Re: tracking state changes in a temporal read-write web

Kingsley,

I find it difficult to read background justifications from a person who has
so much provenance ; who is in-turn, reflecting on something akin to
'trauma'?  but not so much in-terms of growth /  prosperity?  i don't know
how to say it well...

such illuminating leadership to be considered; whilst trying to help...

so; without seeking to support digression...  what's the implicit, problem
definition?

I realised a previously linked reference was out of date.  Amanda (cc'd)
helped me find the right link: https://timeline.knightlab.com/

fields are:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1pHBvXN7nmGkiG8uQSUB82eNlnL8xHu6kydzH_-eguHQ/copy


Perhaps we need to make a form?  perhaps it'll help in enumerate ways?
IDK...

TCH.


On Sat, 22 May 2021 at 04:55, Kingsley Idehen <kidehen@openlinksw.com>
wrote:

> On 5/21/21 2:29 PM, Martynas Jusevičius wrote:
> >>> I have a suggestion for a simple decentralized use case:
> >>>
> >>>     There are 2 agents running instances of the same application,
> >>> where the instances are peers since the application includes both a
> >>> server (with an RDF storage backend) and a client and can communicate
> >>> both ways.
> >>>     One of the agents accesses (dereferences) an RDF document on the
> >>> peer application, and stores that data in its own application.
> >>>
> >>> And that's it, to begin with. The intention is that now the agent can
> >>> cross-reference the new data with the rest of the data in its
> >>> application, e.g. using SPARQL if the storage supports it.
> >>> Authentication, authorization are of course also in this picture, but
> >>> they are orthogonal, so for the sake of simplicity we can skip them
> >>> for now.
> >>>
> >>> Is that too simplistic? Then please show me an RDF-based app that can
> >>> do this out-of-the-box.
> >>
> >> Nice and simple use-case.
> > I'm glad we're in agreement here, that doesn't happen so often ;)
> >
> >> Here's a suggestion re most basic RWW use-case:
> >>
> >> A simple Application deployed in Single Page Application mode (ie.,
> >> HTML, CSS, and JS) that can achieve the following:
> >>
> >> 1. Authenticate using a variety of protocols
> >>
> >> 2. Insert, Update, or Delete Data using a simple data entry form or via
> >> SPARQL; authentication is multi-protocol thereby offering choices;
> >> storage options included a File System or DBMS; and all this subject to
> >> ACLs in place.
> >>
> >>
> >> Example:
> >>
> >> [1] https://github.com/OpenLinkSoftware/single-page-apps
> > I checked the demo here:
> > https://openlinksoftware.github.io/single-page-apps/data-entry-form.html
> >
> > Technically this example might match the description in my use case.
> > As does Atomic Data (https://atomicdata.dev/) mentioned by Jonas.
>
>
> Okay.
>
>
> > But my take is that these are demos and nowhere near consumer
> > products.
>
>
> You didn't request simple RWW example that's consumer-friendly, despite
> the inherently subjective nature of such commentary.
>
>
> > There is *a lot* lacking, especially in terms of UX -- it
> > doesn't seem like it's evolved much since the beginning of Linked Data
> > 10+ years ago.
>
>
> See my comment above.
>
>
> > First of all, we heard a number of times from commercial users that
> > they are not interested in seeing the technical details of RDF. So
> > editing raw triples (rather than entities with properties), displaying
> > raw URIs -- that's a no go from the start.
>
>
> Again, see my comments above.
>
>
> If you want something that end-user friendly, then you can look at what
> we have with our Structured Data Sniffer (OSDS) Browser extension which
> simply adds missing "Save As" functionality to existing browsers, due to
> adherence to fundamental loose-coupling of:
>
> 1. Identity
>
> 2. Identification
>
> 3. Authentication
>
> 4. Authorization
>
> 5. Storage (File System or DBMS)
>
> If I visit a Web Page that catches my interest for a variety of reasons
> I can simply use OSDS to extract Structured Data and save it to a DBMS,
> Remote or Local File System.
>
>
> >
> > Now take a look at Roam Research [1], Notion [2] and their UX. Heck,
> > even at the Freebase demo from 2008 that shows parallax navigation
> > [3].
>
>
> I can save data from those (or anything else that end's up in my
> browser's DOM) as outlined above. I can even read W3C specs and lift
> their various examples (RDF or JSON) into a Knowledge Graph that's
> persisted to wherever I have appropriate privileges, courtesy of
> dokie.li (another RWW app and extension) and OSDS.
>
>
> > The question is: how do we close the UX gap to the level of those
> > products, while building with the basic read-write Linked Data (RDF
> > CRUD) and SPARQL building blocks that we have at hand?
> >
> > Hint: we have some opinionated ideas [4].
> >
> > [1] https://roamresearch.com/
> > [2] https://www.notion.so/
> > [3] https://vimeo.com/1513562
> > [4] https://atomgraph.com/blog/
> >
>
> All we have to do is build and share apps as I suggested a while back.
>
> It is also important to accept apps and services that may or may not
> conform to your perceptions, expectations, and tastes.
>
> Links:
>
> [1] https://youtu.be/M025yfrhNy4 -- demonstrating Super Links via OSDS
> (this is end-user oriented)
>
> [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yPfdHpAr-Q -- Dokie.li and OSDS
>
>
> --
> Regards,
>
> Kingsley Idehen
> Founder & CEO
> OpenLink Software
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