RE: updates to PAQ doc for discussion

I'm complaining about the name 'complement' not the generality of the definition. Complementary angles are not different characterizations of the same angle, they are different angles that create a whole. A wine complements food. Some other term with the broader definition would be fine. (BTW: I am beginning to think that being able to associate a time interval with the relationship would be useful...)

 Jim


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Khalid Belhajjame [mailto:Khalid.Belhajjame@cs.man.ac.uk]
> Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2011 1:31 PM
> To: Myers, Jim
> Cc: Paul Groth; Graham Klyne; public-prov-wg@w3.org
> Subject: Re: updates to PAQ doc for discussion
> 
> Hi Jim
> 
> On 16/08/2011 13:45, Myers, Jim wrote:
> > As for complementOf - since complement means 'counterpart' and has the
> notion of not being the same thing - being separate and adding to the thing, I
> don't think it works as a replacement for IVPof - viewOf doesn't capture
> everything but would be better than complement in that its English meaning
> does not conflict ...
> 
> I am not sure I understand what you mean. Could you please elaborate?
> 
> The way is complement of is defined seems to me more general that IVP of and
> also more natural. While IVPof requires that all the immutable attributes of
> one characterization are subset of the immutable attributes of the other
> characterization, isComplementOf does not pose this constraint, which is
> plausible: in practice, when we have two characterizations of an entity, these
> characterizations are likely to use different set of attributes depending on the
> observer, and the likelihood that the immutable attributes of one are subset of
> the immutable attributes of the second is small.
> 
> Khalid
> 
> 
> 
> >
> >   Jim
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Paul Groth [mailto:p.t.groth@vu.nl]
> >> Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2011 1:21 AM
> >> To: Myers, Jim
> >> Cc: Graham Klyne; public-prov-wg@w3.org
> >> Subject: Re: updates to PAQ doc for discussion
> >>
> >> Hi Jim
> >>
> >> I think<link>  elements in PAQ serve a different purpose the
> >> semantics is here's how you find me (the resource)  in provenance
> information.
> >>
> >> ComplementOf has a much more constrained meaning.
> >>
> >> Paul
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Aug 16, 2011, at 3:01, "Myers, Jim"<MYERSJ4@rpi.edu>  wrote:
> >>
> >>> But, having introduced the definition in this way, other uses are
> >>> possible.  The example I've started thinking about is that multiple
> >>> <link>  elements might indicate different URIs denoting different
> >>> levels of
> >> invariance.
> >>> - why aren't these just IVPof relationships? (I'm not arguing
> >>> against encoding pil relationships as links, just against adding a 'target'
> >>> concept that duplicates other relationships in the model.)
> >>>
> >>> Jim
> >>> ________________________________________
> >>> From: Graham Klyne [graham.klyne@zoo.ox.ac.uk]
> >>> Sent: Monday, August 15, 2011 5:38 PM
> >>> To: Myers, Jim
> >>> Cc: Paul Groth; public-prov-wg@w3.org
> >>> Subject: Re: updates to PAQ doc for discussion
> >>>
> >>> Myers, Jim wrote:
> >>>>> In Issue 46 (http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/track/issues/46), Luc
> >>>>> raised the point that the scenario we had agreed to address
> >>>>> included a case where the recipient of a resource representation
> >>>>> had no way to know its URI for the purposes of provenance
> >>>>> discovery.  After short discussion, my response to this issue was
> >>>>> to introduce a new link relation type (currently called "target")
> >>>>> to allow this URI to be encoded
> >> in the header of an HTML document.
> >>>>> Does this help?
> >>>> So this is only used inside an HTML entity?
> >>> That was the compelling use-case, but once defined, other uses are
> >>> not
> >> excluded.
> >>>> ... I.e. it is not a relationship between two entities, but is a
> >>>> means to embed an identifier in an entity (for HTML)?
> >>> Interesting take.  Practically, in the HTML use case, I think I'd have to
> agree.
> >>>
> >>> But I think it is still technically a relation in the same way that
> >>> owl:sameAs is a relation, even though its semantics tell us that the
> >>> related RDF nodes denote the same thing.  Like all HTML<link>
> >>> elements, it defines a relation between the resource of which the
> >>> containing document is a representation and a resource denoted by
> >>> the given
> >> URI.  They may both be the same resource.
> >>> But, having introduced the definition in this way, other uses are
> >>> possible.  The example I've started thinking about is that multiple
> >>> <link>  elements might indicate different URIs denoting different
> >>> levels of invariance.  If the HTML is a document in a source code
> >>> management system, one such URI might denote a specific version, and
> >>> another might denote the "current" version, both of which might
> >>> reasonably
> >> be the referent for provenance assertions.
> >>> These other uses are not reasons that the propoal was introduced,
> >>> but are just consequences of not placing unnecessary constraints on
> >>> the use of the existing<link>  feature as defined.
> >>>
> >>>> An "ID card" mechanism that would allow me to keep my rdf:resource
> >>>> URL
> >> on my physical body so you could connect me to my online identity is
> >> the same type of thing?
> >>> Hmmm... I suppose you might think of it like that, but I'm wary of
> >>> adopting that view as it tends to arbitrarily exclude other
> >>> possibilities that arguably should flow from this use of the<link>  element.
> >>>
> >>> #g
> >>> --
> >>>
> >>>
> >

Received on Wednesday, 17 August 2011 18:43:55 UTC