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Re: on evaluation

From: Karen Coyle <kcoyle@kcoyle.net>
Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2016 14:41:58 -0700
To: "Peter F. Patel-Schneider" <pfpschneider@gmail.com>, public-rdf-shapes@w3.org
Message-ID: <25735933-8450-6d45-2479-cea45b1a74eb@kcoyle.net>
Oh, I should have included the link to the diagram:

https://www.w3.org/TR/2016/WD-shacl-20160814/images/SHACL-Validation-Process.png

That's a quick read. - kc

On 9/28/16 2:38 PM, Karen Coyle wrote:
>
>
> On 9/28/16 1:56 PM, Peter F. Patel-Schneider wrote:
>> My view is that there should be no requirement that focus nodes are
>> validated
>> against the filter shapes of a shape before they are validated against
>> the
>> constraints of the shape.  I have previously mentioned several reasons
>> that
>> led me to this view.
>
> OK. This is a different objection to what I had previously understood. I
> thought your objection was to saying that they are "validated".
>
> In the introduction to section 2.0 of SHACL there is a diagram that
> shows what I have taken to be an execution flow:
>
> data graph -> targets are used to select focus nodes -> Filters are used
> to eliminate some focus nodes -> Constraints are used to produce
> validation results.
>
> Is it this flow that you are objecting to?
>
> If so, can you either point to or reiterate your reasons?
>
> Thanks,
> kc
>
>
>>
>> Peter F. Patel-Schneider
>> Nuance Communications
>>
>>
>> On 09/28/2016 06:40 AM, Karen Coyle wrote:
>>> Peter, how would you describe the action that takes place then?
>>> Because there
>>> is an implied action and work flow. Implemented? executed? enforced?
>>> resolved?
>>> (I'm running through the thesaurus entries.)
>>>
>>> kc
>>>
>>> On 9/27/16 3:43 PM, Peter F. Patel-Schneider wrote:
>>>> For starters, filter shapes are not "applied to the data graph", so,
>>>> no.
>>>>
>>>> peter
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 09/27/2016 03:38 PM, Holger Knublauch wrote:
>>>>> Peter, would this suggestion work better for you? I assume someone
>>>>> could argue
>>>>> that "applied" is not defined.
>>>>>
>>>>> Holger
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 28/09/2016 1:44, Karen Coyle wrote:
>>>>>> Filter shapes must be ...
>>>>>>  - applied to the data graph
>>>>>> ... before validating....
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 9/26/16 4:38 PM, Holger Knublauch wrote:
>>>>>>> Does anyone else find this sentence unclear? If yes, could someone
>>>>>>> suggest alternative wording?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "Filter shapes MUST be validated before validating the associated
>>>>>>> shapes
>>>>>>> or constraints."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>> Holger
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 27/09/2016 1:52, Peter F. Patel-Schneider wrote:
>>>>>>>> How is a shape "validated"?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This problem even affects the second half of the sentence I
>>>>>>>> initially
>>>>>>>> quoted.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> peter
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 09/26/2016 12:18 AM, Holger Knublauch wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Replaced with "validated":
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> https://github.com/w3c/data-shapes/commit/d4fbdebd7044cd79f35985a75a54994ea3facde9
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Holger
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 26/09/2016 15:59, Peter F. Patel-Schneider wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> "Filter shapes MUST be evaluated before validating the associated
>>>>>>>>>> shapes or
>>>>>>>>>> constraints."
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Evaluation is not defined.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> peter
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>

-- 
Karen Coyle
kcoyle@kcoyle.net http://kcoyle.net
m: 1-510-435-8234
skype: kcoylenet/+1-510-984-3600
Received on Wednesday, 28 September 2016 21:42:28 UTC

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