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Minutes: Low Vision Task Force 27 Apr 2017 telecon

From: Jim Allan <jimallan@tsbvi.edu>
Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2017 13:38:59 -0500
Message-ID: <CA+=z1WmwZw-R-=5SWOegiBwb6cRovJ7BS3gffqFUAczyZGphSw@mail.gmail.com>
To: public-low-vision-a11y-tf <public-low-vision-a11y-tf@w3.org>
source: https://www.w3.org/2017/04/27-lvtf-minutes.html

Low Vision Accessibility Task Force Teleconference 27 Apr 2017

See also: IRC log <http://www.w3.org/2017/04/27-lvtf-irc>
Attendees
Present allanj, steverep, Shawn, Marla, Laura, Wayne Regrets Glenda, Erich
Chair Jim Scribe allanj
Contents

   - Topics <https://www.w3.org/2017/04/27-lvtf-minutes.html#agenda>
      1. Resize Content
      <https://www.w3.org/2017/04/27-lvtf-minutes.html#item01>
      2. IDE <https://www.w3.org/2017/04/27-lvtf-minutes.html#item02>
      3. mobile devices and text resize
      <https://www.w3.org/2017/04/27-lvtf-minutes.html#item03>
      4. Adapting Text - color & font
      <https://www.w3.org/2017/04/27-lvtf-minutes.html#item04>
      5. Semantics. <https://www.w3.org/2017/04/27-lvtf-minutes.html#item05>
   - Summary of Action Items
   <https://www.w3.org/2017/04/27-lvtf-minutes.html#ActionSummary>
   - Summary of Resolutions
   <https://www.w3.org/2017/04/27-lvtf-minutes.html#ResolutionSummary>

------------------------------

<laura> Extra AGWG meeting on Thurs 27th April:
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-gl/2017AprJun/0341.html
Resize Content

https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/Resize_content_issues_review

<shawn> Alastair addressed some issues

laura: can we move 1.4.4 to A?

jim: would like to remove H-scrolling

shawn: this is our suggestion. depends on what AG decides about replacing
SC 2.0 vs 2.1

spatial layout, need a better definition

are video, tables, IDE exempt

wayne: IDEs should be included
... exempt tables and images, but not IDEs
... need semantic navigation

<scribe> scribe: allanj
IDE

ac: powerpoint online, slide and thumbnails - need all onscreen at same
time. Ok at 200%. but beyond things break. there are times when you need
many things on the screen at the same time
... maintain 200% for these . Google presentations works up to 200%. having
difficulty thinking how to make it work above 200

<laura> Resize Content Survey:
https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/NewSC_April25_2017/results#xq10

wd: computer aided design tools. useful to have tools available. but if you
need the entire screen for the work area. would be better to switch views
work area to tools, etc.

ac: toolbar on top and side, when you expand the work area diminishes.
... semantic navigation, and keyboard shortcuts are a different SC. complex
interfaces need other affordances that may allow linearization or greater
size of content.

wd: ms word, ribbon. always eliminate it and use the keyboard. want a
different kind of interface. hit alt expand ribbon to fill the screen, then
click on part of ribbon then that part expands

sr: zoom isn't the answer. you can pop the editor in wordpress to full
screen, and reduce it to see more tools.

ac: don't see how to word this in this SC. perhaps a Flexible interface SC

wd: drop disclaimer, just 400% without hz scrolling.

ac: would have to scope to text only.
mobile devices and text resize

screen width only in testing and understanding

<scribe> *ACTION:* jim to create definition of spatial layout for Text
Resize [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2017/04/27-lvtf-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-98 - Create definition of spatial layout for text
resize [on Jim Allan - due 2017-05-04].

<laura> Definition of spacial layout:
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/Resize_content_issues_review#Definition_of_spacial_layout

sr: make sure math is considered in spatial layout

ja: or understanding document

ac: math and svg work with media queries. presentation creation is
difficult on desktop.
... perhaps a note - putting IDEs in spatial layout category for now,
pending solutions

wd: +1

<shawn> ja: issue of OK if not work on mobile ...

wd: that is a technology bias.

ac: trace comment was about feasibility. there are no example of things
that are not feasible ... yet

discussion of contrast issue

sr: worried about doing research like that but not opposed (e.g.
peer-review, ranges of vision, what display is being used, etc.)
... worried about getting results we can't explain, would need vision
problems, display type, etc.
... would be better to have outside research, with a formal statement.

ac: understand. if there is other research we can use it. if we use
qualitative research - rather than quantitative with ranges and formal stats

wd: may be able to use text break points for reading. contrast may be
similar to acuity level - can perceive text but not read it.

ac: perhaps a honeypot question to really test if person could actually see
the content

wd: perhaps contrast limit. Legge - but he used a different scale would
need to convert.

ac: graphics contrast. need lots of examples in the understanding.
... main feedback on contrast levels. may impact criteria text
... other feed back on graphics objects. can cover in understanding with
pictures.
... please review
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/Resize_content_issues_review
message the list or Alastair directly with updates
Adapting Text - color & font

ack 2

close item 2

open item 1

wd: can calculate width of font. we can create an algorithm
... font family - need to be able to fit 10 to 15 character in fovea. have
a tight distribution of fonts.

<laura> Can the font metrics be incorporated into our spacing metrics?

<steverep> Gets to my point - what actually breaks by changing font that
doesn't break by changing spacing?

ac: so do we need to deal with fonts. if it is just spacing. can we change
the spacing, it should cover the font width issue.

<alastairc> steverep font-icons, but we could deal with that elsewhere.

<steverep> Well, technology independecne is still a big issue for Laura to
check her blood pressure on :)

wd: serif vs san-serif

sh: yes there is need to change the font. the point is if people change
font then things don't break. but this is covered by spacing. so we don't
mention fonts.

wd: concerned with fonts.

ac: can change most everything with css

wd: need inline semantics. should be covered in 1.3.1
... can live with not using fonts and using spacing for adapting text.

ac: 1.3.1 need to be a standardized way in some spec. to provide semantics
in ARIA or HTML

ja: icon fonts?

sh: need to file issue in specs HTML, ARIA

wd: need identify what things are.

lc: do we need to change the spacing to cover font width and letter spacing.

wd: the number are fine. there is spacing already added by font.

removing font family from Adapting Text SC text, because font width h is
very similar to letter spacing. we will address spacing and font family in
the understanding document.

*RESOLUTION: removing font family from Adapting Text SC text, because font
width is very similar to letter spacing. we will address spacing and font
family in the understanding document.*
Semantics.

sh: need to file an issue with HTML. need to have semantics for sprites,
and icon fonts
... should be marked as <img>

ac: things which are programmatically available but not visible (popups,
icon fonts, background images, sprites). May need an SC
... if you have a span with icon font, and a span with text. but change
font then object vanishes

sr: icon font, role=img, then aria label.

Issue: need to think about things which are programmatically available but
not visible (popups, icon fonts, background images, sprites). May need an
SC.

<trackbot> Created ISSUE-2 - Need to think about things which are
programmatically available but not visible (popups, icon fonts, background
images, sprites). may need an sc.. Please complete additional details at <
http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/track/issues/2/edit>.

<laura> Thanks everyone!

<laura> bye.

wd: sprites and other things break High Contrast mode.
... background image, sprites, and other things need inline semantics..

sr: need to get html or aria to require semantics.

we: they fit in 1.3.1, you are not using the appropriate role (semantics)
when include background images as sprites,

we need examples, pictures code.

trackbot, end meeting
Summary of Action Items *[NEW]* *ACTION:* jim to create definition of
spatial layout for Text Resize [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2017/04/27-lvtf-minutes.html#action01]

Summary of Resolutions

   1. removing font family from Adapting Text SC text, because font width
   is very similar to letter spacing. we will address spacing and font family
   in the understanding document.
   <https://www.w3.org/2017/04/27-lvtf-minutes.html#resolution01>

[End of minutes]

-- 
Jim Allan, Accessibility Coordinator
Texas School for the Blind and Visually Impaired
1100 W. 45th St., Austin, Texas 78756
voice 512.206.9315    fax: 512.206.9264  http://www.tsbvi.edu/
"We shape our tools and thereafter our tools shape us." McLuhan, 1964
Received on Thursday, 27 April 2017 18:39:37 UTC

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