Re: EOCred: name search for credentialing organization

Hugh, I don't think you are missing the point. Phil refers to the
"parallel" in the IMS Open Badges spec between an instance of "Badge Class"
describing the attributes of a credential and the related "Assertion" class
describing the attributes of specific awards of the badge including the
identity of the those earning it. As a modeling issue, it also shares
characteristics with Course and CourseInstance.

While we decided early on that the focus here was on description of the
credential and not on the thing awarded, we need to be mindful that the
distinction exists and is significant.  We may even find we want to revisit
that decision before we are done. If so, then maintaining distinctions
between properties like "offeredBy" and "issuedBy" could be very important.

On Mon, Mar 26, 2018 at 10:29 AM, Hugh Paterson III <sil.linguist@gmail.com>
wrote:

> issuedBy vs. offeredBy
> The terms themselves indicate a semantics to me that seems to indicate
> that the issuedBy property appears on a credential already earned or
> awarded, whereas offering is what is currently offered by a granting
> institution. The University of Nottingham may stop offering a Ph.D in
> Electrical Engineering. Earners of Ph.D's  have an issuedby property, where
> as an aggregation of current offerings of Ph.Ds in Electrical Engineering
> would not include The University of Nottingham.
>
> Am I missing the point of the question at hand?
> - Hugh
>
> On Mon, Mar 26, 2018 at 8:44 AM, Phil Barker <phil.barker@pjjk.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
>> I think it depends on whether the distinction between offering and
>> issuing is going to be important.
>>
>> For example a credential might be offered by several organizations and it
>> might be important to know which of those had issued a specific instance.
>> That's a bit hypothetical, I have no strong feel for how often such a
>> distinction would matter in practice (or even if it really happens).
>>
>> issuedBy also has the merit of being simpler, more direct.
>>
>> Phil
>>
>> On 26/03/18 16:29, Vicki Tardif wrote:
>>
>> I think using "offers" works for the use case of understanding which
>> organizations offer a particular credential, but does this work as well for
>> the eventual use case of "Person X earned Credential Y from Organization
>> Z"?
>>
>> If "issuedBy" works better for the latter, maybe we should also use it
>> for this use case.
>>
>> - Vicki
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 26, 2018 at 9:04 AM, Phil Barker <phil.barker@pjjk.co.uk>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Looking through the use cases
>>> <https://www.w3.org/community/eocred-schema/wiki/Use_Cases#Name_search_for_credentialing_organization>
>>> for Educational Occupational Credentials in schema.org, I see we have
>>> one for
>>>
>>> Name search for credentialing organization
>>>
>>> It should be possible to search and find credentials by the name of the
>>> credentialing organization.
>>> *Requires:* ability to show relationship between educational /
>>> occupational credential objects and descriptions or representations of
>>> credentialling organization
>>>
>>> Also,
>>>
>>> Find credentialing organization[edit
>>> <https://www.w3.org/community/eocred-schema/wiki/index.php?title=Use_Cases&action=edit&section=26>
>>> ]
>>>
>>> Having identified a credential, it should be possible to find the
>>> credentialing organization.
>>>
>>> I think we have already solved these back when we discussed cost of a
>>> credential. We solved this in part by use of the the schema.org offers
>>> property and Offer type. As I think Richard pointed out at the time, the
>>> Offer type has a property 'offeredBy' so we can say:
>>>
>>> {
>>>   "@context": "http://schema.org/" <http://schema.org/>,
>>>   "@type": "EducationalOccupationalCredential",
>>>   "url" : "https://example.org/ecocred" <https://example.org/ecocred>,
>>>   "name": "Example",
>>>   "offers": {
>>>     "@type": "Offer",
>>>     "offeredBy" : {
>>>       "@type": "Organization",
>>>       "name": "Example org",
>>>       "url": "https://example.org/" <https://example.org/>
>>>     }
>>>   }
>>> }
>>>
>>> The Example credential is offered by Example.org.
>>>
>>> Does anyone think this is not sufficient to meet the use case?
>>>
>>> An alternative is to co-opt the issuedBy <http://schema.org/issuedBy>
>>> property from Permit <http://schema.org/Permit>. But one important
>>> aspect of our work here is that we are dealing *primarily* with the
>>> offer of a Credential, not a claim that someone has earned one. That is,
>>> BadgeClass rather than Assertions if you appreciate a parallel with Open
>>> Badges. So offeredBy seems the better fit to me.
>>> There is a note in the use cases that "there may be several different
>>> significant types of relationship between credentials and organizations".
>>> We have a separate use case for quality assurance that would cover
>>> accreditation, recognition etc., of the credentialing organization and
>>> which we can discuss later.
>>>
>>> Regards, Phil
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Phil Barker <http://people.pjjk.net/phil>. http://people.pjjk.net/phil
>>> PJJK Limited <https://www.pjjk.co.uk>: technology to enhance learning;
>>> information systems for education.
>>> CETIS LLP: a cooperative consultancy for innovation in education
>>> technology.
>>>
>>> PJJK Limited is registered in Scotland as a private limited company,
>>> number SC569282.
>>> CETIS is a co-operative limited liability partnership, registered in
>>> England number OC399090
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Phil Barker <http://people.pjjk.net/phil>. http://people.pjjk.net/phil
>> PJJK Limited <https://www.pjjk.co.uk>: technology to enhance learning;
>> information systems for education.
>> CETIS LLP: a cooperative consultancy for innovation in education
>> technology.
>>
>> PJJK Limited is registered in Scotland as a private limited company,
>> number SC569282.
>> CETIS is a co-operative limited liability partnership, registered in
>> England number OC399090
>>
>
>


-- 
Stuart A. Sutton, Metadata Consultant
Associate Professor Emeritus, University of Washington
   Information School
Email: stuartasutton@gmail.com
Skype: sasutton