there is not browser session active.

I'm not saying that these scenarios aren't important to cover. However, as I see it they are out of scope of DNT because the 3rd-party data was not captured when a DNT signal was active and DNT does not apply to 1st-party use of 3rd-party data that was captured when the DNT signal was absent.

Thanks,
JC

From: Jeffrey Chester [mailto:jeff@democraticmedia.org]
Sent: Wednesday, March 20, 2013 3:45 PM
To: JC Cannon
Cc: Chris Pedigo; Rigo Wenning; public-tracking@w3.org; ifette@google.com; David Singer
Subject: Re: DNT:1 and "data append"

For # 1, with DNT enabled, no third party data for user targeting.  The personalization issue has been used to cover up practices which impact privacy; we should discuss this.

In 2, if a user has DNT enabled, then online data from third parties should not be permitted for the targeting function.  Offline data that includes online information would have to adjust their product services.




Jeffrey Chester
Center for Digital Democracy
1621 Connecticut Ave, NW, Suite 550
Washington, DC 20009
www.democraticmedia.org<http://www.democraticmedia.org>
www.digitalads.org<http://www.digitalads.org>
202-986-2220

On Mar 20, 2013, at 3:54 PM, JC Cannon wrote:


Jeff,

Could you map out the scenario as you see it happening? It sounds like you are mixing two issues.

1.     Are you stating that a 1st party cannot use 3rd party data in real-time, that is not impacted by DNT, for personalization?
2.    Are you stating that during an offline state that a 1st party cannot perform data append? There is DNT signal at that point.

Regards,
JC

From: Jeffrey Chester [mailto:jeff@democraticmedia.org]
Sent: Wednesday, March 20, 2013 12:41 PM
To: Chris Pedigo
Cc: Rigo Wenning; public-tracking@w3.org<mailto:public-tracking@w3.org>; ifette@google.com<mailto:ifette@google.com>; David Singer
Subject: Re: DNT:1 and "data append"

3rd data append companies bundle huge data sets that include public information, but also proprietary information.  Offline is also integrated with online as well.   I don't think (in the US) there is serious consent to the current state of data append.  This is not out of scope for a robust DNT spec.




Jeffrey Chester
Center for Digital Democracy
1621 Connecticut Ave, NW, Suite 550
Washington, DC 20009
www.democraticmedia.org<http://www.democraticmedia.org>
www.digitalads.org<http://www.digitalads.org>
202-986-2220

On Mar 20, 2013, at 3:35 PM, Chris Pedigo wrote:



Again, under the current framework of our standard, first parties will not be able to share data with each other about DNT:1 users.  And, third parties will not be able to collect any data about DNT:1 users.  You are proposing to restrict first parties from acquiring data that is publicly available, collected with consent or offline data.  This is out of scope for DNT.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jeffrey Chester [mailto:jeff@democraticmedia.org]
Sent: Wednesday, March 20, 2013 2:57 PM
To: Rigo Wenning
Cc: public-tracking@w3.org<mailto:public-tracking@w3.org>; Chris Pedigo; ifette@google.com<mailto:ifette@google.com>; David Singer
Subject: Re: DNT:1 and "data append"

First parties now engage in data append with many, many data partners for targeting.  It's a common practice and should not be permitted when a user signals DNT.
Received on Wednesday, 20 March 2013 23:25:50 UTC

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