- From: <bugzilla@jessica.w3.org>
- Date: Mon, 04 Apr 2011 10:50:25 +0000
- To: public-html-bugzilla@w3.org
http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=12413
Summary: Handling of <table border=0> is incompatible with the
Web
Product: HTML WG
Version: unspecified
Platform: All
URL: http://dev.w3.org/html5/spec/rendering.html#decohints
OS/Version: All
Status: NEW
Severity: normal
Priority: P3
Component: HTML5 spec (editor: Ian Hickson)
AssignedTo: ian@hixie.ch
ReportedBy: xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no
QAContact: public-html-bugzilla@w3.org
CC: mike@w3.org, public-html-wg-issue-tracking@w3.org,
public-html@w3.org
(Relates to ISSUE-155/Bug 7468 - not sure if it shoudl be described as "depends
on".)
ISSUE-155 does not try to change HTML5's Rendering section w.r.t. <table>.
However, while working with ISSUE-155, it become clear that HTML5 is out of
tune with the Web even rendering wise: As <table border="0"> is frequently used
on existing layout tables, HTML5's Rendering section is simply incompatible
with the Web when it suggest to render any table with the @border attribute
present (even when its value is "0") with a 1px border.
This is HTML5's style rule for tables with the border attribute:
http://dev.w3.org/html5/spec/rendering.html#decohints
table[border] > tr > td, table[border] > tr > th,
table[border] > thead > tr > td, table[border] > thead > tr > th,
table[border] > tbody > tr > td, table[border] > tbody > tr > th,
table[border] > tfoot > tr > td, table[border] > tfoot > tr > th {
border-width: 1px;
}
Effectively, this means that <table border="0"> is to be treated as <table
border="1">.
Use agents: no user agents treats border="0" like that. (Tested in: Webkit
[current last version], Opera 11, Firefox 4)
History - HTML4:
* HTML4 says that table@border with an empty value (border="") or a
non-digital value (border="border") for compatibility reasons should be treated
like border="1". And except for a few bugs, user agents do follow HTML4: empty
@border and @border="border" *is* equal to border="1". Thus HTML5 is not
incompatible with whether user agents nor *this* part of of HTML4.
* However, HTML4 does also say that border="0" is equal to not using the
@border attribute at all. And not only HTML4, but also the "real Web" (user
agents and Web authors) do treat border="0" as equal to no @border attribute.
THus, HTML5 deviates from "the Web" when it suggest to see border=0 as
border=1.
Examples of layout tables in the wild which contains border="0", easily found
via Google:
* http://www.ist-inc.com
* Any layout-table based Web page produced by Freeway
(http://www.softpress.com), including the 2011 release
(Freeway has a table layout mode in addition to "normal" mode.)
* http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Documentation/
*
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Documentation/OOoAuthors_User_Manual/Writer_Guide/Using_tables_for_page_layout
* http://www.linuxquestions.org/
* http://www.shire.net/learnwebdesign/nocss/tables1.htm
*
http://www.at.ufl.edu/_archive/accessibility_cd/AccWeb/tables/layout_tables.html
* http://www.thewebseye.com/using-tables.htm
Tutorials of layout tables are probably few, since it is a frown-upon thing,
but those pages who explain it, often suggest user of border="0":
* http://www.w3schools.com/html/html_layout.asp
* http://html.cita.illinois.edu/style/layout/layout-example.php
* http://www.quackit.com/html/tutorial/html_layouts.cfm
* http://www.shire.net/learnwebdesign/nocss/tables1.htm
* http://www.thewebseye.com/using-tables.htm
Proposed fix of HTML5: Simply add one more style rule for border="0", after
the current style rule:
table[border=0] > tr > td, table[border=0] > tr > th,
table[border=0] > thead > tr > td, table[border=0] > thead > tr > th,
table[border=0] > tbody > tr > td, table[border=0] > tbody > tr > th,
table[border=0] > tfoot > tr > td, table[border=0] > tfoot > tr > th {
border-width: 0;
}
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Received on Monday, 4 April 2011 10:50:33 UTC