- From: Francois Daoust <fd@w3.org>
- Date: Wed, 31 May 2017 22:03:20 +0200
- To: <public-sdw-wg@w3.org>
Hi,
The minutes of yesterday's SSN call are available at:
http://www.w3.org/2017/05/30-sdwssn-minutes.html
... and copied as raw text below.
Thanks,
Francois.
-----
Spatial Data on the Web Working Group Teleconference
30 May 2017
[2]IRC log
[2] http://www.w3.org/2017/05/30-sdwssn-irc
Attendees
Present
ahaller2, DanhLePhuoc, Kjanowic, SimonCox, tidoust
Regrets
Scott, Claus
Chair
-
Scribe
mlefranc, SimonCox
Contents
* [3]Meeting Minutes
1. [4]Approving last meeting's minutes https://
www.w3.org/2017/05/16-sdwssn-minutes
2. [5]Patent Call https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/
Patent_Call
3. [6]Discuss further responses to Public Review, and
https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/199 in
response to Markus Stocker's feedback
4. [7]to explain sub-system relationships
5. [8]Progress on https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/
actions/362 - Extend canonical examples with coastal
water body example using rdfs:subclassing and punning
6. [9]Progress on https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/
actions/363 - Fix hierarchy in pull request around
measurement capabilities
7. [10]Implementation of proposal for alignment as of
https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/
Events_and_Situations for ssn:Observation
8. [11]Progress on Action-356 to create a list of axioms
that do not need implementation evidence
9. [12]Implementation Evidence Progress http://
w3c.github.io/sdw/ssn-usage/
10. [13]Discuss ISSUE-201, Hash URIs for System
Capabilities
11. [14]Outreach - Requested Talks and Siemens Plugfest
https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/353
* [15]Summary of Action Items
Meeting Minutes
Approving last meeting's minutes [16]https://www.w3.org/2017/05/
16-sdwssn-minutes
[16] https://www.w3.org/2017/05/16-sdwssn-minutes
<Kjanowic> +1
+1
<ahaller2> +1
<mlefranc> +1
<DanhLePhuoc> +1
Patent Call [17]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Patent_Call
[17] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Patent_Call
Patent call
Discuss further responses to Public Review, and [18]https://
www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/199 in response to Markus
Stocker's feedback
[18] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/199
Markus Stocker feedback resolved and merged.
Comments provided from Nick Car (GA) -
... re feature of interest
mlefranc: "platform" used slightly differnet in WoT
… WoT may need additional class
Kjanowic: sosa:Platform supports composition of sensors - e.g.
smartphone
… or if need to talk about geometry
(WoT needs 'platform' for software platform)
is platform just *hardware* platform
mlefranc: also asking issue about sub-system
<Kjanowic> Sorry, Id did not mean that. We include virtual as
well. My point was that it is not an API platform
in IT world platform=API
in SOSA we mean host for system, sensor, but not API platform.
Not restricted to hardware
ahaller2: don't need to change definition/annotation
<Kjanowic> Wintel is a platform but not in our sense
DanhLePhuoc: must delegate to WoT group - they are still
struggling around what is central point of modelling
… we don't need to change.
… wot still a moving target
… haven't agreed thing-description in JSON, JSON-LD yet ...
difficult to align until they have stablised
<DanhLePhuoc> +1
to explain sub-system relationships
mlefranc: best explained through examples
… subsystem vs ishostedby
… also isSampleOf and hasSubSystem
<ahaller2> create ISSUE What is the difference between
subsystem vs ishostedby
<mlefranc> ISSUE What is the difference between subsystem vs
ishostedby
ISSUE: What is the difference between subsystem vs ishostedby
<trackbot> Created ISSUE-202 - What is the difference between
subsystem vs ishostedby. Please complete additional details at
<[19]http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/202/edit>.
[19] http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/202/edit>.
isSampleOf is to get a sub-feature which is intended to be
'representative of' a bigger thing in the context of
observations
Action: SimonCox to add text to explain role of sampling in SSN
examples room/ice sheet
<trackbot> Created ACTION-364 - Add text to explain role of
sampling in ssn examples room/ice sheet [on Simon Cox - due
2017-06-06].
<Kjanowic> This is a dangerous example btw "<Room145/east> a
sosa:Sample , sosa:FeatureOfInterest , sosa:Platform ;"
Kjanowic: danger of mixing sample/foi/platform in examples
… don't conflate too many things in examples as it is a rare
case
… need to be careful about conflating sampling locations
<Kjanowic> Sorry for jumping ahead
Progress on [20]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/362 -
Extend canonical examples with coastal water body example using
rdfs:subclassing and punning
[20] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/362
<Kjanowic> but it relates to sample vs system and foi
<Kjanowic> yes, absolutely
<Kjanowic> but the example is, correct?
<Kjanowic> <Room145/east> a sosa:Sample ,
sosa:FeatureOfInterest , sosa:Platform ; rdfs:label "East wall
of room #145."@en ; rdfs:comment "This wall hosts PCB Board 1
with DHT22 temperature and humidity sensor #4578."@en ;
sosa:hosts <PCBBoard1> .
<Kjanowic> Thanks Maxime for providing these examples
<Kjanowic> yes to very simple examples
ahaller2: are these examples too complex? need v simple
examples at beginning
… build up to these more complex examples
Action: ahaller2 to create simple SOSA example with smartphone
and sensors
<trackbot> Created ACTION-365 - Create simple sosa example with
smartphone and sensors [on Armin Haller - due 2017-06-06].
<Kjanowic> I like this idea!
Action: SimonCox to add examples from O&M converted to SOSA/SSN
<trackbot> Created ACTION-366 - Add examples from o&m converted
to sosa/ssn [on Simon Cox - due 2017-06-06].
Kjanowic: need variety in samples to capture audience
<Kjanowic> Okay, I see your point.
Everyone seems to agree that multiple examples are better
ahaller2: single example in SOSA, more in SSN?
… need small document in sosa
are we talking about (a) examples listed against definition in
ontology, or (b) fully worked instances in document
<Kjanowic> but liked it in the end
mlefranc: in document - at beginning of each section included
links to worked examples in later chapter
ahaller2: in ontology document how to use skos:example? one or
many?
… multiple examples are helpful in ontology document
… wide review seems to indicate that multiiple examples useful
… all worked examples should be mentioned in ontology
annotations
Kjanowic: would be good to ensure that ontology document is
balanced, similar number of skos:example for each class
… like mlefranc suggestion that each of us makes extended
example using as may classes as possible
… this will verify that we share understanding of the ontology
Action: ahaller SimonCox mlefranc Kjanowic DanhLePhuoc to
create one example each that uses as many classes/properties as
possible
<trackbot> Error finding 'ahaller'. You can review and register
nicknames at <[21]http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/users>.
[21] http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/users>.
<Kjanowic> Yes
<Kjanowic> like a scenario
<mlefranc> +1
Action: armin SimonCox mlefranc Kjanowic DanhLePhuoc to create
one example each that uses as many classes/properties as
possible
<trackbot> Created ACTION-367 - Simoncox mlefranc kjanowic
danhlephuoc to create one example each that uses as many
classes/properties as possible [on Armin Haller - due
2017-06-06].
ahaller2: Canonical examples around water bodies?
Progress on [22]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/363 -
Fix hierarchy in pull request around measurement capabilities
[22] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/363
ahaller2: has been closed
<mlefranc> ok with the new tructure
ahaller2: location and forecasting was in own section, too
prominent
… but not much content?
… now moved to subsections 6.3 6.4
Kjanowic: location is not part of SSN - shoudl be delegated
… when we didn't have any real horizontal modules
… suggest moving the things which are not SSN components into
yet another chapter after the examples
ahaller2: since we haven't actually modeled them as part of
SOSA/SSN they need to be moved to annex?
Kjanowic: the other horizontal modules contain axioms
… for forecasting and locations there is no axioms so no module
… rather this is how to link out to other
… alternatively: we could build an actual alignment
… its a scenario or best practice
mlefranc: should not be pushed into annex. New section
"modeling issues'
<Kjanowic> I like Maxime's proposal
<Kjanowic> have a modleing section
would 'alignment module' include stub classes for geometry etc
Kjanowic: yes - to clarify that sensors are not geometries, etc
<ahaller2> ISSUE: Location and Forecasting are not modules at
the moment, either they need alignments or move to a seperate
section
<trackbot> Created ISSUE-203 - Location and forecasting are not
modules at the moment, either they need alignments or move to a
seperate section. Please complete additional details at
<[23]http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/203/edit>.
[23] http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/203/edit>.
<Kjanowic> I will have to leave soon so I cannot scribe
Implementation of proposal for alignment as of [24]https://
www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Events_and_Situations for
ssn:Observation
[24] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Events_and_Situations
Kjanowic: do it for next week
Progress on Action-356 to create a list of axioms that do not need
implementation evidence
<ahaller2> [25]http://w3c.github.io/sdw/ssn-usage/
[25] http://w3c.github.io/sdw/ssn-usage/
ahaller2: about implementation evidence: need to update
ssn-usage document
ahaller2: plug new implementation evidence in ssn-usage
directly
Action: ahaller2 update ssn-usage with links to working draft
classes/properties and add new classes/properties where
necessary
<trackbot> Created ACTION-368 - Update ssn-usage with links to
working draft classes/properties and add new classes/properties
where necessary [on Armin Haller - due 2017-06-06].
mlefranc: also, draw a graph that show the dependencies
(existential relations) between terms
<DanhLePhuoc> [26]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/
Implicit_Implementations_entailed_by_Axioms
[26] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Implicit_Implementations_entailed_by_Axioms
<Kjanowic> Yes, this was a task we discussed sometime ago
DanhLePhuoc: entailment regime make that class system is
instantiate whenever someone instantiates sensor (under ssn)
… also with owl:inverseOf
ahaller2: reflect that in ssn-usage document ?
… separate section (table) for the instance that are
implemented "behind entailement"
<Kjanowic> afk
Implementation Evidence Progress [27]http://w3c.github.io/sdw/
ssn-usage/
[27] http://w3c.github.io/sdw/ssn-usage/
ahaller2: @tidoust, please explain the agenda again
<tidoust> [28]Timeline to reach REC
[28] https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-sdw-wg/2017Mar/0231.html
tidoust: worried about candidate recommendation phase
… meant to be 15th may
… still have time to work on the implementation, need to
finalize CR
… still need the "exit criteria" in the spec
<tidoust> [29]Exit criteria for Time Ontology
[29] http://w3c.github.io/sdw/time/#exit
tidoust: also need the whole group to accept to switch to CR
… and how the wide reviews were handled
<ahaller2> [30]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Wide_Review
[30] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Wide_Review
<SimonCox> I need to leave now
Action: ahaller write Disposition of Wide Review comments in
Wiki, add exit criteria to document and ask Ed for Plenary
meeting to get into RecTrack
<trackbot> Error finding 'ahaller'. You can review and register
nicknames at <[31]http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/users>.
[31] http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/users>.
tidoust: still work on non-normative sections in document while
CR
… can work tomorrow and wait for a few days, 2 weeks, for a
consensus (list and director)
… but it needs to happen soon
Kjanowic: what about use of MUST BE and SHOULD BE ?
… quantification, in text box, we use MUST BE
… the axioms and the text are not in sync
… only is forall quantifiers, exists is for existential
quantifiers, need to check consistence in the figure
<ahaller2> change axiom language, must be -> only, at least one
-> exists one
<Kjanowic> \forall --> only
<Kjanowic> \exists --> some
<Kjanowic> cardinality --> exactly 1 or at least 1 or at most 5
<Kjanowic> ....
Kjanowic: *discussing the wording for every axiom in the spec
and the figures*
ahaller2: need to be done before vote tomorrow
Action: ahaller to change language for axioms to match best
practice
<trackbot> Error finding 'ahaller'. You can review and register
nicknames at <[32]http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/users>.
[32] http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/users>.
Action: armin to change language for axioms to match best
practice
<trackbot> Created ACTION-369 - Change language for axioms to
match best practice [on Armin Haller - due 2017-06-06].
Discuss ISSUE-201, Hash URIs for System Capabilities
<Kjanowic> I have to leave now
mlefranc: why do we use slash-based URIs anyways ?
Action: mlefranc to harmonise hash URIs to slash URIs for
horizontal modules
<trackbot> Created ACTION-370 - Harmonise hash uris to slash
uris for horizontal modules [on Maxime Lefrançois - due
2017-06-06].
Outreach - Requested Talks and Siemens Plugfest [33]https://
www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/353
[33] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/353
mlefranc: only important if one can get different documents
from the same namespace
DanhLePhuoc: plan to demo something next plugfest in July
<ahaller2> ... next plug fest in Duesseldorf
DanhLePhuoc: plan to use SSN for anything relevant to sensor
and actuator
ahaller2: can use that for implementation evidence ?
DanhLePhuoc: yes
Summary of Action Items
1. [34]SimonCox to add text to explain role of sampling in SSN
examples room/ice sheet
2. [35]ahaller2 to create simple SOSA example with smartphone
and sensors
3. [36]SimonCox to add examples from O&M converted to SOSA/SSN
4. [37]ahaller SimonCox mlefranc Kjanowic DanhLePhuoc to
create one example each that uses as many
classes/properties as possible
5. [38]armin SimonCox mlefranc Kjanowic DanhLePhuoc to create
one example each that uses as many classes/properties as
possible
6. [39]ahaller2 update ssn-usage with links to working draft
classes/properties and add new classes/properties where
necessary
7. [40]ahaller write Disposition of Wide Review comments in
Wiki, add exit criteria to document and ask Ed for Plenary
meeting to get into RecTrack
8. [41]ahaller to change language for axioms to match best
practice
9. [42]armin to change language for axioms to match best
practice
10. [43]mlefranc to harmonise hash URIs to slash URIs for
horizontal modules
Received on Wednesday, 31 May 2017 20:03:53 UTC