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Re: Fullwidth/upright vertical characters in Mongolian

From: Liang Hai <lianghai@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 28 Feb 2017 19:12:23 +0800
To: Andrew West <andrewcwest@gmail.com>
Cc: Martin J. Dürst <duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp>, r12a <ishida@w3.org>, public-i18n-mongolian@w3.org
Message-Id: <d9661869-8cc8-4773-b07b-06daf6ad14e2@gmail.com>
@Martin, and cc @Andrew.
Yeah, the LTR horizontal way is basically the only solution with which you can embed Mongolian in LTR horizontal text without totally messing up line spacing, therefore texts that involve a lot embedded Mongolian (eg, textbooks) usually choose this way, especially when they target foreign audience.
However, Mongolian native users do have a strong preference of keeping Mongolian text TTB vertical whenever they can. I t's a strong requirement to have an option (even the default option) to embed Mongolian vertically in horizontal text, especially when the targeted audience is multilingual Mongolian native users.
I did some inline CSS in a doc generated from Markdown to achieve this: http://www.unicode.org/L2/L2017/17052-mongolian-cmt.pdf
---
Off the off-topic — I consider it's dangerous for Mongolian users not to promote a horizontal variant today when they use the only script that requires vertical writing; see this book for a nice study about writing Mongolian horizontally: https://issuu.com/lianghai/docs/mong__ol___s__g-__n_k__ndelen_tig-_
---
Also, it's an interesting topic to consider how RTL scripts should be embedded in TTB Mongolian. Or even, should Mongolian be sometimes embedded RTL in horizontal text? :P
梁海 Liang Hai https://lianghai.github.io
On Tue, Feb 28, 2017 at 18:46, Andrew West <andrewcwest@gmail.com> wrote:
Martin,

In printed books and articles Mongolian text embedded in horizontal
text (English, French, Russian, Chinese, ...) is usually rotated and
laid out horizontally left-to-right. This has the advantage that line
spacing is not affected, but has the disadvantage that it is not so
easy to read.

On the English Wikipedia we embed Mongolian text vertically into
English text, breaking the Mongolian text into words at a space
character so that the line spacing is not affected more than
necessary. For example, in the article
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongolian_script the Mongolian words
ᠮᠣᠩᠭᠣᠯ ᠪᠢᠴᠢᠭ are embedded vertically in two adjacent columns in the
first sentence of the English text. I'm not really sure what more
there is to say about this.

Andrew



On 28 February 2017 at 09:52, Martin J. Dürst <duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp> wrote:
> On 2017/02/28 04:49, r12a wrote:
>>
>> On 25/01/2017 07:13, Liang Hai wrote:
>>>
>>> Off topic:
>>>
>>> This discussion reminds me of Mongolian users' need of setting
>>> Mongolian text word-by-word vertically in horizontal text. Is there
>>> already some recommendation or ongoing discussion on that?
>>
>>
>>
>> Not that i'm aware of, yet.
>
>
> Interesting. The only book (in French actually) I have that uses Mongolian
> in horizontal text does so by turning the text sidewise. So I assumed that
> that's the usual way to typeset such a combination. But it may be quite
> difficult to read.
>
> Regards, Martin.
>
Received on Tuesday, 28 February 2017 11:13:21 UTC

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