Re: 3.11 A page's overall vertical scrollbar (WAS: RE: Implementation status of "Additional Requirements for Bidi in HTML")

Some followups on this vertical scroll bar issue.

I created a test page for this -> http://www.w3.org/People/kennyluck/Test/bidi-scrollbar

Tested under FF4b7, FF3.6 and IE9Platform on Windows all zh-tw(LTR)  
localized version. L indicates vertical scroll on the left side. R is  
similar.

FF3.6
page overall: R
<textarea>: R
<div>: R
RTL in <iframe>: R
LTR in <iframe>: R
<textarea dir="ltr" style="text-aligh:right;">: R

FF4b7
page overall: R
<textarea>: L
<div>: L
RTL in <iframe>: R
LTR in <iframe>: R
<textarea dir="ltr" style="text-aligh:right;">: R

So a large part of 3.12 in "Additional Requirements for Bidi in HTML"  
is solved by the patch for Bug556363 of Gecko.[1]

IE9
page overall: L
<textarea>: L
<div>: L
RTL in <iframe>: L
LTR in <iframe>: R
<textarea dir="ltr" style="text-aligh:right;">: R

Is the following expected behavior correct based on "Additional  
Requirements for Bidi in HTML" and the clarification in [2]?

expected behavior
page overall: R
<textarea>: L
<div>: L
RTL in <iframe>: L
LTR in <iframe>: R
<textarea dir="ltr" style="text-aligh:right;">: (undefined)


> 3.12 The vertical scrollbar of an element below <body> should be on  
> the "end" side relative to the element's direction
> Bug 454420 filed on Mozilla and still active

If I understand it correctly Bug 454420 [3] is mainly for 3.11 and I  
don't think that bug issue addresses much of the <iframe> part of 3.12.


[1] https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=556363
[2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-bidi/2010AprJun/0028
[3] https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=454420


> It seems to me that since scrollbar position is legitimately out of  
> scope for both CSS and HTML, we need to cover it in a new W3C  
> document of "recommendations" for user agent implementors.
>

>
> On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 8:49 AM, Ehsan Akhgari <ehsan@mozilla.com>  
> wrote:
> I'm not positive that this would get accepted into the CSS spec.   
> There are user agents today which do not use scrollbars as scrolling  
> mechanisms, so I honestly am rethinking whether this makes sense as  
> a CSS proposal at all...

Although "scroll" is defined in CSS in a general sense, "scrollbar" is  
probably not. I think it makes certain sense to have in css3-ui  
something like 'scrollbar-position' where the default value is an  
'auto' which matches what's described in "Additional Requirements for  
Bidi in HTML" .

css3-ui lists "The appearance, styling and coloring of scrollbars" as  
potential new feature in future version[4] so it looks like a good  
place to go. Of course devices in which there's no concept of  
"scrollbar" would just ignore the value of 'scrollbar-position'.

[4] http://dev.w3.org/csswg/css3-ui#scope



Side question, should the "vertical scrollbar on the left" behavior  
depends on 'direction' or 'text-align' (re. the last example of my  
test page)? I think it makes sense if this behavior relates to 'text- 
align' but not 'direction', but this is not implemented in IE. I doubt  
there ever exists any LTR site with 'text-align:right' and overflowed  
content, so changing this probably won't break too many things.


Cheers,
Kenny

Received on Thursday, 16 December 2010 02:18:00 UTC