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[minutes SSN] 2015-05-30 call

From: Francois Daoust <fd@w3.org>
Date: Wed, 31 May 2017 22:03:20 +0200
To: <public-sdw-wg@w3.org>
Message-ID: <027201d2da48$f376b7f0$da6427d0$@w3.org>
Hi,

The minutes of yesterday's SSN call are available at:
http://www.w3.org/2017/05/30-sdwssn-minutes.html

... and copied as raw text below.


Thanks,
Francois.


-----
Spatial Data on the Web Working Group Teleconference

30 May 2017

   [2]IRC log

      [2] http://www.w3.org/2017/05/30-sdwssn-irc

Attendees

   Present
          ahaller2, DanhLePhuoc, Kjanowic, SimonCox, tidoust

   Regrets
         Scott, Claus

   Chair
          -

   Scribe
          mlefranc, SimonCox

Contents

     * [3]Meeting Minutes
         1. [4]Approving last meeting's minutes https://
            www.w3.org/2017/05/16-sdwssn-minutes
         2. [5]Patent Call https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/
            Patent_Call
         3. [6]Discuss further responses to Public Review, and
            https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/199 in
            response to Markus Stocker's feedback
         4. [7]to explain sub-system relationships
         5. [8]Progress on https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/
            actions/362 - Extend canonical examples with coastal
            water body example using rdfs:subclassing and punning
         6. [9]Progress on https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/
            actions/363 - Fix hierarchy in pull request around
            measurement capabilities
         7. [10]Implementation of proposal for alignment as of
            https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/
            Events_and_Situations for ssn:Observation
         8. [11]Progress on Action-356 to create a list of axioms
            that do not need implementation evidence
         9. [12]Implementation Evidence Progress http://
            w3c.github.io/sdw/ssn-usage/
        10. [13]Discuss ISSUE-201, Hash URIs for System
            Capabilities
        11. [14]Outreach - Requested Talks and Siemens Plugfest
            https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/353
     * [15]Summary of Action Items

Meeting Minutes

Approving last meeting's minutes [16]https://www.w3.org/2017/05/
16-sdwssn-minutes

     [16] https://www.w3.org/2017/05/16-sdwssn-minutes

   <Kjanowic> +1

   +1

   <ahaller2> +1

   <mlefranc> +1

   <DanhLePhuoc> +1

Patent Call [17]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Patent_Call

     [17] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Patent_Call

   Patent call

Discuss further responses to Public Review, and [18]https://
www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/199 in response to Markus
Stocker's feedback

     [18] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/199

   Markus Stocker feedback resolved and merged.

   Comments provided from Nick Car (GA) -

   ... re feature of interest

   mlefranc: "platform" used slightly differnet in WoT
   … WoT may need additional class

   Kjanowic: sosa:Platform supports composition of sensors - e.g.
   smartphone
   … or if need to talk about geometry

   (WoT needs 'platform' for software platform)

   is platform just *hardware* platform

   mlefranc: also asking issue about sub-system

   <Kjanowic> Sorry, Id did not mean that. We include virtual as
   well. My point was that it is not an API platform

   in IT world platform=API

   in SOSA we mean host for system, sensor, but not API platform.
   Not restricted to hardware

   ahaller2: don't need to change definition/annotation

   <Kjanowic> Wintel is a platform but not in our sense

   DanhLePhuoc: must delegate to WoT group - they are still
   struggling around what is central point of modelling
   … we don't need to change.
   … wot still a moving target
   … haven't agreed thing-description in JSON, JSON-LD yet ...
   difficult to align until they have stablised

   <DanhLePhuoc> +1

to explain sub-system relationships

   mlefranc: best explained through examples
   … subsystem vs ishostedby
   … also isSampleOf and hasSubSystem

   <ahaller2> create ISSUE What is the difference between
   subsystem vs ishostedby

   <mlefranc> ISSUE What is the difference between subsystem vs
   ishostedby

   ISSUE: What is the difference between subsystem vs ishostedby

   <trackbot> Created ISSUE-202 - What is the difference between
   subsystem vs ishostedby. Please complete additional details at
   <[19]http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/202/edit>.

     [19] http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/202/edit>.

   isSampleOf is to get a sub-feature which is intended to be
   'representative of' a bigger thing in the context of
   observations

   Action: SimonCox to add text to explain role of sampling in SSN
   examples room/ice sheet

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-364 - Add text to explain role of
   sampling in ssn examples room/ice sheet [on Simon Cox - due
   2017-06-06].

   <Kjanowic> This is a dangerous example btw "<Room145/east> a
   sosa:Sample , sosa:FeatureOfInterest , sosa:Platform ;"

   Kjanowic: danger of mixing sample/foi/platform in examples
   … don't conflate too many things in examples as it is a rare
   case
   … need to be careful about conflating sampling locations

   <Kjanowic> Sorry for jumping ahead

Progress on [20]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/362 -
Extend canonical examples with coastal water body example using
rdfs:subclassing and punning

     [20] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/362

   <Kjanowic> but it relates to sample vs system and foi

   <Kjanowic> yes, absolutely

   <Kjanowic> but the example is, correct?

   <Kjanowic> <Room145/east> a sosa:Sample ,
   sosa:FeatureOfInterest , sosa:Platform ; rdfs:label "East wall
   of room #145."@en ; rdfs:comment "This wall hosts PCB Board 1
   with DHT22 temperature and humidity sensor #4578."@en ;
   sosa:hosts <PCBBoard1> .

   <Kjanowic> Thanks Maxime for providing these examples

   <Kjanowic> yes to very simple examples

   ahaller2: are these examples too complex? need v simple
   examples at beginning
   … build up to these more complex examples

   Action: ahaller2 to create simple SOSA example with smartphone
   and sensors

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-365 - Create simple sosa example with
   smartphone and sensors [on Armin Haller - due 2017-06-06].

   <Kjanowic> I like this idea!

   Action: SimonCox to add examples from O&M converted to SOSA/SSN

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-366 - Add examples from o&m converted
   to sosa/ssn [on Simon Cox - due 2017-06-06].

   Kjanowic: need variety in samples to capture audience

   <Kjanowic> Okay, I see your point.

   Everyone seems to agree that multiple examples are better

   ahaller2: single example in SOSA, more in SSN?
   … need small document in sosa

   are we talking about (a) examples listed against definition in
   ontology, or (b) fully worked instances in document

   <Kjanowic> but liked it in the end

   mlefranc: in document - at beginning of each section included
   links to worked examples in later chapter

   ahaller2: in ontology document how to use skos:example? one or
   many?
   … multiple examples are helpful in ontology document
   … wide review seems to indicate that multiiple examples useful
   … all worked examples should be mentioned in ontology
   annotations

   Kjanowic: would be good to ensure that ontology document is
   balanced, similar number of skos:example for each class
   … like mlefranc suggestion that each of us makes extended
   example using as may classes as possible
   … this will verify that we share understanding of the ontology

   Action: ahaller SimonCox mlefranc Kjanowic DanhLePhuoc to
   create one example each that uses as many classes/properties as
   possible

   <trackbot> Error finding 'ahaller'. You can review and register
   nicknames at <[21]http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/users>.

     [21] http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/users>.

   <Kjanowic> Yes

   <Kjanowic> like a scenario

   <mlefranc> +1

   Action: armin SimonCox mlefranc Kjanowic DanhLePhuoc to create
   one example each that uses as many classes/properties as
   possible

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-367 - Simoncox mlefranc kjanowic
   danhlephuoc to create one example each that uses as many
   classes/properties as possible [on Armin Haller - due
   2017-06-06].

   ahaller2: Canonical examples around water bodies?

Progress on [22]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/363 -
Fix hierarchy in pull request around measurement capabilities

     [22] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/363

   ahaller2: has been closed

   <mlefranc> ok with the new tructure

   ahaller2: location and forecasting was in own section, too
   prominent
   … but not much content?
   … now moved to subsections 6.3 6.4

   Kjanowic: location is not part of SSN - shoudl be delegated
   … when we didn't have any real horizontal modules
   … suggest moving the things which are not SSN components into
   yet another chapter after the examples

   ahaller2: since we haven't actually modeled them as part of
   SOSA/SSN they need to be moved to annex?

   Kjanowic: the other horizontal modules contain axioms
   … for forecasting and locations there is no axioms so no module
   … rather this is how to link out to other
   … alternatively: we could build an actual alignment
   … its a scenario or best practice

   mlefranc: should not be pushed into annex. New section
   "modeling issues'

   <Kjanowic> I like Maxime's proposal

   <Kjanowic> have a modleing section

   would 'alignment module' include stub classes for geometry etc

   Kjanowic: yes - to clarify that sensors are not geometries, etc

   <ahaller2> ISSUE: Location and Forecasting are not modules at
   the moment, either they need alignments or move to a seperate
   section

   <trackbot> Created ISSUE-203 - Location and forecasting are not
   modules at the moment, either they need alignments or move to a
   seperate section. Please complete additional details at
   <[23]http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/203/edit>.

     [23] http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/issues/203/edit>.

   <Kjanowic> I will have to leave soon so I cannot scribe

Implementation of proposal for alignment as of [24]https://
www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Events_and_Situations for
ssn:Observation

     [24] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Events_and_Situations

   Kjanowic: do it for next week

Progress on Action-356 to create a list of axioms that do not need
implementation evidence

   <ahaller2> [25]http://w3c.github.io/sdw/ssn-usage/

     [25] http://w3c.github.io/sdw/ssn-usage/

   ahaller2: about implementation evidence: need to update
   ssn-usage document

   ahaller2: plug new implementation evidence in ssn-usage
   directly

   Action: ahaller2 update ssn-usage with links to working draft
   classes/properties and add new classes/properties where
   necessary

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-368 - Update ssn-usage with links to
   working draft classes/properties and add new classes/properties
   where necessary [on Armin Haller - due 2017-06-06].

   mlefranc: also, draw a graph that show the dependencies
   (existential relations) between terms

   <DanhLePhuoc> [26]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/
   Implicit_Implementations_entailed_by_Axioms

     [26] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Implicit_Implementations_entailed_by_Axioms

   <Kjanowic> Yes, this was a task we discussed sometime ago

   DanhLePhuoc: entailment regime make that class system is
   instantiate whenever someone instantiates sensor (under ssn)
   … also with owl:inverseOf

   ahaller2: reflect that in ssn-usage document ?
   … separate section (table) for the instance that are
   implemented "behind entailement"

   <Kjanowic> afk

Implementation Evidence Progress [27]http://w3c.github.io/sdw/
ssn-usage/

     [27] http://w3c.github.io/sdw/ssn-usage/

   ahaller2: @tidoust, please explain the agenda again

   <tidoust> [28]Timeline to reach REC

     [28] https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-sdw-wg/2017Mar/0231.html

   tidoust: worried about candidate recommendation phase
   … meant to be 15th may
   … still have time to work on the implementation, need to
   finalize CR
   … still need the "exit criteria" in the spec

   <tidoust> [29]Exit criteria for Time Ontology

     [29] http://w3c.github.io/sdw/time/#exit

   tidoust: also need the whole group to accept to switch to CR
   … and how the wide reviews were handled

   <ahaller2> [30]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Wide_Review

     [30] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Wide_Review

   <SimonCox> I need to leave now

   Action: ahaller write Disposition of Wide Review comments in
   Wiki, add exit criteria to document and ask Ed for Plenary
   meeting to get into RecTrack

   <trackbot> Error finding 'ahaller'. You can review and register
   nicknames at <[31]http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/users>.

     [31] http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/users>.

   tidoust: still work on non-normative sections in document while
   CR
   … can work tomorrow and wait for a few days, 2 weeks, for a
   consensus (list and director)
   … but it needs to happen soon

   Kjanowic: what about use of MUST BE and SHOULD BE ?
   … quantification, in text box, we use MUST BE
   … the axioms and the text are not in sync
   … only is forall quantifiers, exists is for existential
   quantifiers, need to check consistence in the figure

   <ahaller2> change axiom language, must be -> only, at least one
   -> exists one

   <Kjanowic> \forall --> only

   <Kjanowic> \exists --> some

   <Kjanowic> cardinality --> exactly 1 or at least 1 or at most 5

   <Kjanowic> ....

   Kjanowic: *discussing the wording for every axiom in the spec
   and the figures*

   ahaller2: need to be done before vote tomorrow

   Action: ahaller to change language for axioms to match best
   practice

   <trackbot> Error finding 'ahaller'. You can review and register
   nicknames at <[32]http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/users>.

     [32] http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/users>.

   Action: armin to change language for axioms to match best
   practice

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-369 - Change language for axioms to
   match best practice [on Armin Haller - due 2017-06-06].

Discuss ISSUE-201, Hash URIs for System Capabilities

   <Kjanowic> I have to leave now

   mlefranc: why do we use slash-based URIs anyways ?

   Action: mlefranc to harmonise hash URIs to slash URIs for
   horizontal modules

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-370 - Harmonise hash uris to slash
   uris for horizontal modules [on Maxime Lefrançois - due
   2017-06-06].

Outreach - Requested Talks and Siemens Plugfest [33]https://
www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/353

     [33] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/353

   mlefranc: only important if one can get different documents
   from the same namespace

   DanhLePhuoc: plan to demo something next plugfest in July

   <ahaller2> ... next plug fest in Duesseldorf

   DanhLePhuoc: plan to use SSN for anything relevant to sensor
   and actuator

   ahaller2: can use that for implementation evidence ?

   DanhLePhuoc: yes

Summary of Action Items

    1. [34]SimonCox to add text to explain role of sampling in SSN
       examples room/ice sheet
    2. [35]ahaller2 to create simple SOSA example with smartphone
       and sensors
    3. [36]SimonCox to add examples from O&M converted to SOSA/SSN
    4. [37]ahaller SimonCox mlefranc Kjanowic DanhLePhuoc to
       create one example each that uses as many
       classes/properties as possible
    5. [38]armin SimonCox mlefranc Kjanowic DanhLePhuoc to create
       one example each that uses as many classes/properties as
       possible
    6. [39]ahaller2 update ssn-usage with links to working draft
       classes/properties and add new classes/properties where
       necessary
    7. [40]ahaller write Disposition of Wide Review comments in
       Wiki, add exit criteria to document and ask Ed for Plenary
       meeting to get into RecTrack
    8. [41]ahaller to change language for axioms to match best
       practice
    9. [42]armin to change language for axioms to match best
       practice
   10. [43]mlefranc to harmonise hash URIs to slash URIs for
       horizontal modules
Received on Wednesday, 31 May 2017 20:03:53 UTC

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