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Re: Feedback (Re: [all] Call for consensus on disambiguation [ACTION-181])

From: Sebastian Hellmann <hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de>
Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2012 05:35:41 +0200
Message-ID: <505FD50D.5090308@informatik.uni-leipzig.de>
To: Tadej Štajner <tadej.stajner@ijs.si>
CC: Felix Sasaki <fsasaki@w3.org>, "Pablo N. Mendes" <pablomendes@gmail.com>, "public-multilingualweb-lt@w3.org" <public-multilingualweb-lt@w3.org>, "raphael.troncy@eurecom.fr" <raphael.troncy@eurecom.fr>, "Giuseppe.Rizzo@eurecom.fr" <Giuseppe.Rizzo@eurecom.fr>
Hi Tadej,

Am 20.09.2012 15:00, schrieb Tadej Štajner:
> I like the idea of automatically inferring the disambigLevel from 
> targetType - there definitely is a clear mapping, but would this work 
> in general? I understand that for lexical concepts and skos:Concepts 
> it could work, but for entity types it may be a stretch.

Why? Basically all types used by certain ontologies can be considered 
"entities". Hence, we just need a list of ontologies. I would start with 
NERD (also covering Zemanta and OpenCalais), DBpedia, Yago, schema.org 
....  Such a list might be completed fast, by an email to the Semantic 
Web list.

I would rather consider the lexical concept part difficult.

Sebastian

>
> I'm attaching a revised version with some additional revisions and 
> term definitions. I've kept the disambigLevel for now, but added that 
> the implementors may infer it from the type if they have the 
> capability to do so. If we can come up with a clear mapping, we could 
> even drop the disambigLevel altogether.
>
> -- Tadej
>
> On 07. 09. 2012 09:53, Felix Sasaki wrote:
>>
>>
>> 2012/9/7 Sebastian Hellmann <hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de 
>> <mailto:hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de>>
>>
>>     Hi Felix,
>>
>>     Am 06.09.2012 20 <tel:06.09.2012%2020>:54, schrieb Felix Sasaki:
>>
>>         Some people said that we should also drop the 
>> "its-disambig-level"
>>         attribute. The three values "lexicalConcept",
>>         "ontologyConcept" and
>>         "entity" are just too hard to justify.
>>
>>
>>     Well, it is obvious that you can not represent *all* NLP layers
>>     with three values.  One problem seems to be the distinction
>>     between its-­‐target-­‐type-­‐ref
>>      and its-­‐disambig-­‐level. Target type ref gives the concrete
>>     type of the annotation, while disambig level is more coarse
>>     grained and on a meta level.
>>
>>     In some cases, level is implied by type:
>>     http://nerd.eurecom.fr/ontology#Place  -> "entity"
>>
>> http://purl.org/vocabularies/princeton/wn30/synset-Dublin-noun-1
>>     with type:
>>     http://www.w3.org/2006/03/wn/wn20/schema/NounSynset ->
>>     "lexicalConcept"
>>
>>     So currently, disambigLevel is more of a coarse-grained type.
>>     Maybe we just use its-target-type for strings and 
>> its-target-type-ref?
>>
>>     On the other hand, I had the impression that this coarse grained
>>     type are really useful and practical and it can really help to put
>>     the target type information into boxes fast.
>>     One proposal would be to limit disambigLevel to coarse-grained 
>> types:
>>
>>     In the semantic web world, there are probably 2-5 relevant classes
>>     for each level,
>>     so "entity" could be one of:  foaf:Person,
>>     http://dbpedia.org/class/yago/Entity100001740,
>>     http://www.opengis.net/gml/_Feature
>>     while "lexicalConcept" can be one of:
>>     http://www.w3.org/2006/03/wn/wn20/schema/Synset,
>>     http://www.monnet-project.eu/lemon#LexicalSense
>>     ontologyConcept is more difficult maybe skos:Concept ?
>>     This grounding/mapping can be done quite fast and is easy to
>>     maintain. Alternatively, data producer could either use the types
>>     directly or we provide such a mapping. This would produce an easy
>>     to handle and robust infrastructure.
>>
>>     More comments below.
>>
>>
>>         A lot of discussion during the seminar was related to 
>> existing ISO
>>         standards like LAF/MAF/GrAF. So far we haven't yet taken the
>>         effort to see
>>         what could be re-used from this realm.
>>
>>         Finally, we were asked whether we have looked into the work of
>>         the open
>>         annotations community group
>>         http://www.w3.org/community/openannotation/
>>         and (along the lines of LAF/MAF/GrAF) whether there is
>>         something we could
>>         re-use.
>>
>>          From this I am wondering whether somebody would take actions
>>         to talk to
>>         LAF/MAF/GrAF people, and the openannotation group? For the
>>         former, I would
>>         recommend  Christian Chiarcos "christian.chiarcos@web.de
>>         <mailto:christian.chiarcos@web.de>" as a contact, but
>>         there may be others.
>>
>>
>>     These two communities have quite a different scope and their
>>     efforts seem very far-stretched.  For LAF/GrAF I would recommend
>>     that somebody with superb XML knowledge has a quick look at the
>>     ISO standard. I think, you can quickly see how this is not
>>     relevant for this group. The main focus of LAF/GrAF is to
>>     represent multi-layers of annotations in a graph and encode that
>>     into XML.
>>     You might as well start looking at UIMA CAS XML, Gate XML, and TCF
>>     by Clarin. I am not sure, what the open annotation community will
>>     say about this, they have other annotation targets and use cases:
>>     e.g. annotating images or web sites with user comments.
>>
>>     Instead of asking more academics, I really hoped, we would ask
>>     somebody from industry, now. The list of relevant tools can be
>>     found here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knowledge_extraction#Tools
>>     I can forward ask my colleague Ali Khalili  (who implemented
>> http://rdface.aksw.org/lite/test/tinymce/examples/rdface_lite.html
>>     ) to check whether Spotlight, OpenCalais, Alchemy, Extractiv,
>>     Evri, Saplo and Lupedia can produce this information and whether
>>     they produce something else that might be important.  I can also
>>     offer to establish a contact to Semantic Web Company, Zemanta and
>>     Ontos about the proposal. Raphael and Giuseppe might know more 
>> people.
>>
>>
>> That would be ... just great.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Felix
>>
>>
>>     All the best,
>>     Sebastian
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>         It's important - that was also mentioned - that we get
>>         feedback of these
>>         and other groups before going to last call, to avoid surprises.
>>
>>         Best,
>>
>>         Felix
>>
>>
>>             2012/8/30 Sebastian Hellmann
>>             <hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de
>> <mailto:hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de>>
>>
>>                 Sounds like a very good solution to me, simple, clear
>>                 and absolutely
>>                 sufficient.
>>
>>                 Cheers,
>>                 Sebastian
>>
>>                 Am 30.08.2012 16:29, schrieb Tadej Stajner:
>>
>>                   Hi, all,
>>
>>                     Co-existence of disambiguaton is not that
>>                     important - I also can't
>>                     justify a real use case for it. The point is more
>>                     about specifying what
>>                     level we're disambiguating on. I'm in favor of
>>                     keeping the disambigLevel
>>                     solution and not introducing a new set of
>>                     attributes, trading off
>>                     coexistence.
>>
>>                     I also propose a different solution for the
>>                     'disambigSource' and
>>                     'entityTypeSource' scenario, which are mostly
>>                     redundant in RDF: the user
>>                     can use either only a disambigIdentRef to specify
>>                     a URI for the target
>>                     entity, or a pair of disambigSource and
>>                     disambigIdent strings in order to
>>                     cover use cases, where the meanings don't have
>>                     addressable URIs.
>>
>>                     Major differences:
>>                     * entityType -> generalize to targetType, cover
>>                     all levels;
>>                     * disambigType -> rename to disambigLevel, change
>>                     constants from
>>                     literals to URIs.
>>                     * disambigSource* -> disambigSource, restrict
>>                     usage to disambiguating
>>                     with non-URI identifiers
>>                     * disambigIdentRef -> disambigIdentRef* for URI
>>                     identifier +
>>                     disambigIdent for local identifiers in the scope
>>                     of a disambigSource
>>                     * entityTypeSource* -> dropped
>>
>>                     -- Tadej
>>
>>                     On 8/20/2012 5:01 PM, Sebastian Hellmann wrote:
>>
>>                         Hi all,
>>                         digging to the core of the problem:
>>
>>                         How many layers of annotations do you need?
>>                         entity, dictionaryEntry,
>>                         lexicalMeaning, pragmaticMeaning,  some other
>>                         layer ... The problem is that
>>                         the XML attribute data structure is not
>>                         appropriate to handle this kind of
>>                         information. So we really need to decide how
>>                         many layers we need. If you
>>                         were to leave this open, I would suggest:
>>                         its-disambig-type-ref-1,
>>                         its-entity-type-ident-ref-1 ,
>>                         its-disambig-type-ref-2,
>>                         its-entity-type-ident-ref-2,
>>                         its-disambig-type-ref-3,
>>                         its-entity-type-ident-ref-3, ....
>>                         But that is not XML-like.
>>
>>                         So question is for how many levels/layers do
>>                         we require coexistence?
>>                         Otherwise its-disambig-type-ref would be
>>                         sufficient to give the level/layer
>>                         (even more fine grained informationm, e.g. an
>>                         entity of type place) .
>>
>>                         Regarding isDefinedBy : It is recommended to
>>                         use it, but, of course,
>>                         you don't go to prison, if you forget it ;)
>>                         Especially with # - OWL
>>                         classes, isDefinedBy is not necessary, as the
>>                         # part is cut away for any
>>                         retrieval request, anyhow.
>>
>>                         All the best,
>>                         Sebastian
>>
>>
>>                         Am 20.08.2012 12:11, schrieb Tadej Štajner:
>>
>>                             Hi, Pablo,
>>                             correct. The feedback I got was that this
>>                             distinction is very
>>                             important, but I can't think of an example
>>                             with the scenario you mention.
>>                             Perhaps for spans where one is contained
>>                             within the other, such as
>>                             assigning a lexical meaning to a word,
>>                             while the whole phrase is an entity,
>>                             for example 'agriculture' in 'Ministry of
>>                             agriculture'.
>>
>>                             I think it boils down to this: could this
>>                             property be reliably
>>                             inferred from the target itself? For
>>                             instance, if someone points to
>> http://www.w3.org/2006/03/wn/**wn20/instances/worsense-**
>> capital-noun-3<http://www.w3.org/2006/03/wn/wn20/instances/worsense-capital-noun-3>-
>>                             can we expect that is definitely a case of
>>                             lexical disambiguation?
>>
>>
>>                             -- Tadej
>>
>>
>>                             On 20. 08. 2012 11
>>                             <tel:08.%202012%2011>:42, Pablo N. Mendes
>>                             wrote:
>>
>>                                 Hi all,
>>
>>                                      I would suggest  to merge
>>                                 "its-entity-type-ident-ref" into
>>                                      "its-disambig-type-ref".
>>
>>
>>                                 If I understand correctly this is the
>>                                 same proposal I made at the
>>                                 call?
>>
>>                                 "<pablomendes> wrt. its:disambigType =
>>                                 (word | entity) can't the
>>                                 distinction between word and entity be
>>                                 inferred from entityTypeRef? e.g.
>>                                 wiktionary:doc is a word, dbpedia:Dog
>>                                 is an entity" [1]
>>
>>                                 If so, this is the answer that Tadej 
>> gave:
>>
>>                                 "tadej: disambiguation use cases are
>>                                 often used in cases where text
>>                                 is short and lacks context
>>                                 ... and computational lingusitic
>>                                 community draw a clear distinction
>>                                 ebtween lexical and conceptual
>>                                 meaning" [1]
>>
>>                                 Perhaps one way to test how strong is
>>                                 this requirement would be to
>>                                 think of use cases where one could
>>                                 assign both lexical and conceptual
>>                                 meaning to the same span.
>>
>>                                 Cheers,
>>                                 Pablo
>>
>>                                 [1]
>> http://www.w3.org/2012/07/26-**mlw-lt-minutes.html<http://www.w3.org/2012/07/26-mlw-lt-minutes.html>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                 On Mon, Aug 20, 2012 at 11:13 AM,
>>                                 Felix Sasaki <fsasaki@w3.org
>> <mailto:fsasaki@w3.org><mailto:
>>                                 fsasaki@w3.org
>> <mailto:fsasaki@w3.org>>> wrote:
>>
>>                                      Hi Sebastian,
>>
>>                                      2012/8/20 Sebastian Hellmann
>>                                 <hellmann@informatik.uni-**
>>                                 leipzig.de <http://leipzig.de>
>> <hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de
>> <mailto:hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de>>
>> <mailto:hellmann@informatik.
>> <mailto:hellmann@informatik.>**uni-leipzig.de
>> <http://uni-leipzig.de><hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de
>> <mailto:hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de>>
>>
>>
>>                                          Hi Felix,
>>                                          your proposal is based on the
>>                                 assumption, that more data is
>>                                          available at these three URLs:
>>
>> http:/nerd.eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place 
>> <http://nerd.eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place><http://nerd.eurecom.fr/ontology#Place>
>> <http://nerd.eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place<http://nerd.eurecom.fr/ontology#Place>
>> http://dbpedia.org/resource/**Dublin<http://dbpedia.org/resource/Dublin>
>> http://www.w3.org/2006/03/wn/**wn20/instances/worsense-**
>> capital-noun-3<http://www.w3.org/2006/03/wn/wn20/instances/worsense-capital-noun-3>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                          While this assumption is ok
>>                                 for the Semantic Web, I am not
>>                                          sure about the ITS world.
>>
>>
>>
>>                                      You are right that in the "ITS
>>                                 world" one cannot be sure that more
>>                                      data is available. But I would
>>                                 argue that implementors who process
>>                                      links also in the ITS world very
>>                                 likely need to know (not
>>                                      automatically, but as a
>>                                 prerequisite for implementation ) 
>> what the
>>                                      URL is about. So I'd rather
>>                                 encourage implementors towards that
>>                                      "Semantic Web like" approach than
>>                                 defining so many attributes.
>>
>>                                      Feedback from the people who want
>>                                 to process "disambiguation"
>>                                      without Semantic Web processing
>>                                 is of course very important here.
>>
>>
>>                                          Furthermore, if you are
>>                                 attempting to minimize it, I would
>>                                          suggest  to merge
>> "its-entity-type-ident-ref"
>>                                 into "its-disambig-type-ref". You
>>                                          wouldn't be limited to entity
>>                                 types and could use any of:
>>
>>
>>
>>                                      Makes sense to me, thanks for the
>>                                 proposal - let's see what Tadej
>>                                      and others say.
>>
>>                                      Best,
>>
>>                                      Felix
>>
>>
>>                                          -
>> http:/nerd.eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place
>> <http://nerd.eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place><http://nerd.eurecom.fr/ontology#Place>
>> <http://nerd.eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place<http://nerd.eurecom.fr/ontology#Place>
>>                                          -
>> http://dbpedia.org/ontology/**Place<http://dbpedia.org/ontology/Place>
>>                                          -
>> http://www.monnet-project.eu/**lemon#LexicalSense<http://www.monnet-project.eu/lemon#LexicalSense>
>>                                          -
>> http://www.monnet-project.eu/**lemon#LexicalEntry<http://www.monnet-project.eu/lemon#LexicalEntry>
>>                                          -
>> http://wordnet.princeton.edu/**wndatamodel#NounWordSense<http://wordnet.princeton.edu/wndatamodel#NounWordSense>
>>                                          -
>> http://wordnet.princeton.edu/**wndatamodel#Synset<http://wordnet.princeton.edu/wndatamodel#Synset>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                          All the best,
>>                                          Sebastian
>>
>>                                          Am 20.08.2012 09:44, schrieb
>>                                 Felix Sasaki:
>>
>>                                              Hi Sebastian, all,
>>
>>                                              thanks, Sebastian. From
>>                                 what you say in the wiki and in
>>                                              the previous mail,
>>                                              I think one could
>>                                 simplify things a lot.
>>
>>                                              The HTML example from
>>                                 Tadej *could* look like this:
>>
>>                                              <html lang="en">
>>
>>                                                  <head>
>>
>>                                                     <meta
>>                                 charset="utf-8" />
>>
>> <title>Entity:
>>                                 Local Test</title>
>>
>>                                                  </head>
>>
>>                                                  <body>
>>
>> <p><span
>>
>> its-entity-type-ident-ref="**http:/nerd.eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place
>> <http://nerd.eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place><http://nerd.eurecom.fr/ontology#Place>
>> <http://nerd.eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place<http://nerd.eurecom.fr/ontology#Place>
>>
>>                                     "
>>
>> its-disambig-ident-ref="http:/**/dbpedia.org/resource/Dublin
>> <http://dbpedia.org/resource/Dublin><http://dbpedia.org/resource/Dublin>
>>                                 ">**Dublin</span>
>>                                              is the <span
>>
>> its-disambig-ident-ref="
>> http://www.w3.org/2006/03/wn/**wn20/instances/worsense-**
>> capital-noun-3<http://www.w3.org/2006/03/wn/wn20/instances/worsense-capital-noun-3>">capital</span>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                              of Ireland.</p>
>>
>>                                                  </body>
>>
>>                                              </html>
>>
>>                                              That is, no explicit
>>                                 "resource" references for entity
>>                                 type and
>>                                              disambiguation source,
>>                                 and no disambig-type.
>>
>>                                              Also, I think one could
>>                                 get rid of adding this kind of
>>                                              information via
>>                                              global rules - I really
>>                                 don't see a use case for that.
>>
>>                                              Tadej, others, thoughts?
>>                                 Maybe Yves as one of the
>>                                              implementors processing
>>                                              the output and other have
>>                                 some thoughts too?
>>
>>                                              Best,
>>
>>                                              Felix
>>
>>                                              2012/8/17 Sebastian 
>> Hellmann
>> <hellmann@informatik.uni-**leipzig.de
>> <http://leipzig.de><hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de
>> <mailto:hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de>>
>>                                 <mailto:hellmann@informatik.
>> <mailto:hellmann@informatik.>**uni-leipzig.de
>> <http://uni-leipzig.de><hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de
>> <mailto:hellmann@informatik.uni-leipzig.de>>
>>
>>
>>                                                  Dear Felix,
>>                                                  to solve this issue I
>>                                 prepared a page:
>> http://wiki.nlp2rdf.org/wiki/****DBpedia_Spotlight<http://wiki.nlp2rdf.org/wiki/**DBpedia_Spotlight>
>> <http://**wiki.nlp2rdf.org/wiki/DBpedia_**Spotlight
>> <http://wiki.nlp2rdf.org/wiki/DBpedia_**Spotlight><http://wiki.nlp2rdf.org/wiki/DBpedia_Spotlight>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                                  It is a rough draft,
>>                                 so there are many mistakes,
>>                                                  still. Once it is 
>> mature,
>>                                                  I will send it to the
>>                                 DBpedia Spotlight and Apache
>>                                                  Stanbol lists to get
>>                                                  their feedback.
>>                                                  Note that I don't
>>                                 have a problem with these properties
>>                                                  as XML attributes,
>>                                                  where they can
>>                                 naturally occur only once and encoding
>>                                                  an implicit
>>                                                  dependency (attribute
>>                                 refering to another attribute)
>>                                                  is unproblematic. They
>>                                                  are, however,
>>                                 difficult to handle in RDF, even when
>>                                                  declaring them
>>                                                  functional.
>>                                                  I will report back,
>>                                 if there are any news,
>>
>>                                                  All the best,
>>                                                  Sebastian
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                                  Am 14.08.2012 21:34,
>>                                 schrieb Felix Sasaki:
>>
>>                                                      Hi Sebastian, all,
>>
>>                                                      August is taking
>>                                 its tribute ... I am wondering if
>>                                                      there any 
>> thoughts on
>>                                                      Sebastian's mail
>>                                 below. It seems that some of the
>>                                                      proposed ITS
>>                                 attributes
>>                                                      are not needed,
>>                                 but I don't have the competence to
>>                                                      evaluate this.
>>                                 Thoughts
>>                                                      from others?
>>                                  Sebastian, could you confirm that
>>                                                      the output
>>                                 mentioned in
>>                                                      this other thread
>>
>> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/****Public/public-**multilingualweb-**<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/**Public/public-multilingualweb-**>
>> lt/2012Aug/0168.html<http://**lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/**
>> <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/**>
>> public-multilingualweb-lt/**2012Aug/0168.html<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-multilingualweb-lt/2012Aug/0168.html>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                                      is correct for
>>                                 NIF? I then would create a test
>>                                                      case for our test
>>                                 suite,
>>                                                      see
>>
>> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/****Public/public-**multilingualweb-**<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/**Public/public-multilingualweb-**>
>> lt-tests/2012Aug/0003.html<htt**p://lists.w3.org/Archives/**
>> <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/**>
>>
>> Public/public-multilingualweb-**lt-tests/2012Aug/0003.html<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-multilingualweb-lt-tests/2012Aug/0003.html>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                                      Thanks,
>>
>>                                                      Felix
>>
>>                                                      Am Donnerstag, 9.
>>                                 August 2012 schrieb Sebastian
>>                                                      Hellmann :
>>
>>                                                        Hi Felix,
>>
>>                                                          below mostly
>>                                 my opinion on this. Nothing,
>>                                                          wrong with
>>                                 including these
>> properties,
>>                                 but they might not make sense in
>>                                                          RDF. If you
>>                                 think, that
>>                                                          there
>>                                                          are people
>>                                 who would really use these
>> properties in
>>                                 RDF, then go ahead
>>                                                          and
>>                                                          include them.
>>                                 Personally, *I* wouldn't know
>>                                                          for what *I*
>>                                 could use them.
>>                                                          More comments
>>                                 inline.
>>
>>                                                          Am 09.08.2012
>>                                 15 <tel:09.08.2012%2015>
>>                                 <tel:09.08.2012%2015>:20,
>>                                                          schrieb Felix
>>                                 Sasaki:
>>
>>                                  its:entityTypeSourceRef
>>
>>                                                                I
>>                                 really do not find this property
>>                                 helpful.
>>
>>                                                          Do you see
>>                                 any sense in saying that
>> http://dbpedia.org/resource/******<http://dbpedia.org/resource/****>
>>                                                          Dublin
>> <http://dbpedia.org/resource/****Dublin<http://dbpedia.org/resource/**Dublin>
>>
>>                                     <http://dbpedia.org/**
>>
>> resource/Dublin
>> <http://dbpedia.org/resource/**Dublin<http://dbpedia.org/resource/Dublin>>>is
>>
>>
>>                                 from
>>
>>
>>                                 http://dbpedia.org ? In the linked
>>                                 data world
>>                                 http://dbpedia.org/resource/
>> **Dublin
>> <http://dbpedia.org/resource/****Dublin<http://dbpedia.org/resource/**Dublin>
>> <http://dbpedia.org/**resource/Dublin<http://dbpedia.org/resource/Dublin>>>
>>
>>                                                          comes from
>> http://dbpedia.org/resource/******Dublin<http://dbpedia.org/resource/****Dublin>
>> <http://dbpedia.org/**resource/**Dublin<http://dbpedia.org/resource/**Dublin>><
>>
>>
>>
>> http://dbpedia.org/resource/****Dublin<http://dbpedia.org/resource/**Dublin>
>> <http://dbpedia.org/**resource/Dublin<http://dbpedia.org/resource/Dublin>>>.
>>
>>
>>
>>                                                          So you might
>>                                 specify a way to convert that to
>>                                                          ITS, but we
>>                                 might not need
>>
>>                                                          an RDF
>>                                 property for this.
>>
>>                                 its:disambigType
>>
>> "(http://www.w3.org/2005/11/******its/lexicalConcept|
>> <http://www.w3.org/2005/11/******its/lexicalConcept%7C><http://www.w3.org/2005/11/****its/lexicalConcept%7C>
>> <http://www.w3.org/2005/11/******its/lexicalConcept%7C<http://www.w3.org/2005/11/****its/lexicalConcept%7C>
>>
>> <http:/**/www.w3.org/2005/11/**its/**lexicalConcept%7C
>> <http://www.w3.org/2005/11/**its/**lexicalConcept%7C><http://www.w3.org/2005/11/**its/lexicalConcept%7C>>
>>
>> <http://**www.w3.org/2005/11/**its/**lexicalConcept%7C
>> <http://www.w3.org/2005/11/**its/**lexicalConcept%7C><http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/**lexicalConcept%7C>
>> <http://www.w3.org/2005/11/**its/**lexicalConcept%7C<http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/**lexicalConcept%7C>
>>
>> <http:**//www.w3.org/2005/11/its/**lexicalConcept%7C
>> <http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/**lexicalConcept%7C><http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/lexicalConcept%7C>>
>>
>> http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/******ontologyConcept|http://**
>> <http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/******ontologyConcept%7Chttp://**>
>> www.**w3.**<http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/****ontologyConcept%7Chttp://www.**w3.**>
>> <http://www.w3.org/2005/11/**its/****ontologyConcept%**
>> 7Chttp://www.**w3.**<http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/****ontologyConcept%7Chttp://www.**w3.**>
>>
>> <http://**www.w3.org/2005/11/its/****ontologyConcept%7Chttp://www.**
>> <http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/****ontologyConcept%7Chttp://www.**>
>>
>> w3.**<http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/**ontologyConcept%7Chttp://www.w3.**>>
>>
>> org/2005/11/its/<http://www.****w3.org/2005/11/its/**
>> <http://w3.org/2005/11/its/**><http://w3.org/2005/11/its/**>
>> <http://w3.org/2005/11/its/**>
>> ontologyConcept%7Chttp://www.****w3.org/2005/11/its/
>> <http://w3.org/2005/11/its/>
>> <http://w3.org/2005/11/its/><h**ttp://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/**
>> <http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/**>
>> ontologyConcept%7Chttp://www.**w3.org/2005/11/its/
>> <http://w3.org/2005/11/its/><http://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/ontologyConcept%7Chttp://www.w3.org/2005/11/its/>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> entity)"
>>
>>                                                                I am
>>                                 unsure about this one.
>>
>>                                 its:entityTypeRef
>>                                                          is already
>>                                 rdf:type, so it would be a
>> duplicate to
>>                                 have its:entityTypeRef
>>                                                          in RDF. For
>> http://dbpedia.org/resource/******Dublin<http://dbpedia.org/resource/****Dublin>
>> <http://dbpedia.org/**resource/**Dublin<http://dbpedia.org/resource/**Dublin>>
>>
>> <http://dbpedia.org/****resource/Dublin<http://dbpedia.org/**resource/Dublin>
>> <http://**dbpedia.org/resource/Dublin
>> <http://dbpedia.org/resource/Dublin><http://dbpedia.org/resource/Dublin>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                  its:**entityTypeRef would be one of:
>>
>> http://dbpedia.org/ontology/******PopulatedPlace<http://dbpedia.org/ontology/****PopulatedPlace>
>> <http://**dbpedia.org/ontology/****PopulatedPlace
>> <http://dbpedia.org/ontology/****PopulatedPlace><http://dbpedia.org/ontology/**PopulatedPlace>>
>>
>> <http://dbpedia.**org/**ontology/PopulatedPlace<http:/**
>> /dbpedia.org/ontology/**PopulatedPlace
>> <http://dbpedia.org/ontology/**PopulatedPlace><http://dbpedia.org/ontology/PopulatedPlace>>
>>
>> http://dbpedia.org/ontology/******Settlement<http://dbpedia.org/ontology/****Settlement>
>> <http://dbpedia.**org/ontology/**Settlement<http://dbpedia.org/ontology/**Settlement>>
>>
>> <http://dbpedia.org/****ontology/Settlement<http://dbpedia.org/**ontology/Settlement>
>> <http://**dbpedia.org/ontology/**Settlement
>> <http://dbpedia.org/ontology/**Settlement><http://dbpedia.org/ontology/Settlement>>
>>
>> http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/******PopulatedPlace<http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/****PopulatedPlace>
>> <http://umbel.**org/umbel/rc/**PopulatedPlace<http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/**PopulatedPlace>>
>>
>> <http://umbel.**org/umbel/rc/**PopulatedPlace<http://umbel.**
>> org/umbel/rc/PopulatedPlace<http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/PopulatedPlace>>
>>
>> http://dbpedia.org/ontology/******Place<http://dbpedia.org/ontology/****Place>
>> <http://dbpedia.org/**ontology/**Place<http://dbpedia.org/ontology/**Place>><
>>
>>
>>
>> http://dbpedia.org/ontology/****Place<http://dbpedia.org/ontology/**Place>
>> <http://dbpedia.org/ontology/**Place<http://dbpedia.org/ontology/Place>
>> http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/******Village<http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/****Village>
>> <http://umbel.org/**umbel/rc/**Village<http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/**Village>><
>>
>>
>>
>> http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/****Village<http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/**Village>
>> <http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/**Village<http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/Village>
>> http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/******Location_Underspecified<http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/****Location_Underspecified>
>> <http:/**/umbel.org/umbel/rc/****Location_Underspecified
>> <http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/****Location_Underspecified><http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/**Location_Underspecified>>
>>
>> <http:/**/umbel.org/umbel/rc/**Location_**Underspecified
>> <http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/**Location_**Underspecified><http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/Location_**Underspecified>
>> <http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/**Location_**Underspecified<http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/Location_**Underspecified>
>>
>> <htt**p://umbel.org/umbel/rc/**Location_Underspecified
>> <http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/**Location_Underspecified><http://umbel.org/umbel/rc/Location_Underspecified>>
>>
>>                                 http://schema.org/Place
>> http://www.w3.org/2002/07/owl#******Thing<http://www.w3.org/2002/07/owl#****Thing>
>> <http://www.w3.org/**2002/07/owl#**Thing<http://www.w3.org/2002/07/owl#**Thing>>
>>
>> <http://www.w3.org/**2002/07/**owl#Thing<http://www.w3.org/**2002/07/owl#Thing>
>> <http://www.w3.org/**2002/07/owl#Thing<http://www.w3.org/2002/07/owl#Thing>>
>>
>> http://www.opengis.net/gml/_******Feature<http://www.opengis.net/gml/_****Feature>
>> <http://www.opengis.**net/gml/_**Feature<http://www.opengis.net/gml/_**Feature>>
>>
>> <http://www.opengis.**net/gml/**_Feature<http://www.opengis.**
>>                                 net/gml/_Feature
>> <http://www.opengis.net/gml/_Feature>>
>>                                                          +
>> http:/nerd.eurecom.fr/******ontology#Place
>> <http://nerd.eurecom.fr/******ontology#Place><http://nerd.eurecom.fr/****ontology#Place>
>> <http://nerd.eurecom.fr/******ontology#Place<http://nerd.eurecom.fr/****ontology#Place>
>>
>> <http://nerd.**eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place
>> <http://eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place><http://nerd.eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place>>
>>
>> <http://nerd.**eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place
>> <http://eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place><http://eurecom.fr/ontology#Place>
>> <http://eurecom.fr/ontology#**Place<http://eurecom.fr/ontology#Place>
>>
>> <http://nerd.eurecom.fr/**ontology#Place<http://nerd.eurecom.fr/ontology#Place>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                                          If you have a
>>                                 Problem with this plurality.
>>                                                          Then it might
>>                                 be good to
>>                                                          include an
>>                                 annotation property
>>                                 its:preferedEntityTypeRef
>>                                                          So the data
>>                                 is there already in RDF, the
>>                                                          problem is
>>                                 rather to find a way
>>                                                          to convert it
>>                                 back to ITS.
>>
>>                                                          All the best,
>> Sebastian
>>
>>
>>
>>                                                          Thanks,
>>
>>
>>                                                          Felix
>>
>> 2012/8/9
>>                                 Felix Sasaki <fsasaki@w3.org
>>                                 <mailto:fsasaki@w3.org>
>>                                  <mailto:fsasaki@w3.org
>> <mailto:fsasaki@w3.org>>>
>>
>> Thanks for
>>                                 this, Tadej, looks good. There
>>                                                          is just one
>>                                 comment I don't
>>                                                          see
>> reflected:
>>
>>                                                          7) A question
>>                                 on the data category in general
>>                                                          and the
>>                                 "rules" element:
>>                                                          does it make
>>                                 sense to make some attributes
>> mandatory?
>>                                 Currently, this
>>                                                          would
>>                                                          be valid:
>>                                  <its:disambiguation
>> selector="/text/body/p[@id='******dublin']/>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                                          It seems that
>>                                 still all metadata items /
>> attributes
>>                                 are optional. Is
>>                                                          there
>>                                                          a way to be
>>                                 more specific about what must or
>>                                                          must not
>>                                 appear together,
>>                                                          what
>>                                                          is optional 
>> etc?
>>
>>                                                          Best,
>>
>>                                                          Felix
>>
>> 2012/8/9
>>                                 Tadej Stajner <tadej.stajner@ijs.si
>> <mailto:tadej.stajner@ijs.si>
>>                                 <mailto:tadej.stajner@ijs.si
>> <mailto:tadej.stajner@ijs.si>>>
>>
>> Hi,
>> thanks
>>                                 for the tips. I covered them, and I
>>                                                          agree towards
>>                                 removing the
>>                                                          local XPath,
>>                                 since it has very limited use.
>>                                                          Here is
>>                                 another incorporating
>>                                                          all these
>>                                 comments.
>>                                                          -- Tadej
>>
>>                                                          On 8/3/2012
>>                                 1:07 PM, Felix Sasaki wrote:
>>
>>                                                          Hi Tadej, all,
>>
>> thanks a
>>                                 lot for this. Just a few comments
>>                                                          / questions:
>>
>>                                                              1) About
>>                                 "The information applies to the
>>                                                          textual
>>                                 content of the
>> element,
>>                                 including child elements and
>> attributes.":
>>                                 wouldn't it make more
>>                                                          sense to say
>>                                 that this applies to only the
>>                                                          content of
>>                                 the element? E.g.
>>                                                          if
>>                                                          you annotate
>>                                 the "span" element in
>>
>> <p>I have
>>                                 seen <span id="timbl"><span
>> class="firstame">Tim</span>
>> <span
>> class="lastname">Berners-Lee</******span></span>
>>
>>
>>                                                          in the
>>                                 olympics opening
>>
>>
>> ceremony</p>
>>
>>                                                              You want
>>                                 to express disambiguation
>> information
>>                                 about the "span"
>>                                                          element
>>                                                          with the "id"
>>                                 attribute, but not about the
>>                                                          "id"
>>                                 attribute or the nested
>>                                                          span
>>                                 elements. So inheritance probably should
>>                                                          be: "There 
>> is no
>> inheritance".
>>                                 What do you think?
>>
>>
>>                                                              2) About
>>                                 "The Entity data category can be
>> expressed
>>                                 with global rules,
>>                                                          or locally on
>>                                 an individual element.": This
>>                                                          should
>>                                 probably be "The
>>                                  Disambiguation data category can be
>>                                 expressed
>>                                                          with global
>>                                 rules, or
>>                                                          locally
>>                                                          on an
>>                                 individual element."
>>
>>                                                              3) About
>>                                 local markup: for other data
>> categories,
>>                                 we don't have the
>> "pointer"
>>                                 attributes as local markup, since
>> processing of
>>                                 XPath in local
>>                                                          markup can be
>>                                 very expensive. So I would
>>                                                          propose to
>>                                 drop the local
>>                                                          pointer
>> attributes
>>                                 here too.
>>
>>                                                              4) In the
>>                                 table at the end, "Global
>> pointing to
>>                                 existing information"
>>                                                          should be
>>                                 "yes" I think.
>>
>>                                                              5) This
>>                                 selector
>>                                  <its:disambiguation
>> selector="/text/body/p/#******dublin"
>>                                 ...
>>
>>                                                          In XPath
>>                                 should be
>>                                  <its:disambiguation
>> selector="/text/body/p[@id='******dublin']
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                                              6) To
>>                                 follow the conventions from other
>>                                                          data
>>                                 categories, the
>>                                  "its:disambiguation" element should
>>                                 probably
>>                                                          be called
>>                                  "its:disambiguationRule".
>>
>>                                                              7) A
>>                                 question on the data category in
>>                                                          general and
>>                                 the "rules" element:
>>                                                          does it make
>>                                 sense to make some attributes
>> mandatory?
>>                                 Currently, this
>>                                                          would
>>                                                          be valid:
>>                                  <its:disambiguation
>> selector="/text/body/p[@id='******dublin']/>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                                              8) A
>>                                 question to the others in this thread
>> (Guiseppe,
>>                                 Pablo, Raphael,
>> Sebastian):
>>                                 is this a representation that
>>                                                          makes sense
>>                                 to you and that
>>                                                          your
>>                                                          tools could
>>                                 produce?
>>
>>                                                              9) A
>>                                 question to the MT guys: is the way
>>                                                          "entity and
>>                                 disambiguation"
>> information
>>                                 is represented here useful for
>>                                 you?
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Felix
>>
>> 2012/8/3
>>                                 Tadej Štajner <tadej.stajner@ijs.si
>> <mailto:tadej.stajner@ijs.si>
>>                                 <mailto:tadej.stajner@ijs.si
>> <mailto:tadej.stajner@ijs.si>>>
>>
>>                                                             Hi,
>>                                                          I
>>                                 incorporated some comments that
>>                                 'entity' was
>>                                                          still
>>                                 conflated from
>>                                                          several
>>                                 distinct things in the data category
>> proposal. Now, we
>> distinguish
>>                                                          between
>>                                 disambiguation of word sense, ontology
>>                                                          concept and
>>                                 entity
>> instance.
>> Following
>>                                 that, it seems that 'Disambiguation'
>>                                                          was the
>>                                 better name for
>>                                                          the
>>                                                          data category.
>>
>>                                                          Thanks for
>>                                 everyone's input!
>>
>>                                                          -- Tadej
>>
>>                                                          On 02. 08.
>>                                 2012 17 <tel:02.%2008.%202012%2017>
>> <tel:02.%2008.%202012%2017>:**26,
>>                                 Tadej Štajner
>>
>>                                                          wrote:
>>
>> Apologies
>>                                 -- wrong link on the previous
>>                                                          mail. This is
>>                                 the relevant one:
>> http://www.w3.org/******International/multilingualweb/****<http://www.w3.org/****International/multilingualweb/**>
>> **lt/track/actions/181<http://**www.w3.org/**International/**
>> <http://www.w3.org/**International/**>
>> multilingualweb/**lt/track/**actions/181<http://www.w3.org/**International/multilingualweb/**lt/track/actions/181>>
>>
>> <http://**www.w3.org/**International/****multilingualweb/lt/track/**
>> <http://www.w3.org/**International/****multilingualweb/lt/track/**><http://www.w3.org/International/**multilingualweb/lt/track/**>
>> <http://www.w3.org/**International/****multilingualweb/lt/track/**<http://www.w3.org/International/**multilingualweb/lt/track/**>
>>
>> actions/181<http://www.w3.org/**International/multilingualweb/**
>> lt/track/actions/181<http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/track/actions/181>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                                          -- Tadej
>>
>>                                                          On 02. 08.
>>                                 2012 17 <tel:02.%2008.%202012%2017>
>> <tel:02.%2008.%202012%2017>:**22,
>>                                 Tadej Štajner
>>
>>                                                          wrote:
>>
>>                                                          Dipl. Inf.
>>                                 Sebastian Hellmann
>> Department of
>>                                 Computer Science, University of
>>                                                          Leipzig
>>                                                          Events:
>>                                                              *
>> http://sabre2012.infai.org/******mlode<http://sabre2012.infai.org/****mlode>
>> <http://sabre2012.infai.**org/**mlode<http://sabre2012.infai.org/**mlode>><
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> http://sabre2012.infai.org/****mlode<http://sabre2012.infai.org/**mlode>
>> <http://sabre2012.infai.org/**mlode<http://sabre2012.infai.org/mlode>
>>
>>                                         (Leipzig,
>>
>>                                                          Sept.
>>                                 23-24-25, 2012)
>>
>>                                                              *
>>                                 http://wole2012.eurecom.fr (*Deadline:
>>                                                          July 31st 
>> 2012*)
>> Projects:
>>                                 http://nlp2rdf.org ,
>>                                 http://dbpedia.org
>> Homepage:
>> http://bis.informatik.uni-****le**ipzig.de/SebastianHellmann
>> <http://ipzig.de/SebastianHellmann>
>> <http://ipzig.de/**SebastianHellmann<http://ipzig.de/SebastianHellmann>
>>
>> <http://**leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann
>> <http://leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann><http://leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann>>
>>
>> <htt**p://bis.informatik.uni-****leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann
>> <http://leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann>
>> <http://leipzig.de/**SebastianHellmann<http://leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann>
>>
>> <http://bis.**informatik.uni-leipzig.de/**SebastianHellmann
>> <http://informatik.uni-leipzig.de/**SebastianHellmann><http://bis.informatik.uni-leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann>>
>>
>> Research
>>                                 Group: http://aksw.org
>>
>>
>>
>>                                                  --
>>                                                  Dipl. Inf. Sebastian
>>                                 Hellmann
>>                                                  Department of
>>                                 Computer Science, University of Leipzig
>>                                                  Events:
>>                                                     *
>> http://sabre2012.infai.org/****mlode<http://sabre2012.infai.org/**mlode>
>>
>>
>> <http://sabre2012.infai.org/**mlode<http://sabre2012.infai.org/mlode>>(Leipzig,
>>                                 Sept.
>>                                                  23-24-25, 2012)
>>                                                     *
>>                                 http://wole2012.eurecom.fr (*Deadline:
>>                                 July 31st
>>                                                  2012*)
>>                                                  Projects:
>>                                 http://nlp2rdf.org , http://dbpedia.org
>>                                                  Homepage:
>> http://bis.informatik.uni-**le**ipzig.de/SebastianHellmann
>> <http://ipzig.de/SebastianHellmann><http://leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann>
>> <http://leipzig.de/**SebastianHellmann<http://leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann>
>>
>> <http://bis.**informatik.uni-leipzig.de/**SebastianHellmann
>> <http://informatik.uni-leipzig.de/**SebastianHellmann><http://bis.informatik.uni-leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann>>
>>
>>                                                  Research Group:
>>                                 http://aksw.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                          --         Dipl. Inf.
>>                                 Sebastian Hellmann
>>                                          Department of Computer
>>                                 Science, University of Leipzig
>>                                          Events:
>>                                            *
>> http://sabre2012.infai.org/**mlode<http://sabre2012.infai.org/mlode>(Leipzig,
>>                                 Sept. 23-24-25,
>>                                          2012)
>>                                            *
>>                                 http://wole2012.eurecom.fr (*Deadline:
>>                                 July 31st 2012*)
>>                                          Projects: http://nlp2rdf.org
>>                                 , http://dbpedia.org
>>                                          Homepage:
>>                                 http://bis.informatik.uni-**
>>                                 leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann
>> <http://leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann><http://bis.informatik.uni-leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann>
>>
>>
>>                                          Research Group: http://aksw.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                      --     Felix Sasaki
>>                                      DFKI / W3C Fellow
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                                 --
>>                                 ---
>>                                 Pablo N. Mendes
>>                                 http://pablomendes.com
>>                                 Events: http://wole2012.eurecom.fr
>> <http://wole2012.eurecom.fr/>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>                 --
>>                 Dipl. Inf. Sebastian Hellmann
>>                 Department of Computer Science, University of Leipzig
>>                 Events:
>>                    * http://sabre2012.infai.org/**mlode
>> <http://sabre2012.infai.org/mlode>(Leipzig, Sept.
>>                 23-24-25, 2012)
>>                    * http://wole2012.eurecom.fr (*Deadline: July 31st
>>                 2012*)
>>                 Projects: http://nlp2rdf.org , http://dbpedia.org
>>                 Homepage:
>> http://bis.informatik.uni-**leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann
>> <http://leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann><http://bis.informatik.uni-leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann>
>>                 Research Group: http://aksw.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>             --
>>             Felix Sasaki
>>             DFKI / W3C Fellow
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>     --     Dipl. Inf. Sebastian Hellmann
>>     Department of Computer Science, University of Leipzig
>>     Events:
>>       * http://sabre2012.infai.org/mlode (Leipzig, Sept. 23-24-25, 2012)
>>       * http://wole2012.eurecom.fr (*Deadline: July 31st 2012*)
>>     Projects: http://nlp2rdf.org , http://dbpedia.org
>>     Homepage: http://bis.informatik.uni-leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann
>>     Research Group: http://aksw.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Felix Sasaki
>> DFKI / W3C Fellow
>>
>
>


-- 
Dipl. Inf. Sebastian Hellmann
Department of Computer Science, University of Leipzig
Events:
* http://sabre2012.infai.org/mlode (Leipzig, Sept. 23-24-25, 2012)
* http://wole2012.eurecom.fr (*Deadline: July 31st 2012*)
Projects: http://nlp2rdf.org , http://dbpedia.org
Homepage: http://bis.informatik.uni-leipzig.de/SebastianHellmann
Research Group: http://aksw.org
Received on Monday, 24 September 2012 03:36:18 UTC

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