Forwarded message 1
Janina:
Here are my notes from our conversation earlier this week. I will try to
send the list of terminology in a few days.
Thanks again for a great conversation, and for being open to my
feedback. Also nice to reconnect!
--JAM
3.1 intro should not reference any of the stylistic preferences or
guidelines for description (e.g., voicing, objectivity, timing), but
should reference existing guidelines such as the DCMP description key.
There is a list of different description approaches in the intro. What
are the items in this list. Should it be a definition list?
In addition to talking about monolithic description tracks, please talk
about atomic description where individual description clips are synced
with video.
What about DV4. Does it really have to be real human speech? What about
clips vs track?
If DV5 and DV6 regarding independent volume controls for program and
descriptive audio are requirements, then Open Description does not comply
DV12 seems funny. Why address this specific buggy behavior? It seems
like there are lots of undesirable behaviors we could call out, but this
should not be a list of possible programming errors.
What about multiple, simultaneous description tracks, such as might be
desirable for different tracks voicing different information types, or
for subtitled films where different voices would read different
characters, and describer of visual elements; might want these voices in
separate locations.
TVD requirements talk a lot about UA/ST TTS options to be supported.
There is significant overlap here with DV list and extended requirements
Discuss hybrid extended/inline case.
Consider content navigation by description element Is this what 4.2
Granularity level control for structural navigation is getting at?
Structural opinion about this document: the lists of requirements [dv]
[td], pcc[, etc, should be marked up as lists or otherwise
On 2/9/2015 12:28 PM, Janina Sajka wrote:
> Hi, Josh:
>
> 1PM Pacific Tuesday would be 4PM Eastern, and that works perfectly for
> me. Do you want to call me? Best number is:
>
> +1 202 494 7040
>
> Looking forward to catching up with you.
>
> Janina
>
> Joshua A. Miele writes:
>> Janina:
>>
>> Thanks for following up -- I'd love to have a talk. I do have some thoughts
>> about the document and have been slammed, so haven't had time to write about
>> them.
>>
>> Any chance we could schedule a call Tuesday, 2/10 at 1:00 Pacific?
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> --JAM
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2/9/2015 9:39 AM, Janina Sajka wrote:
>>> Hi, Josh:
>>>
>>> Just a quick resend of my email from the past week following up on the
>>> W3C Media Accessibility User Requirements document.
>>>
>>> Have you had opportunity to review it? Should we chat sometime soon?
>>> Please let me know what works for you.
>>>
>>> tia
>>>
>>> Janina
>>>
>>> Janina Sajka writes:
>>>> Hi, Josh:
>>>>
>>>> We've not managed to have the telephone conversation we exchanged email
>>>> about, but I have good opportunity to do so over the next couple weeks.
>>>> Did you find items we should discuss? Do you want to propose some times
>>>> to talk?
>>>>
>>>> Best days for me are Tuesdays and Fridays. Mondays are also pretty good
>>>> for me, Wednesdays and Thursdays not so good. Let me know what might
>>>> work for you.
>>>>
>>>> Janina
>>>>
>>>> Judy Brewer writes:
>>>>> Hi Josh, Janina,
>>>>>
>>>>> Did you manage to connect yet on the Media User Accessibility Requirements?
>>>>> That work is coming to a close soon so we should capture your input, Josh,
>>>>> if you think we're missing some things.
>>>>>
>>>>> And Josh and Philippe, do you both have any time on Friday, afternoon for
>>>>> Philippe and me, morning for Josh, when we could talk for half an hour to
>>>>> introduce Josh to the WebVTT and Timed Text work going on here at W3C? For
>>>>> instance, would 10am Pacific, 1pm Eastern, be possible?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> - Judy
>>>>>
>>>>> On 1/8/2015 8:02 PM, Joshua A. Miele wrote:
>>>>>> Judy -- thank you for the intros!
>>>>>> Philippe -- I look forward to speaking with you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Janina:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's really great to be back in touch!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks so much for sharing the link to the MAUR. I will not be able to
>>>>>> make the scheduled meeting on Monday, but I am extremely excited to have
>>>>>> the opportunity to provide feedback for this document. I have already
>>>>>> given it a quick look and it has set my thought wheels in motion.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm not sure if you're familiar with YouDescribe -- a description tool we
>>>>>> have been developing here at Smith-Kettlewell -- but it brings a number of
>>>>>> these issues out of the theoretical and into the concrete. Based on user
>>>>>> feedback about our admittedly rudimentary feature set, I think I have a
>>>>>> few things to contribute to the MAUR.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You can check it out at:
>>>>>> http://youdescribe.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think it might be helpful for me to review the document a little more
>>>>>> closely, and then maybe have a realtime conversation with you, Janina. I
>>>>>> want to make sure my feedback is valuable, so I'd like to chat about stuff
>>>>>> a little before committing detailed comments to text.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> One of the things I'd like to discuss is the separation of traditional
>>>>>> (i.e., inline) description versus extended description. our tool allows
>>>>>> for both types of description in any given video, and I think they are not
>>>>>> as different as this document might make them seem.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'd also like to discuss the assumption that a description track is a
>>>>>> monolithic audio track -- we do it with individual audio clips for each
>>>>>> atomic bit of description, and we think its important to include this
>>>>>> concept in the enumeration of use cases.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'd love to talk before going much further in my feedback.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm really sorry, but tomorrow and Monday are really tight. Any chance we
>>>>>> can schedule some time next week? I'm available on Wednesday morning
>>>>>> (Pacific -- early afternoon eastern). Let me know if that might work.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks so much for allowing me to discuss this with you!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --JAM
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 1/8/2015 1:06 PM, Janina Sajka wrote:
>>>>>>> Hello, Josh:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Great to be in communication with you again, and Happy New Year to you.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I welcome your perspectives on our Media Accessibility User Requirements
>>>>>>> document. We do believe we're pretty complete, but we also did not place
>>>>>>> great emphasis on viewing the issues from a mobile perspective. So, your
>>>>>>> input would be most welcome, even this late in our process. Certainly,
>>>>>>> we don't want to publish something less than the best thinking
>>>>>>> available.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The latest editor's draft of the MAUR is at:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://w3c.github.io/pfwg/media-accessibility-reqs/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Our next scheduled teleconference on this document is this coming
>>>>>>> Monday, January 12 at 4PM Boston / 1PM San Francisco. If you can join
>>>>>>> the call, that would be fabulous. I'll cc you when I send the agenda
>>>>>>> Friday.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If the telecon doesn't work for you, please let me know how we can best
>>>>>>> get your input. I'm happy to have an individual call with you, if that
>>>>>>> would be better. I look forward to talking with you soon.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Janina
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Judy Brewer writes:
>>>>>>>> Hi Josh! And happy New Year!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In December we were talking about some work you were doing at
>>>>>>>> Smith-Kettlewell on video mobile accessibility, and how that might
>>>>>>>> relate to
>>>>>>>> two things under development in Web standards at W3C.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Here are two introductions -- or rather one re-introduction and a new
>>>>>>>> intro
>>>>>>>> -- that are both timely for the beginning of January.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The re-introduction:
>>>>>>>> Janina Sajka is wrapping up work on the Media Accessibility User
>>>>>>>> Requirements (MAUR) document through the Media Accessibility Group of
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> HTML Accessibility Task Force. They're close to publishing a final
>>>>>>>> version
>>>>>>>> of that, but I think you and she should talk to make sure that the user
>>>>>>>> requirements that you've been working with are covered. And actually,
>>>>>>>> there's a Media Accessibility Group meeting this coming Monday,
>>>>>>>> January 12
>>>>>>>> that might be good for you to visit, if you're available then.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Janina, I don't have links handy for the latest editor's draft of
>>>>>>>> MAUR, or
>>>>>>>> the Media group's meeting time& coordinates for Monday. Could you
>>>>>>>> please
>>>>>>>> send those to Josh? (And also please copy me as I'd like to take a
>>>>>>>> look at
>>>>>>>> the latest.) And Josh my suggestion would be that you talk with Janina
>>>>>>>> rather quickly, if your schedule allows, so that you can jointly assess
>>>>>>>> whether or not the requirements you've been researching are adequately
>>>>>>>> covered.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The new introduction:
>>>>>>>> Philippe le Hegaret is Interaction Domain Lead for W3C (sort of like
>>>>>>>> my role
>>>>>>>> for WAI, except he does it for HTML& a ton of other Web
>>>>>>>> specifications).
>>>>>>>> One of his working groups is working on both WebVTT and Timed Text. We
>>>>>>>> want
>>>>>>>> to make sure that the requirements that we've captured in MAUR are
>>>>>>>> reflected
>>>>>>>> as much as possible in WebVTT and Timed Text, and I think there was a
>>>>>>>> particular feature compatibility issue -- perhaps how to handle
>>>>>>>> multiple
>>>>>>>> captioning streams and/or multiple video description streams, or both
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> where I think this intersected with an issue that Philippe and I had
>>>>>>>> tentatively identified a while back as a possible gap.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So Josh and Philippe, my suggestion would be that we figure out a time
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> talk in the next week or two. But it would probably be helpful to
>>>>>>>> exchange
>>>>>>>> some info up front by email. Josh, do you recall more details about the
>>>>>>>> particular requirements and/or feature(s) that you mentioned concerns
>>>>>>>> about
>>>>>>>> when we spoke in December?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And actually, these discussions about requirements and implementations
>>>>>>>> are
>>>>>>>> related, so we might want to keep the thread going between both areas.
>>>>>>>> Thoughts welcome.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks and best,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> - Judy
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Judy Brewer
>>>>>>>> Director, Web Accessibility Initiative
>>>>>>>> at the World Wide Web Consortium (W3C)
>>>>>>>> 32 Vassar St. Room G-526, MIT/CSAIL
>>>>>>>> Cambridge MA 02149 USA
>>>>>>>> www.w3.org/WAI/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Judy Brewer
>>>>> Director, Web Accessibility Initiative
>>>>> at the World Wide Web Consortium (W3C)
>>>>> 32 Vassar St. Room G-526, MIT/CSAIL
>>>>> Cambridge MA 02149 USA
>>>>> www.w3.org/WAI/
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Janina Sajka, Phone: +1.443.300.2200
>>>> sip:janina@asterisk.rednote.net
>>>> Email: janina@rednote.net
>>>>
>>>> Linux Foundation Fellow
>>>> Executive Chair, Accessibility Workgroup: http://a11y.org
>>>>
>>>> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
>>>> Chair, Protocols& Formats http://www.w3.org/wai/pf
>>>> Indie UI http://www.w3.org/WAI/IndieUI/
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> ----------------------------------------
>> Joshua A. Miele, Ph.D., Director
>> The Smith-Kettlewell Video Description Research and Development Center
>> 2318 Fillmore St.
>> San Francisco, CA 94115
>>
>> Phone: 415/345-2113
>> E-Mail: jam@ski.org
>> Web: http://www.vdrdc.org
>> Twitter: @VDRDC
>