- From: Harry Halpin <hhalpin@ibiblio.org>
- Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 14:13:49 -0400
- To: Jeremy Carroll <jjc@hpl.hp.com>
- Cc: ogbujic@ccf.org, GRDDL Working Group <public-grddl-wg@w3.org>
I'll just add this to the agenda as a re-approve - it appears to have just been a cut and paste buffer mishap - as I'm making the new agenda now... Jeremy Carroll wrote: > > > I note a problem with > > the approval for > http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#sq2 > > i.e. > [[ > scribe: http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#inline > > <HarryH> PROPOSAL: > http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#inline is a > valid test for test-case document. > > <HarryH> RESOLVED: > http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#inline is a > valid test for test-case document. > > scribe:http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#sq2 > > scribe:the ns document is served as application/rdf+xml (no > controversy there) > > <HarryH> PROPOSED: > http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#inline is a > valid test for test-case document. > > <HarryH> RESOLVED: > http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#inline is a > valid test for test-case document. > ]] > > The scribe comments are what I remember - we approved > http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#inline > and then > http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#sq2 > > the chair seems to have typed in the same URI twice. > > I would be happy either to approve the minutes as is, and vote again > on #sq2, or to have the minutes modified. > > Jeremy > > > > Chimezie Ogbuji wrote: >> .. attached .. >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> W3C <http://www.w3.org/> >> >> >> GRDDL Working Group Weekly Teleconference >> >> >> 11 Apr 2007 >> >> See also: IRC log <http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-irc> >> >> >> Attendees >> >> Present >> john-l, HarryH, Chimezie_Ogbuji, FabienG, +0127368aaaa, jjc, >> briansuda, rreck, DanC >> Regrets >> IanD >> Simone >> Chair >> HarryH >> Scribe >> Chime >> >> >> Contents >> >> * Topics <#agenda> >> 1. Convene GRDDL WG meeting of 2007-04-10T11:00-0400 <#item01> >> 2. GRDDL Spec: pending editorial work <#item02> >> 3. Test Cases: Towards Last Call <#item03> >> 4. issue-http-header-links <#item04> >> 5. base case GRDDL rule and application/xml documents <#item05> >> 6. GRDDL Spec: pending editorial work <#item06> >> * Summary of Action Items <#ActionSummary> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> >> Convene GRDDL WG meeting of 2007-04-10T11:00-0400 >> >> <HarryH> PROPOSED: to approve GRDDL WG Weekly --4 April 2007 as a >> true record >> >> <HarryH> So note the real minutes are here: >> >> <HarryH> >> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-grddl-wg/2007Apr/att-0039/04-grddl-wg-minutes.html >> >> >> <HarryH> RESOLVED : approved GRDDL WG Weekly --4 April 2007 as a true >> record >> >> <HarryH> Reck will be scribe next meeting. >> >> <HarryH> Jeremy? >> >> <HarryH> Jeremy can scribe next meeting. >> >> >> GRDDL Spec: pending editorial work >> >> <HarryH> DanC? >> >> <HarryH> Without DanC, I suggest we move to Test Cases. >> >> >> Test Cases: Towards Last Call >> >> scribe: >> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-grddl-wg/2007Apr/0031.html >> >> scribe: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#projectsSpreadsheet >> >> >> input: http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/projects.xml >> >> outpu: http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/projects.rdf >> >> scribe:prior approval: >> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-grddl-wg/2006Nov/att-0096/22-grddl-wg-minutes.html#item03 >> >> >> <HarryH> PROPOSAL: Approve >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#projectsSpreadsheet >> as a valid test for test-case document. >> >> <HarryH> RESOLVED: Approved >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#projectsSpreadsheet >> as a valid test for test-case document. >> >> jjc: prefer test approval for material, and review WD as a whole >> (with test text) >> >> john-l: same preference >> >> <HarryH> *ACTION:* john-l to add text to >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#projectsSpreadsheet >> [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action01] >> >> <HarryH> *ACTION:* john-l is to add text to any tests many text where >> deemed appropriate. [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action02] >> >> Remaining tests with prior approval: >> >> scribe: http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#atomttl1 >> >> scribe: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#xmlWithGrddlAttribute >> >> >> <HarryH> PROPOSED: To reapprove in bulk all tests with prior approval. >> >> <HarryH> RESOLVED: all tests with prior approval approved. >> >> scribe: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#base-param >> >> <HarryH> PROPOSED: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#base-param as >> a valid test for test-case document. >> >> <HarryH> RESOLVED: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#base-param as >> a valid test for test-case document. >> >> scribe:http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#rdfa1 >> >> HarryH: we should approve this noting that the stylesheet may be updated >> >> FabienG: 1) difference btwn implementation 2) RDFa spec is not stable >> >> jjc: text should reflect that the transform does not reflect a >> general RDFa transform >> >> FabienG: works fine WRT the test case >> >> FabienG: should the transform predicate be included in the output? >> >> FabienG: at F2F - the transform is ignored >> >> <HarryH> PROPOSAL: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#rdfa1 as a >> valid test for test-case document. >> >> <HarryH> *ACTION:* john-l to make sure rdfa1 test case text reflects >> current state of rdfa [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action03] >> >> <HarryH> APPROVED: Given caveat about current state of rdfa, >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#rdfa1 as a >> valid test for test-case document. >> >> scribe: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#title_author >> >> <HarryH> PROPOSAL: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#title_author >> is a valid test for test-case document. >> >> <HarryH> RESOLVED: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#title_author >> is a valid test for test-case document. >> >> scribe: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#multiprofile >> >> scribe:<head profile="http://purl.org/NET/erdf/profile >> >> <HarryH> PROPOSAL: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#multiprofile >> is a valid test for test-case document. >> >> scribe:>http://www.w3.org/2006/03/hcard"> >> >> jjc: possibility that changes to the profile effected validity of output >> >> <john-l> +1 >> >> jjc: we should copy these profiles to our test repository >> >> <john-l> (+1 to that, rather) >> >> jjc: would like to see the test modified in that regard >> >> <HarryH> *ACTION:* jjc to do modify >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#multiprofile >> to keep all profiles in W3C space. [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action04] >> >> <jjc> ^W3C^GRDDL WG^ >> >> scribe: http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#inline >> >> <HarryH> PROPOSAL: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#inline is a >> valid test for test-case document. >> >> <HarryH> RESOLVED: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#inline is a >> valid test for test-case document. >> >> scribe:http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#sq2 >> >> scribe:the ns document is served as application/rdf+xml (no >> controversy there) >> >> <HarryH> PROPOSED: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#inline is a >> valid test for test-case document. >> >> <HarryH> RESOLVED: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#inline is a >> valid test for test-case document. >> >> <HarryH> Chime: What all the controversial ones have is a "multiple >> output" sort of one. >> >> scribe: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#multiple-output >> >> scribe:the tests with maximal results are less ambiguous >> >> jjc: for the langconneg ppl probably pass the english version but not >> the german version >> >> jjc: is there a maximal result of the merge of the english and german >> GRDDL results? >> >> scribe:to calculate the maximal result, dont yo uneed to know the >> accept headers up front? >> >> jjc: technically possible >> >> <DanC_lap> (I'd be happy to leave the german test in the someday pile.) >> >> scribe: not neccessary for testing phase >> >> <DanC_lap> (actually, the IETF rules is included in W3C process, as a >> SHOULD) >> >> <DanC_lap> (is discussion of our request for CR/PR on the agenda?) >> >> <jjc> (transparent content negotiation) >> >> scribe: http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#xinclude >> >> jjc: Jena reader passes the noxinclude version >> >> scribe: >> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-grddl-comments/2007AprJun/0010.html >> >> >> scribe:[[[ >> >> * http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/#noxinclude failed >> >> ok: since raptor does do xinclude processing this is ok to fail >> >> ]]] >> >> <HarryH> (I'm happy to discuss CR/PR is we have time. In particular, >> as soon as I get EARL from Jena I'll make an implementation report, >> but I need Jena's results and the precise number of tests to be >> approved) >> >> <jjc> EARL from Jena this week ... hopefully >> >> HarryH: as long as implementations pass noxinclude I'm happy >> >> jjc: agrees.. but we need enough evidence >> >> scribe: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#noxinclude >> >> <HarryH> PROPOSAL: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#xinclude is a >> valid test for test-case document. >> >> <HarryH> PROPOSAL: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#xinclude and >> ihttp://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#noxinclude as >> a valid test for test-case document. >> >> <DanC_lap> is the .html on purpose? >> >> <HarryH> PROPOSAL: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests#xinclude and >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests#noxinclude as a >> valid test for test-case document. >> >> <DanC_lap> 2nd >> >> <HarryH> For previous resolutsions regards tests s/.html// >> >> <DanC_lap> yes, s/.html#/#/g in resolutions of this meeting >> >> <HarryH> APPROVED: >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests#xinclude and >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests#noxinclude as a >> valid test for test-case document. >> >> scribe: http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests#grddlonrdf1 >> >> scribe: http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests#grddlonrdf2 >> >> scribe: http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests#grddlonrdf3 >> >> scribe:if a test passes the third, can it assume it has passed the >> others? >> >> scribe:the maximal result is not isomorphic with the others >> >> <DanC_lap> (tests don't assume anything; they're not thinking things) >> >> <HarryH> \me asks DanC - can you take over chairing at noon? I still >> have these meetings at noon on Wed. till early May :( >> >> jjc: issues with the test text >> >> <DanC_lap> chairing... tricky... perhaps, if we start making the >> transition 10 minutes before you need to go. >> >> scribe:so is "However, for the purpose of running these tests in >> order to determine compliance, a GRDDL-aware agent with a security >> policy which does not prevent it from applying transformations >> identified by each test will produce the GRDDL result associated with >> each normative test. >> >> scribe:" authoritative? >> >> jjc: happy to approve number 3, and modify text of 1-2 >> >> <jjc> no delete 1-2 >> >> <jjc> annd modify text of 3 >> >> <HarryH> Note that I can't right CR transition till our test cases >> are fairly stable, so this test approval process is quite important. >> >> <DanC_lap> you can start on the CR request at any time, harry. I find >> it's often good to work backwards from the goal >> >> <DanC_lap> or perhaps somebody else can start on the CR request >> >> <HarryH> *ACTION:* Chime and john-l to remove non-maximal tests with >> ones with security relevancy. [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action06] >> >> <DanC_lap> action -5 >> >> jjc: issues with general conneg and what the 'maximal' result is >> >> <HarryH> *ACTION:* HarryH to start working on CR/PR transition report >> for GRDDL Spec. [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action07] >> >> jjc: would like to see the merge as a seperate test for conneg >> >> <jjc> *ACTION:* jjc to produce/check merge results involving content >> negotiation [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action08] >> >> >> issue-http-header-links >> >> <HarryH> I'm happy to drop this. >> >> <HarryH> I'm happy to e-mail IanD and ask him to drop this. >> >> <DanC_lap> WITHDRAWN. it falls to the someday pile. bonus points to >> anybody who picks this up and makes progress on it. >> >> >> base case GRDDL rule and application/xml documents >> >> scribe: >> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-grddl-comments/2007AprJun/0010.html >> >> >> scribe:[[[ >> >> I do notice http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/sq1ns >> >> is not of the RDF mime type, should it really be handled >> >> as RDF/XML? >> >> ]]] >> >> <DanC_lap> DanC: this WG decided that the answer is yes, IIRC. >> >> scribe:does this require the GRDDL-aware agent to attempt to parse >> all source documents as RDF/XML? >> >> <HarryH> I thought there was a rule about this sort of sniffing. >> >> <john-l> All application/xml source documents... >> >> <HarryH> I.e. look for rdf:RDF. >> >> scribe:the spec doesn't speak about media-type >> >> scribe:just 'conforming RDF/XML' >> >> <john-l> But if it's conforming RDF/XML, then it must also be XML, so >> anything that's not in an XML media type could not be a conforming >> RDF/XML document. >> >> scribe:RDF/XML spec doesn't define conformance by anything other than >> the content not the media-type over the wire >> >> <HarryH> In which case we're okay as regards RDF/XML. >> >> <HarryH> So, one can serve RDF/XML as application/xml and still >> interpret it as RDF. >> >> <HarryH> We might want to bring this up explicitly in informative text. >> >> <HarryH> However, we should remember that we don't want to tie the >> spec to RDF/XML. >> >> <DanC_lap> the relevant WG decision is under feb 7 under >> http://www.w3.org/2004/01/rdxh/spec#issue-mt-ns >> >> <jjc> >> http://www.w3.org/TR/rdf-syntax-grammar/#section-grammar-productions >> >> scribe: discussion continues on what RDF/XML 'conformance' is .. >> >> <DanC_lap> "If an information resource IR is represented by a >> conforming RDF/XML document[RDFX], then the RDF graph represented by >> that document is a GRDDL result of IR" >> >> <HarryH> What if IR is in N3? >> >> <HarryH> Sorry for asking the question :( >> >> <HarryH> It's a real edge-case. >> >> <DanC_lap> then the premise of that rule isn't satisfied and you >> gotta look elsewhere, Harry >> >> <HarryH> Hmmm... >> >> <DanC_lap> <foo/> >> >> <HarryH> Is there a notion of RDF conformance that isn't tied to >> RDF/XML? >> >> DanC_lap: is a conforming RDF/XML document >> >> <DanC_lap> <foo xmlns="http://example/vocab" /> >> >> <HarryH> I'll just have to re-read the spec and look for >> this...anyways, feel free to ignore my comments as I'm not on the phone. >> >> <jjc> If an information resource IR is represented by a conforming >> RDF/XML document[RDFX], then the RDF graph represented by that >> document is a GRDDL result of IR. >> >> <john-l> What about what >> http://www.w3.org/TR/rdf-syntax-grammar/#section-grammar-productions >> about application/rdf+xml? >> >> scribe:http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests#sq1 >> >> <DanC_lap> DanC nominates jjc to review this sq1 test >> >> <DanC_lap> JJC: sq1 is not problematic; it bears the rdf:RDF root >> element >> >> <DanC_lap> ... or... hmm... >> >> <DanC_lap> (the TAG concurred with the idea that the root element >> namespace URI works as an alternative to a MIME type decl) >> >> <HarryH> +` root element namespace URI working as an alternatie to >> MIME type. >> >> <HarryH> +1 >> >> <DanC_lap> *ACTION:* JohnL to draft refinement to "If an information >> resource IR is represented by a conforming RDF/XML document[RDFX], >> then the RDF graph represented by that document is a GRDDL result of >> IR" to be clear that "some other means", for our purposes, is a >> namespace on the root elt [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action09] >> >> >> GRDDL Spec: pending editorial work >> >> <DanC_lap> DanC collects advice on the xml pi appendix >> >> <DanC_lap> ADJOURN >> >> >> Summary of Action Items >> >> *[NEW]* *ACTION:* Chime and john-l to remove non-maximal tests with >> ones with security relevancy. [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action06] >> *[NEW]* *ACTION:* HarryH to start working on CR/PR transition report >> for GRDDL Spec. [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action07] >> *[NEW]* *ACTION:* jjc to do modify >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#multiprofile >> to keep all profiles in W3C space. [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action04] >> *[NEW]* *ACTION:* jjc to produce/check merge results involving >> content negotiation [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action08] >> *[NEW]* *ACTION:* john-l is to add text to any tests many text where >> deemed appropriate. [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action02] >> *[NEW]* *ACTION:* john-l to add text to >> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/grddl-wg/td/grddl-tests.html#projectsSpreadsheet >> [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action01] >> *[NEW]* *ACTION:* john-l to make sure rdfa1 test case text reflects >> current state of rdfa [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action03] >> *[NEW]* *ACTION:* JohnL to draft refinement to "If an information >> resource IR is represented by a conforming RDF/XML document[RDFX], >> then the RDF graph represented by that document is a GRDDL result of >> IR" to be clear that "some other means", for our purposes, is a >> namespace on the root elt [recorded in >> http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html#action09] >> >> [End of minutes] >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> Minutes formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl >> <http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/%7Echeckout%7E/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm> >> version 1.128 (CVS log <http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/>) >> $Date: 2007/04/11 16:28:35 $ >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> >> Scribe.perl diagnostic output >> >> [Delete this section before finalizing the minutes.] >> >> This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.128 of Date: 2007/02/23 21:38:13 >> Check for newer version at >> http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ >> <http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/%7Echeckout%7E/2002/scribe/> >> >> Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) >> >> No ScribeNick specified. Guessing ScribeNick: chimezie >> Found Scribe: Chime >> Default Present: john-l, HarryH, Chimezie_Ogbuji, FabienG, >> +0127368aaaa, jjc, briansuda, rreck, DanC >> Present: john-l HarryH Chimezie_Ogbuji FabienG +0127368aaaa jjc >> briansuda rreck DanC >> Regrets: IanD >> >> WARNING: No meeting title found! >> You should specify the meeting title like this: >> <dbooth> Meeting: Weekly Baking Club Meeting >> >> Got date from IRC log name: 11 Apr 2007 >> Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2007/04/11-grddl-wg-minutes.html >> People with action items: chime harryh is jjc john-l johnl >> >> WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. >> You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option. >> >> >> >> [End of scribe.perl >> <http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/%7Echeckout%7E/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm> >> diagnostic output] > -- -harry Harry Halpin, University of Edinburgh http://www.ibiblio.org/hhalpin 6B522426
Received on Tuesday, 17 April 2007 18:14:02 UTC