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RE: Separation of Presentation from the Places/Things

From: Seiler, Karl <karl.seiler@navteq.com>
Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 13:14:13 -0600
To: Thomas Wrobel <darkflame@gmail.com>, "Seiler, Karl" <karl.seiler@navteq.com>
CC: "cperey@perey.com" <cperey@perey.com>, "roBman@mob-labs.com" <roBman@mob-labs.com>, "public-poiwg@w3.org" <public-poiwg@w3.org>
Message-ID: <0B559C0AA6C114479A87C752A04E343E05D6C6BC5F@hq-ex-mb02.ad.navteq.com>
Below

_______________________________
Karl Seiler
Director Location Technology & Services
NAVTEQ - Chicago
(T)  +312-894-7231
(M) +312-375-5932
www.navteq.com


-----Original Message-----
From: Thomas Wrobel [mailto:darkflame@gmail.com] 
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 4:47 PM
To: Seiler, Karl
Cc: cperey@perey.com; roBman@mob-labs.com; public-poiwg@w3.org
Subject: Re: Separation of Presentation from the Places/Things

Must admit, those descriptions just confused me utterly :-/

"Location" -  How does a 3d construct describe where a place is?
surely a 3d construct is what you put -at- a specified location, not
the data that specifies the location.
[<KS>] Right. That one concerns me as well. Here is my POV - As navigable maps go from 2D to 3D this 3D data will be location relative. 3D information is additional information about the place. Parts of the 3d model must be able to bind to the road network and or other positional geometry. Visually it can use to recognize a place.

In this example, what acts as a trigger for the display; The
"Location" or the "POI" ?(that is, what data does the client device,
such as a phone, use to know if something should be visible, and where
to place it if it is).
[<KS>]  IF a device wanted to display a POI,s brand icon over a view, for example, the where to put the icon is available in the "location" primitive, the icon image is part of the POIs extended attribution, the name of the POI and its persistent  and unique ID is part of the base POI attribution.
[<KS>] 
On 17 December 2010 23:29, Seiler, Karl <karl.seiler@navteq.com> wrote:
> The POI/Places draft edits should be out on the wiki for review.
>
>
>
> Location is a primitive that consists of one for more types of descriptions
> of where a place is, such as X/Y, Address, MBR, vector of points, 3d
> constructs, etc.
>
>
>
> A POI/Place consists of other primitives such as names, ID, what type of
> thing it is (category), a location, relationships to other POIs, meta-data
> about when it was created, who can use it, etc.
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________
>
> Karl Seiler
>
> Director Location Technology & Services
>
> NAVTEQ - Chicago
>
> (T)  +312-894-7231
>
> (M) +312-375-5932
>
> www.navteq.com
>
>
>
> From: public-poiwg-request@w3.org [mailto:public-poiwg-request@w3.org] On
> Behalf Of Christine Perey
> Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 2:08 PM
> To: roBman@mob-labs.com
> Cc: public-poiwg@w3.org
> Subject: Re: Separation of Presentation from the Places/Things
>
>
>
> Hello all,
>
> Could someone who was at the F2F meeting summarize if this topic was
> discussed and the outcomes?
>
> Many thanks!
>
> Christine
>
>
>
> Spime Wrangler
>
>
>
> cperey@perey.com
>
> mobile +41 79 436 6869
>
> VoIP +1 (617) 848-8159
>
> Skype Christine_Perey
>
> On 12/13/10 11:24 PM, Rob Manson wrote:
>
> Hey Karl,
>
>
>
> sounds good to me 8)
>
>
>
>
>
> roBman
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, 2010-12-13 at 12:38 -0600, Seiler, Karl wrote:
>
> I agree that a prime goal should be the separation of the definition of a
> POI and a location.
>
>
>
> A POI may need one or more locations to describe itself (navigation point
> x/y/z, display point center, main entrance door front, parking spots, a
> parcel area, a bounded polygon of linked X/y's, a set of navigable map
> references - link/side/spot, etc.).
>
>
>
> POI's can and do move from one location to another (closed and moved across
> the street).
>
>
>
> Locations may not always have POIs.
>
>
>
> A location can be shared by several POIs (stores in a mall).
>
>
>
> _______________________________
>
> Karl Seiler
>
> Director Location Technology & Services
>
> NAVTEQ - Chicago
>
> (T)  +312-894-7231
>
> (M) +312-375-5932
>
> www.navteq.com
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> From: public-poiwg-request@w3.org [mailto:public-poiwg-request@w3.org] On
> Behalf Of Rob Manson
>
> Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2010 9:27 PM
>
> To: public-poiwg@w3.org
>
> Subject: Separation of Presentation from the Places/Things
>
>
>
> Hi,
>
>
>
> a while back I posted a note about the Data Model coming in 2 main
>
> flavours[1].
>
>
>
>         1. the data describing the physical placement of the POI
>
>            (e.g.lat/lon/alt/x-rot/y-rot/z-rot).
>
>         2. the content the POI is linked to
>
>            (e.g. title, description, type, keywords, favicon/thumbnail,
>
>            3D model, etc.).
>
>
>
> Looking back at it I think I didn't quite express it correctly...but the
>
> idea is important and needs more discussion.  I think with point 1. I
>
> was really thinking about Presentation.  With point 2. I was thinking
>
> about the underlying Place or Thing that the POI was re-presenting.
>
>
>
> On the Data Model page there seems to be a real blurring of these 2
>
> types of data (e.g. "Apply some CSS-like "outer-glow: 3pt yellow;"
>
> effect to your POI").
>
>
>
> I think clarifying this abstraction would allow the two aspects of the
>
> Data Model to develop more freely and independently.
>
>
>
> NOTE: In the Mobile AR space there is a constant push for more freedom
>
> in the Presentation layer (just like CSS enabled with the web).  But in
>
> the Data Model discussion this is quite different from separation of
>
> Markup and Presentation.
>
>
>
> NOTE: Dynamic behaviour (e.g. scripting) may also need to be explicitly
>
> separated out too.
>
>
>
>
>
> roBman
>
>
>
>
>
> [1] http://www.w3.org/2010/POI/wiki/Data_Model#Notes

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> ________________________________
> The information contained in this communication may be CONFIDENTIAL and is
> intended only for the use of the recipient(s) named above. If you are not
> the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination,
> distribution, or copying of this communication, or any of its contents, is
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The information contained in this communication may be CONFIDENTIAL and is intended only for the use of the recipient(s) named above.  If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication, or any of its contents, is strictly prohibited.  If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender and delete/destroy the original message and any copy of it from your computer or paper files.
Received on Monday, 20 December 2010 19:14:50 UTC

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