- From: Richard Wallis <richard.wallis@dataliberate.com>
- Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2020 21:13:04 +0000
- To: Alan LaFrance <stidotorg@gmail.com>
- Cc: Andrew Crimer <andrew.crimer@gmail.com>, "schema.org Mailing List" <public-schemaorg@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <CAD47Kz7oCntj6YSXEhq2bWyN9xx3BahZFX_zm696xY+JAzfm1w@mail.gmail.com>
A not for profit status is potentially useful property to convey. However I believe there are two facets to this. There are indeed *not for profit* organisations, there are also *not for profit *services that are not necessarily only offered by such organisations. Some for profit organisations offer *charitable* / *pro bono* / *not for profit* services alongside their commercial operations. I have even worked for a not for profit organisation that offered for profit services to help support its other operations.. To support such distinctions it would be appropriate to add the *profitStatus* property to both the Organization <https://schema.org/Organization> and Service <https://schema.org/Service> types. Richard Wallis Founder, Data Liberate http://dataliberate.com Linkedin: http://www.linkedin.com/in/richardwallis Twitter: @rjw On Tue, 24 Mar 2020 at 19:47, Alan LaFrance <stidotorg@gmail.com> wrote: > Andrew, > > Good points. > > Can you think of some test cases that would challenge either of the > methods? Perhaps we can work the problem backwards and arrive at a more > robust solution. > > Alan > > On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 1:52 PM Andrew Crimer <andrew.crimer@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> (forgot to cc the list) >> >> ---------- Forwarded message --------- >> From: Andrew Crimer <andrew.crimer@gmail.com> >> Date: Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 2:48 PM >> Subject: Re: Public Interest legal aid markup >> To: Margaret Hagan <mdhagan@stanford.edu> >> >> >> A note on the complexity here: there are many types of corporation and >> they vary substantially by jurisdiction. "profitStatus" probably can't >> effectively be made binary. Incentives, i.e. "will never charge you money," >> are probably even more complicated. In the United States, IRC section 501c >> has 29 subsections <https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/501>, >> each with various additional cases attached. I'm not advocating for >> encoding the US tax code into schema, but I do think it bears mentioning >> that "for profit" and "not for profit" are both subject to change over time >> and extremely broad generalizations. >> >> On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 2:44 PM Margaret Hagan <mdhagan@stanford.edu> >> wrote: >> >>> Hi! >>> >>> I like the profitStatus property, because there are many non-profit >>> organizations that do not primarily identify as an ‘NGO’ — but still want >>> to communicate that they are non-commercial, public-interest, and will >>> never charge you money/sell your data. >>> >>> The ICNPO can be fine, though it’s definitely higher burden to do the >>> classification than the profitStatus. >>> >>> Thanks so much for your thoughts! Best, Margaret >>> >>> >>> On March 24, 2020 at 11:37:03 AM, Alan LaFrance (stidotorg@gmail.com) >>> wrote: >>> >>> Margaret, >>> >>> I think this exposes a gap in the existing schema, as you mentioned. >>> >>> I’d like to advocate for adding an optional property called profitStatus >>> to Organization that notates the status of an org as “for profit” or “non >>> profit.” >>> >>> Alternatively, we could use ICNPO classifications as guidance for a more >>> granular method. (See link below) >>> >>> https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/en/catalogue/13-015-X >>> >>> Thoughts? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Alan LaFrance >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 1:06 PM Margaret Hagan <mdhagan@stanford.edu> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi! >>>> >>>> I’m working with various legal aid groups and other ‘public >>>> interest/non-profit’ legal groups on marking up their online resources. >>>> >>>> I am running into a few limitations/areas for help.` If you have any >>>> thoughts, edits, reactions — I’d really appreciate it! Best, Margaret >>>> >>>> >>>> *1) Organization Type:* Should we be tagging a non-profit legal >>>> information/services as an ‘NGO’ or as a ‘Legal Service’? The ideal is that >>>> we are communicating to the public that the sites are: >>>> - public interest and free >>>> - offering info + services related to legal problems >>>> >>>> Ideally there would be another category like ‘Non-profit Legal Service’ >>>> or ‘Legal Aid’ >>>> >>>> *2) Issue Expertise:* What’s the best way to label the areas of law >>>> that a legal aid or free legal info site might help a person with? For >>>> example, to let people know they have help with domestic violence; child >>>> custody; landlord-tenant problems; migrant worker problems, etc? >>>> >>>> Right now, we are using ‘knowsAbout’ and then linking to a URL with a >>>> taxonomy entry for that legal problem. >>>> >>>> Has anyone used any other strategy for this? >>>> >>>> >>>> *3) Jurisdiction Coverage:* Ideally we could label the organization >>>> and services very precisely with what cities, counties, or states their >>>> info/services apply to. For example, some of the housing law pages are only >>>> for certain cities, while some family/child custody are only for people in >>>> a certain state. >>>> >>>> We are currently using Administrative Area and listing these different >>>> city/county/state units as text entries — but ideally we could be more >>>> precise than text. Has anyone used other strategies for communicating the >>>> jurisdictions that particular rules or services apply to? >>>> >>>> -- >>>> >>>> For more detail, here are some of the sample drafts of markup that our >>>> groups are working on. >>>> >>>> { >>>> >>>> "@context": "http://www.schema.org", >>>> >>>> "@type": "LegalService", >>>> >>>> "name": "Idaho Legal Aid Services", >>>> >>>> "url": "https://www.idaholegalaid.org/", >>>> >>>> "description": "Idaho Legal Aid Services is a nonprofit statewide law >>>> firm dedicated to providing equal access to justice for low income people >>>> through quality advocacy and education.", >>>> >>>> "logo": " >>>> https://www.idaholegalaid.org/sites/idaholegalaid.org/files/ilas-logo-100.png >>>> ", >>>> >>>> "address": { >>>> >>>> "@type": "PostalAddress", >>>> >>>> "streetAddress": "1447 S. Tyrell Lane >>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/1447+S.+Tyrell+Lane?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>> ", >>>> >>>> "addressLocality": "Boise", >>>> >>>> "addressRegion": "ID", >>>> >>>> "postalCode": 83706 >>>> >>>> }, >>>> >>>> "areaServed": [ >>>> >>>> { >>>> >>>> "@type": "AdministrativeArea", >>>> >>>> "name": "Idaho" >>>> >>>> } >>>> >>>> ], >>>> >>>> "telephone": "208-746-7541", >>>> >>>> "openingHours": [ >>>> >>>> "Mo 08:30-17:00", >>>> >>>> "Tu 08:30-17:00", >>>> >>>> "We 08:30-17:00", >>>> >>>> "Th 08:30-17:00", >>>> >>>> "Fr 08:30-17:00" >>>> >>>> ], >>>> >>>> "isAccessibleForFree": true, >>>> >>>> "knowsAbout": [ >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/HO-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/FA-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/IM-13-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/BE-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/MO-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/NA-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> “https://taxonomy.legal/term/BE-07-00-00-00”, >>>> >>>> “https://taxonomy.legal/term/FA-15-00-00-00” >>>> >>>> ], >>>> >>>> } >>>> >>>> >>>> { >>>> >>>> "@context": "http://www.schema.org", >>>> >>>> "@type": "LegalService", >>>> >>>> "name": "Legal Services of North Florida", >>>> >>>> "url": "https://www.lsnf.org/", >>>> >>>> "description": "LSNF is a not-for-profit legal services organization >>>> serving only low-income individuals and families in sixteen counties across >>>> Florida’s central and western panhandle. LSNF’s priority areas are cases >>>> involving Family Law, Housing, Public Benefits, Employment, Education, and >>>> Health Care issues. It does not help with traffic tickets, car injuries, or >>>> defending criminal actions.", >>>> >>>> "logo": " >>>> https://www.lsnf.org/wp-content/themes/LSNFtheme/assets/images/Logo.png >>>> ", >>>> >>>> "alternateName": "LSNF", >>>> >>>> "telephone": "(850) 385-9007", >>>> >>>> "address": [ >>>> >>>> { >>>> >>>> "@type": "PostalAddress", >>>> >>>> "streetAddress": "2119 Delta Boulevard >>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/2119+Delta+Boulevard?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>> ", >>>> >>>> "addressLocality": "Tallahassee", >>>> >>>> "addressRegion": "FL", >>>> >>>> "postalCode": “32303” >>>> >>>> }, >>>> >>>> ] >>>> >>>> "areaServed": [ >>>> >>>> { >>>> >>>> "@type": "AdministrativeArea", >>>> >>>> "name": "[“Bay County, FL”, “Calhoun County, FL”, “Escambia >>>> County, FL”, “Franklin County, FL”, “Gadsden County, FL”, “Gulf County, >>>> FL”, “Holmes County, FL”, “Jackson County, FL”, “Jefferson County, FL”, >>>> “Leon County, FL”, “Liberty County, FL”, “Okaloosa County, FL”, “Santa Rosa >>>> County, FL”, “Wakulla County, FL”, “Walton County, FL”, “Washington County, >>>> FL”]" >>>> >>>> } >>>> >>>> ], >>>> >>>> "isAccessibleForFree": true, >>>> >>>> "openingHours": [ >>>> >>>> "Mo 09:00-17:00", >>>> >>>> "Tu 09:00-17:00", >>>> >>>> "We 09:00-17:00", >>>> >>>> "Th 09:00-17:00", >>>> >>>> "Fr 09:00-17:00" >>>> >>>> ], >>>> >>>> "contactPoint": [ >>>> >>>> { "@type": "ContactPoint", >>>> >>>> "url": " >>>> https://floi.legalserver.org/modules/matter/extern_intake.php?pid=38&h=757e8c >>>> ", >>>> >>>> "contactType": "Online Intake", >>>> >>>> "areaServed": "Florida" >>>> >>>> }, >>>> >>>> ] >>>> >>>> >>>> "availableLanguage": [ >>>> >>>> { >>>> >>>> "@type": "Language", >>>> >>>> "name": "English", >>>> >>>> "alternateName": "English" >>>> >>>> } >>>> >>>> ] >>>> >>>> "serviceLocation": [ >>>> >>>> { >>>> >>>> “@type”: “LegalService” >>>> >>>> “name” : “Legal Services of North Florida: Pensacola office”, >>>> >>>> “telephone” : “(850) 432-8222” >>>> >>>> “address”: { >>>> >>>> "streetAddress": "118 South Baylen Street >>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/118+South+Baylen+Street?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>> ", >>>> >>>> "addressLocality": "Pensacola", >>>> >>>> "addressRegion": "FL", >>>> >>>> "postalCode": 32502 >>>> >>>> } >>>> >>>> }, >>>> >>>> { >>>> >>>> “@type”: “LegalService” >>>> >>>> “name” : “Legal Services of North Florida: Quincy Office”, >>>> >>>> “telephone” : “(850) 875-9881” >>>> >>>> “address”: { >>>> >>>> "streetAddress": "121 North Jackson Street >>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/121+North+Jackson+Street?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>> ", >>>> >>>> "addressLocality": "Quincy", >>>> >>>> "addressRegion": "FL", >>>> >>>> "postalCode": 32303 >>>> >>>> } >>>> >>>> }, >>>> >>>> { >>>> >>>> “@type”: “LegalService” >>>> >>>> “name” : “Legal Services of North Florida: Ft. Walton Beach”, >>>> >>>> “telephone” : “(850) 862-3279” >>>> >>>> “address”: { >>>> >>>> "streetAddress": "133 Staff Drive, NE >>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/133+Staff+Drive,+NE?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>> ", >>>> >>>> "addressLocality": "Ft. Walton Beach", >>>> >>>> "addressRegion": "FL", >>>> >>>> "postalCode": 32548 >>>> >>>> } >>>> >>>> }, >>>> >>>> { >>>> >>>> “@type”: “LegalService” >>>> >>>> “name” : “Legal Services of North Florida: Panama City office”, >>>> >>>> “telephone” : “(850) 769-3581” >>>> >>>> “address”: { >>>> >>>> "@type": "PostalAddress", >>>> >>>> "streetAddress": "211 East 11th Street >>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/211+East+11th+Street?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>> ", >>>> >>>> "addressLocality": "Panama City", >>>> >>>> "addressRegion": "FL", >>>> >>>> "postalCode": 32401 >>>> >>>> } >>>> >>>> }, >>>> >>>> { >>>> >>>> “@type”: “LegalService” >>>> >>>> “name” : “Legal Services of North Florida: Tallahassee office”, >>>> >>>> “telephone” : “(850) 385-9007” >>>> >>>> “address”: { >>>> >>>> "@type": "PostalAddress", >>>> >>>> "streetAddress": "2119 Delta Blvd >>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/2119+Delta+Blvd?entry=gmail&source=g> >>>> ., >>>> >>>> "addressLocality": "Tallahassee", >>>> >>>> "addressRegion": "FL", >>>> >>>> "postalCode": 32303” >>>> >>>> } >>>> >>>> } >>>> >>>> ] >>>> >>>> } >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> { >>>> >>>> "@context": "http://www.schema.org", >>>> >>>> "@type": "LegalService", >>>> >>>> "name": "Law Help NY", >>>> >>>> "url": "https://www.lawhelpny.org/", >>>> >>>> "description": "Access to legal information and free legal help for >>>> New Yokers in need of legal assistance.", >>>> >>>> "image": " >>>> https://www.lawhelpny.org/files/B23B29BF-0DED-F7B9-2149-1DB14E1A7DE5/images/LHNY%203_20.png >>>> ", >>>> >>>> "logo": " >>>> https://www.lawhelpny.org/files/B23B29BF-0DED-F7B9-2149-1DB14E1A7DE5/images/LHNY%203_20.png >>>> ", >>>> >>>> "isAccessibleForFree": true, >>>> >>>> "areaServed": [ >>>> >>>> { >>>> >>>> "@type": "AdministrativeArea", >>>> >>>> "name": "New York" >>>> >>>> } >>>> >>>> ], >>>> >>>> "knowsAbout": [ >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/DI-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/FA-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/CO-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/HE-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/BE-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/HO-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/WO-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/MO-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/ES-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/GO-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/VE-00-00-00-00", >>>> >>>> "https://taxonomy.legal/term/RI-00-00-00-00" >>>> >>>> ], >>>> >>>> "description": "Legal information for New Yorkers who cannot afford >>>> an attorney.", >>>> >>>> "availableLanguage": { >>>> >>>> "@type": "Language", >>>> >>>> "name": [ >>>> >>>> "English", >>>> >>>> "Spanish", >>>> >>>> "French", >>>> >>>> "Korean", >>>> >>>> "Russian", >>>> >>>> "Polish", >>>> >>>> "Vietnamese", >>>> >>>> "Haitian; Haitian Creole", >>>> >>>> "Arabic", >>>> >>>> "Italian", >>>> >>>> "Tagalog" >>>> >>>> ] >>>> >>>> }, >>>> >>>> "email": "info@nylawhelp.org" >>>> >>>> } >>>> >>> >> >> -- >> acrimer.com >> <https://acrimer.com?utm_source=signature&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=passive> >> schedule a call <https://calendly.com/acrimer> >> >> >> -- >> acrimer.com >> <https://acrimer.com?utm_source=signature&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=passive> >> schedule a call <https://calendly.com/acrimer> >> >
Received on Tuesday, 24 March 2020 21:13:35 UTC